39th Ryder Cup

[LongTimeListener]

Didn't someone post a stat here that guys who play all four time slots Fri/Sat are terrible I Sunday singles? I imagine that was in Love's thinking on resting Phil.

 

[MileHigh]

Phil begging off on Saturday after a dominating 3-0 with Bradley is the start of the downfall. Olazabal was perfect in how he sent out the singles.

 

[Mark2010]

Yeah, that was a stat during the TV coverage. And, as noted earlier, it makes sense because 90 holes in less than 72 hours is an awful lot of golf, especially for modern players who aren't used to it like the old-timers were.

I really do wish they would change the format, spread it over 4 or 5 days and only play one session per day, either 5 or 6 matches per session.

I can't fault Love's strategy. His top players just didn't come through this time.

While we're at it, why do we somehow automatically assume that if someone loses, or even chokes, that they don't give a ****? Maybe the other player was just better that day. Maybe the pressure was a factor. But for an outsider to say someone doesn't care strikes me as awfully harsh.

Did Tom Brady not give a **** in the Super Bowl? Or Josh Hamilton in the World Series? Or Novak Djokovic in Grand Slam finals? I remember Mark Calcavecchia blowing a 4-up lead on the back nine in singles in 1991 and crying his heart out afterwards. But different players deal with stuff differently. Money or not, I suspect Jim Furyk and Steve Stricker are just sick over how it went down Sunday.

Unless I had overwhelming evidence to back it up, I would never write or say that a player doesn't care. (even if he shows up 10 minutes before tee time.)

 

[Double Down]

Phil begging off on Saturday after a dominating 3-0 with Bradley is the start of the downfall. Olazabal was perfect in how he sent out the singles.

If we keep working at this, we'll figure out a way to blame this entire thing on Phil. Steve Stricker thanks you all.

 

[Double Down]

Anyone who saw the full replay of Furyk's miss on 18 -- not the NBC feed, but the Golf Channel replay -- where he literally had his hands on his knees for 30 seconds before he moved, should have no doubt about how much Furyk cared. He cared a ton. This is the last chance he and Stricker will probably ever get to do this. I suspect this will linger for the rest of their lives in some respects. They wanted it bad. They're just not all that good anymore.

 

[Mark2010]

DoubleDown,

I hear your point. But I suspect the entire point of putting Stricker on the team to begin with was because he and Woods had such a good record in the Presidents Cup. That makes logical sense to me.

Even a cursory look at the PGA Tour shows how players can be on one week and miss the cut the next. This just obviously wasn't Stricker's week. How could Love possibly have predicted that when making a pick?

On the other hand, Peter Hanson and Martin Kaymer each sat out the whole day Saturday (mistake, IMO) and came back and won key singles matches on Sunday.

And, if you want to talk Americans who underperformed, what about Brandt Snedeker? Mr. FedEx Cup Champion got blown off the course 5 and 3 by Paul Lawrie, perhaps the least dominant player on the European team.

 

[Mark2010]

Anyone who saw the full replay of Furyk's miss on 18 -- not the NBC feed, but the Golf Channel replay -- where he literally had his hands on his knees for 30 seconds before he moved, should have no doubt about how much Furyk cared. He cared a ton. This is the last chance he and Stricker will probably ever get to do this. I suspect this will linger for the rest of their lives in some respects. They wanted it bad. They're just not all that good anymore.

Yeah, Furyk admitted in the press conference afterward he had a low year. In position to win the US Open and loses. Leader after 53 holes at The Tour Championship and rapidly falls out of contention. And now to lose in the manner he did... tough to take. Reminds me of some of Tom Lehman's close calls in the 1990s. (Furyk and Lehman, it seems, share the same barber as well.)

I think four captain's picks is too many. But I think the point of having ANY captain's picks is to include old reliables who, for whatever reason, may not have had a great statistically (like Woods in 2010), but who either have built a good reputation over the long haul or are someone the captain wants around for leadership, intangibles, etc.

 

[Double Down]

DoubleDown,

I hear your point. But I suspect the entire point of putting Stricker on the team to begin with was because he and Woods had such a good record in the Presidents Cup. That makes logical sense to me.

People keep saying that, but at the last President's Cup, Tiger played most of his team matches with Dustin Johnson. He played once with Stricker, and he got absolutely housed, 7 & 6. Whatever magic they had in their pairing is long gone. I don't see how what happened in 2009 justifies his permanent spot as Tiger's sidecar.

Besides, Hunter Mahan won four points at the President's Cup. That didn't earn him a spot on the team.

I just think the days of Tiger getting catered to him -- even if he doesn't ask for it -- should be over.

 

[Mark2010]

I also thought Mahan should have been on the team, probably instead of Dustin Johnson. Mahan was ranked as high as No. 4 in the world at one point this year.

As long as they can walk and swing a club, Tiger and Phil will be on the team one way or another. They've been the two icons of American golf the last 15 years and you can't find a dozen guys who outperform them. They're sort of like Ballesteros, Langer, Faldo, Woosnam for Europe back in the 90s.... always there.

They're in sort a no-win situation. If they get picked and beg off, then people rip them for being selfish, unpatriotic, etc. So whether they want to play or not --- and my guess is they do --- they are sort of obligated to. Sort of like Kobe and LeBron at the Olympics.

 

[hondo]

And if Love had picked Mahan and he played the way he did most of the season (only one top-10 after April) everyone would have ripped him anyway. Regardless of captain's picks, each team has 12 damn good players who have been performing well over a two-year period entering the Ryder Cup. All a captain can do is put them out there. He can't make the putts for them, or stop the other side from making them. Goes for Love or Ollie. If you read British golf writers after the doubles, they were tearing Jose Marie apart. A half-point swing Sunday, and they're urging the crown to declare war on Spain.

 

[Fly]

I really do wish they would change the format, spread it over 4 or 5 days and only play one session per day, either 5 or 6 matches per session.

Format should change. Same time frame, however.

Make it six four-ball and six foursome matches daily the first two days, and then singles on the third day. EVERYONE plays every session. Players must play two four-ball and two foursomes. A test of the best in the truest sense, no?

 

[Double Down]

No format changes. Don't take all the strategy out of it. That's one of the things I love, and why it's always up in the air on Sunday, because there are so many points at stake.

Good stuff as always from the SI/Golf Mag crew. Always my favorite post tournament read. They think the captain will be David Toms or Phil in a player/captain role.

http://m.golf.com/s/1350/313?itemUri1=d29e9fac51b6942b1cd6dc6d17b314fa/15141112251181031214156613413&viewDetails=true

 

[LongTimeListener]

Phil in a player/captain role would be very, very, very Pete Rose-ish.

 

[Double Down]

It would have major disaster potential. Not a fan of the idea.

 

[LongTimeListener]

I was thinking more of the gambling part.

 

[micropolitan guy]

If we keep working at this, we'll figure out a way to blame this entire thing on Phil. Steve Stricker thanks you all.

Yeah, no kidding. If everybody would have gakked as badly as he did and won 75 percent of their possible points we only would have won 21-7.

 

[Michael_ Gee]

Dufner's got the blood temperature of an amphibian. Really got the temperament made for match play.

 

[Double Down]

Of all the things I love about RC, seeing guys like Dufner even get a little pumped up in the heat of it. I've never seem him pump his fist once before yesterday, but when he looked like his match was slipping away, then made a birdie to take control again, he walked off the green and pumped his fist twice and it made me a little emotional. Even he was moved. I remember Mahan doing that four years ago, just going nuts after he made a crazy birdie that answered a crazy scream by someone like Poulter or Garcia. It's just fun.

I'm still glum about this. Maybe the one event left in sports I love w/o any hang ups.

 

[Mark2010]

I really do wish they would change the format, spread it over 4 or 5 days and only play one session per day, either 5 or 6 matches per session.

Format should change. Same time frame, however.

Make it six four-ball and six foursome matches daily the first two days, and then singles on the third day. EVERYONE plays every session. Players must play two four-ball and two foursomes. A test of the best in the truest sense, no?

I can see that, except it doesn't leave much wiggle room in the case of injury.

I just think asking the guys to play 36 holes a day is silly. You could sell more tickets if you had more sessions. I'm shocked someone hasn't grasped that yet. Same reasons MLB teams rarely play doubleheaders anymore.

 

[typefitter]

Any idea of tinkering with the format of the Ryder Cup is madness. It's perfection.

I think some of you are overreacting because the collapse was so bad, but you're forgetting how close this really was. Basically, any two putts changes it. Just picking two out of the air—say Rose doesn't make that long birdie on 17, and Furyk sinks it on 18, and you guys win. When 24 guys play golf for three days and it comes down to that sort of margin—and is routinely close, if not quite that close—it is a perfectly designed sports event.

If I would do anything, I'd get rid of the President's Cup, which nobody gives a **** about and only dilutes the thrill of the Ryder.