NFL Week 14 -- Decision days

[outofplace]

Here's the rule. Apparently Likely failed to complete the "additional step" referenced below. I still question why that should be required in the end zone.
Let's say a guy catches the ball with two feet in the end zone and, without moving either foot, spikes the ball. Nobody would rule that an incomplete pass.

ARTICLE 3. COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is
complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) in the field of play, at the sideline, or in the end zone if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and
(c) after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, clearly performs any act common to the game (e.g., extend the ball forward, take an
additional step, tuck the ball away and turn upfield, or avoid or ward off an opponent), or he maintains control of the ball long
enough to do so.

Ex-NFL referee says officials got controversial overruling of Ravens touchdown in loss to Steelers correct

 

[outofplace]

I, too, thought it should have been called a TD based on how many steps he took, but the “extension” argument doesn’t fly. He didn’t extend the ball — that’s where he caught it.

The explanation isn't about the extension. The explanation they gave Harbaugh was that he didn't make a football move. In this case, he needed that third step. The rule is awful, but the officials got it right.

The Ravens are also complaining that an interception was overturned earlier in the fourth quarter. Rodgers had a pass tipped back at him and he caught it. Two defenders fought him for the ball and eventually wrestled it away from him. Replay showed that his knee was down before he lost the ball. That set up a third-and-19 that the Steelers did not convert, so the Ravens ended up getting the ball anyway, but with time off the clock and field position that was much worse.

 

[BurnsWhenIPee]

And for all the rest of their warts, Mahomes' knee doesn't look good.

Wonder if there's a point coming up where they shut him down for the season? Bad/injured OL, Kelce is non-existent, Reid can't/won't commit to running the ball, season really going nowhere.

As someone suffering from extreme Chiefs' Fatigue, I can't say I'm hating this.

 

[DanielSimpsonDay]

And for all the rest of their warts, Mahomes' knee doesn't look good.

Wonder if there's a point coming up where they shut him down for the season? Bad/injured OL, Kelce is non-existent, Reid can't/won't commit to running the ball, season really going nowhere.

As someone suffering from extreme Chiefs' Fatigue, I can't say I'm hating this.

counterpoint

this make patriots fans very happy

 

[BTExpress]

Hasn't Kelce had at least THREE balls bounce off his hands and turn into interceptions this season?

vs. Eagles, Commanders and now Texans.

 

[da man]

Calvin Johnson wonders too. I have never understood why this was an incomplete pass when if he was a running back he could fumble the ball and it’s still a touchdown if he crosses the goal line first

It’s a weird rule. Why can a ball carrier for a split second take it over the goal line … but a receiver needs a stride and a half in that situation? I don’t know.

Comparing those two scenarios is a fallacy that comes up often and drives me nuts always.

They are completely separate situations involving completely different concepts and governed by completely different rules.

The misunderstood concept here is possession. A player with possession of the ball in the end zone has scored a touchdown.

The ball carrier already has possession, so as soon as he gets the ball across the plane of the goal line, it’s a touchdown and the play is over. What happens after that moment is irrelevant. He can lose the ball after, but it was in his possession when it crossed the line.

The receiver, on the other hand, does NOT have possession in the end zone before the ball arrives. He must ESTABLISH possession, which is what all the “catch-or-no-catch” rules are all about. How do we determine if he has possession? You might not like the rule defining how possession is established, but there has to be one — and BTW, it’s the same in the end zone as anywhere else on the field.

And Scout, it’s also the same for the sideline toe-tap catch, which does not “instantly” become a TD. He has to “survive the ground” with possession.

 

[da man]

The explanation isn't about the extension. The explanation they gave Harbaugh was that he didn't make a football move. In this case, he needed that third step. The rule is awful, but the officials got it right.

The Ravens are also complaining that an interception was overturned earlier in the fourth quarter. Rodgers had a pass tipped back at him and he caught it. Two defenders fought him for the ball and eventually wrestled it away from him. Replay showed that his knee was down before he lost the ball. That set up a third-and-19 that the Steelers did not convert, so the Ravens ended up getting the ball anyway, but with time off the clock and field position that was much worse.

I was replying to a post that asked: “Doesn't the extension of the ball count as the act common to the game that satisfies the requirements?”

 

[Songbird]

And just like that the Chiefs dynasty is dead.

 

[Jake from State Farm]

And Calvin Johnson established possession no matter what the refs said

 

[Cosmo]

Pretty decisive day ... I think we have the playoff teams in the AFC mostly sewn up:
West - Broncos, Chargers (WC)
North - Steelers or Ravens
East - Patriots, Bills (WC)
South - Jaguars/Texans (one as WC)

Colts probably won't win another game and finish 8-9
The Chiefs win zero tiebreakers against the teams that matter, so 10-7 won't be enough to get them in. Not sure they'll win out as it is.
Dolphins are a cute story but their chances of running the table (at PIT, vs. CIN, vs. TB, at NE) are nearly zero.
Bengals, I guess, could get to 8-9 and hope that's enough to forge a tie in the north. Doesn't really matter, whoever the North champ is will be the No. 4 seed and probably host Buffalo in round one.

NFC is fairly clear now too
East -- Eagles (barring a collapse that allows Dallas to pass them)
North -- Packers, Bears or Lions (WC)
South -- Bucs or Panthers
West -- Rams/Seahawks (one as WC), 49ers (WC)

Lions likely have a better chance to catch Chicago than they do San Fran, which is 8-2 in NFC games
Minnesota is still technically alive, but I'm not sure how. They can't win the division (best possible finish, 9-8, GB's worst possible finish, 9-7-1) and the No. 7 seed currently has nine wins.

 

[qtlaw]

I’m not one to rejoice in someone else’s failure but my Chiefs fatigue was real, especially the unseemly praise from Romo/Nantz types and 5he blind eyes of the refs. Thank goodness they’re done. On the other hand, claps for their run.

 

[Songbird]

I’m not one to rejoice in someone else’s failure

You're invited to next year's Passover Seder.

 

[LanceyHoward]

It was also 17 points with like four minutes left and the Broncos defense just whatever'd the Raiders possession before the field goal and let them drive right down the field unbothered.

It was honestly about the Broncos most complete and decisive win of the year, three freaking drives of 8-plus minutes, one of which was 10, and it was nearly scrimmage like, and it ended up being another one possession win because of whatever all that was at the end. The delay of game penalty that allowed the Raiders to kick the field goal was also kind of borderline, I see it sort of but in that situation?, but goes with the rest.

Blame the refs for the Broncos not covering. The Raiders were down by 10 without any timeouts and threw a pass to about the Denver 35 where the receiver was tackled in-bounds with about five seconds left. The Raiders probably could not have spiked the ball in time to get off another play. But the officials called a delay of game on a Bronco player for not getting off the Raider player in a timely fashion which stopped the clock. That allowed the Raiders to run their kicker on for a field goal.

Yet another reason I am glad I do not gamble.

 

[da man]

And Calvin Johnson established possession no matter what the refs said

That’s a valid opinion. I just hope you now understand why a running back can fumble the ball and it’s still a touchdown if he crosses the goal line first.

 

[BTExpress]

Would not be a catch today. Sigh.

 

[LanceyHoward]

Beat the Super Bowl champ and runner-up 4 days apart ... get eliminated after giving up 44 to the Lions.

The Cowboys are a pretty good team at home and bottom five on the road.

 

[Jake from State Farm]

Lions likely have a better chance to catch Chicago than they do San Fran, which is 8-2 in NFC games

Lions can lose to the Rams and still get in with three wins and Bears losses to the Packers and Lions in the finale

 

[da man]

Would not be a catch today. Sigh.

1. Are college rules in this area the same as the NFL’s?

2. From that video I’d say it shouldn’t have been a catch then.

 

[da man]

Bengals, I guess, could get to 8-9 and hope that's enough to forge a tie in the north. Doesn't really matter, whoever the North champ is will be the No. 4 seed and probably host Buffalo in round one.

I don’t think the Bengals losing at home to the Bills would be a sure thing.

 

[micropolitan guy]

The explanation isn't about the extension. The explanation they gave Harbaugh was that he didn't make a football move. In this case, he needed that third step. The rule is awful, but the officials got it right.

The Ravens are also complaining that an interception was overturned earlier in the fourth quarter. Rodgers had a pass tipped back at him and he caught it. Two defenders fought him for the ball and eventually wrestled it away from him. Replay showed that his knee was down before he lost the ball. That set up a third-and-19 that the Steelers did not convert, so the Ravens ended up getting the ball anyway, but with time off the clock and field position that was much worse.

Isn't running in the end zone with the football after he caught it, which he did, a "football move?"