Tim Tebow: Fraud?

[LongTimeListener]

Vince Young won a BCS title and has a better winning percentage than Tebow and nobody is calling him a winner.

When Haynesworth signed with the Redskins he was promised the defense was a going to be 4-3 and was a petulant ass when the Skins changed to a 3-4. Te only difference is he has better handlers who manipulated Schefter once the **** hit the fan with the quitter story.

The one thing Timmy could hang his hat on was character. Quitting unmasked his facade.

I do think the fact that Vince Young won something like 63% of his games as a starter but couldn't get a starting job after Tennessee speaks to how coaches see him as a coach killer.

The guy won games but was there a sense that he could win in the playoffs? I think Tebow has a similar perception. He might be able to beat the Chiefs and Jags and get a WC spot or win a bad division. Can he lead a team to a Super Bowl? Especially with the circus he brings? Tebow brings a media circus just as VY brought "wide receiver drama", such as strip club fights and suicide watches. Hey, we all have baggage.

In a league where you HAVE to have a good to elite QB, Young's phone didn't ring. Or maybe it has but it's been disconnected.

There was a sense, after he was reported as suicidal, was the subject of a police manhunt and was found with a gun in the team facility, that he was just a little bit unstable. That's what knocked him out of the league.

I have seen the Young-Tebow comparisons and they all seem to leave out that central point of the story.

 

[Boom_70]

Vince Young won a BCS title and has a better winning percentage than Tebow and nobody is calling him a winner.

When Haynesworth signed with the Redskins he was promised the defense was a going to be 4-3 and was a petulant ass when the Skins changed to a 3-4. Te only difference is he has better handlers who manipulated Schefter once the **** hit the fan with the quitter story.

The one thing Timmy could hang his hat on was character. Quitting unmasked his facade.

I do think the fact that Vince Young won something like 63% of his games as a starter but couldn't get a starting job after Tennessee speaks to how coaches see him as a coach killer.

The guy won games but was there a sense that he could win in the playoffs? I think Tebow has a similar perception. He might be able to beat the Chiefs and Jags and get a WC spot or win a bad division. Can he lead a team to a Super Bowl? Especially with the circus he brings? Tebow brings a media circus just as VY brought "wide receiver drama", such as strip club fights and suicide watches. Hey, we all have baggage.

In a league where you HAVE to have a good to elite QB, Young's phone didn't ring. Or maybe it has but it's been disconnected.

There was a sense, after he was reported as suicidal, was the subject of a police manhunt and was found with a gun in the team facility, that he was just a little bit unstable. That's what knocked him out of the league.

I have seen the Young-Tebow comparisons and they all seem to leave out that central point of the story.

I bet we don't even know 25 % of what Titan security has in Vince Young's file.

 

[Mizzougrad96]

The Refrigerator?

Maybe. To me, Perry's popularity dropped off pretty significantly after his rookie season... Tebow could wind up being the backup on one of the worst teams in the NFL and he will still be one of the most popular players in the NFL.

They polled the first-graders in my son's class who their favorite QB was and Tebow finished a relatively close second to the local QB and had more votes than a couple guys who are locks to make it to Canton.

He remains in the top 10 of jerseys sold... I think he was eighth for the year.

I don't think we've ever seen anything like it. Hell, ESPN will probably have a reporter in Jacksonville on a full-time basis if that's where St. Timmy winds up.

 

[LongTimeListener]

The only thing that bothers me anymore as one of the "Tebow worshipers" (TM oop) is that he never got a chance to lose his job on the field. All those other guys that get mentioned, they did get their chance and flopped. Tebow wasn't flopping in his last playoff action. He -- sorry Rick, his team -- beat the Steelers behind a 300-yard day from him, and then he got overwhelmed by the Pats, but he looked like your basic first-time starter who has some promise.

It's entirely possible that upon arriving in New York, he showed every day in practice that he couldn't possibly take the field. But frankly I don't trust the Jets to make that determination. They don't know a thing about offense, something they have proved ever since ... I think the last time they looked any good was that year Chad Pennington took over halfway through. Hell, they just gave Sanchez the huge contract, so that should clue you in that their opinions shouldn't be taken seriously.

I'd love for Tebow to go somewhere and have an honest chance. Even if it's a bad team and even if it's only three games, at least then you can say, yeah, he can't do it. But this way, nobody knows that except for an asshat coaching staff that hasn't shown it knows anything about game-planning or scoring points anyway.

But as I've said before, I think there's a place in the league for Tebow as the spread grows in influence. Backing up RG3, Newton, wherever Chip Kelly ends up ... there is potential there.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Has there ever been a player who brings a media circus like Tebow has? I can't think of anyone who has ever compared to him popularity-wise.

Bo Jackson?

 

[LongTimeListener]

Favre was pretty circus-like in both NY and Minnesota.

TO in Philly, and especially in his driveway in Jersey, was Ringling Bros. Carried it pretty well to Dallas.

At their heights, they rivaled Tebow in New York. But nothing comes close to the Tebow circus of last season.

 

[Mizzougrad96]

Has there ever been a player who brings a media circus like Tebow has? I can't think of anyone who has ever compared to him popularity-wise.

Bo Jackson?

That would be a good one, although a media circus in 1990 would seem pretty quaint compared with today.

 

[Mizzougrad96]

The only thing that bothers me anymore as one of the "Tebow worshipers" (TM oop) is that he never got a chance to lose his job on the field. All those other guys that get mentioned, they did get their chance and flopped. Tebow wasn't flopping in his last playoff action. He -- sorry Rick, his team -- beat the Steelers behind a 300-yard day from him, and then he got overwhelmed by the Pats, but he looked like your basic first-time starter who has some promise.

It's entirely possible that upon arriving in New York, he showed every day in practice that he couldn't possibly take the field. But frankly I don't trust the Jets to make that determination. They don't know a thing about offense, something they have proved ever since ... I think the last time they looked any good was that year Chad Pennington took over halfway through. Hell, they just gave Sanchez the huge contract, so that should clue you in that their opinions shouldn't be taken seriously.

I'd love for Tebow to go somewhere and have an honest chance. Even if it's a bad team and even if it's only three games, at least then you can say, yeah, he can't do it. But this way, nobody knows that except for an asshat coaching staff that hasn't shown it knows anything about game-planning or scoring points anyway.

But as I've said before, I think there's a place in the league for Tebow as the spread grows in influence. Backing up RG3, Newton, wherever Chip Kelly ends up ... there is potential there.

I really agree with this. I want to see him given the opportunity to fail on the field.

There are enough bad quarterbacks in the NFL that Tebow should at least get a chance.

 

[outofplace]

The only thing that bothers me anymore as one of the "Tebow worshipers" (TM oop) is that he never got a chance to lose his job on the field. All those other guys that get mentioned, they did get their chance and flopped. Tebow wasn't flopping in his last playoff action. He -- sorry Rick, his team -- beat the Steelers behind a 300-yard day from him, and then he got overwhelmed by the Pats, but he looked like your basic first-time starter who has some promise.

It's entirely possible that upon arriving in New York, he showed every day in practice that he couldn't possibly take the field. But frankly I don't trust the Jets to make that determination. They don't know a thing about offense, something they have proved ever since ... I think the last time they looked any good was that year Chad Pennington took over halfway through. Hell, they just gave Sanchez the huge contract, so that should clue you in that their opinions shouldn't be taken seriously.

I'd love for Tebow to go somewhere and have an honest chance. Even if it's a bad team and even if it's only three games, at least then you can say, yeah, he can't do it. But this way, nobody knows that except for an asshat coaching staff that hasn't shown it knows anything about game-planning or scoring points anyway.

But as I've said before, I think there's a place in the league for Tebow as the spread grows in influence. Backing up RG3, Newton, wherever Chip Kelly ends up ... there is potential there.

I really agree with this. I want to see him given the opportunity to fail on the field.

There are enough bad quarterbacks in the NFL that Tebow should at least get a chance.

Why does anybody owe him anything? There are plenty of guys with borderline ability that never get much of a shot, including ones who had damn good college careers. The only difference in this case is his high profile.

 

[exmediahack]

I don't disagree with some of your points, LTL.

Again, I think back to the media reports on how awful Tebow was in practice in Denver. He might also be the kind of QB a head coach in his first year might give an honest shot to because the pressure to win isn't as dire as in Year 2.

I tend to believe in the NFL that true QB talent earns playing time. We've seen it with Russell Wilson winning his starting job. The league is so desperate for QBs that Cassel, Fitzpatrick and Flynn received huge contracts off a very thin body of work. Scott Mitchell was the trail blazer for this. A handful of these unexpected QBs who are behind an established starter or thrown in because of injury do succeed (Brady, Hasselbeck, Warner, Brunnell).

The era or a David Woodley or a Trent Dilfer riding out defense to the Super Bowl has ended. With that, a coach taking a chance on an unproven QB is hazardous to his financial well being. Look at Munchak in Nashville. It he sticks with Hasselbeck, maybe they go 7-9 and he returns. Now they will be 5-11 with awful defeats and he gets fired. Munchak wont get another HC job in the NFL.

 

[LongTimeListener]

Why does anybody owe him anything? There are plenty of guys with borderline ability that never get much of a shot, including ones who had damn good college careers. The only difference in this case is his high profile.

I would be surprised if there is another quarterback in the history of the NFL who had a 300-yard game in a playoff victory and then never started another game. Maybe somebody who retired soon after, but I'd be surprised if there was someone who wanted to keep playing and couldn't find a spot. That's a big difference. He does have some body of work that indicates he might have a chance.

 

[Mizzougrad96]

Why does anybody owe him anything? There are plenty of guys with borderline ability that never get much of a shot, including ones who had damn good college careers. The only difference in this case is his high profile.

I would be surprised if there is another quarterback in the history of the NFL who had a 300-yard game in a playoff victory and then never started another game. Maybe somebody who retired soon after, but I'd be surprised if there was someone who wanted to keep playing and couldn't find a spot. That's a big difference. He does have some body of work that indicates he might have a chance.

Exactly.

I want him to go to a team where the coaching staff wants him. Then, if he fails, fine...

 

[cyclingwriter]

Has there ever been a player who brings a media circus like Tebow has? I can't think of anyone who has ever compared to him popularity-wise.

Joe Namath.

 

[exmediahack]

I also think Tebow's presence would bring resentment in most locker rooms. Having to answer questions about Tebow over and over.

Especially when, in practice drills, it becomes obvious the guy can't play.

 

[dog eat dog world]

Or merely human for refusing to run the Wildcat yesterday, in reaction to not getting the starting nod?

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/8776088/tim-tebow-new-york-jets-asked-left-wildcat-sources-say

I think in the effort to canonize Tebow as the nicest man to ever wear shoulder pads, people sometimes forget what a raging competitor he is. And I admire that, even though I think he's ill-equipped to be an every-down NFL quarterback.

In this case, though, I think it manifested itself in a pretty childish way. Hard to stand up for his action here, no?

I'll weigh the good things he does against the childish things he does and wish the former side was the gold investment I gave in on and bought this month.

 

[Gehrig]

Has there ever been a player who brings a media circus like Tebow has? I can't think of anyone who has ever compared to him popularity-wise.

Michael Jordan? Wayne Gretzky in Canada.

Or, are you just talking about people who played in the NFL?

 

[Mizzougrad96]

Has there ever been a player who brings a media circus like Tebow has? I can't think of anyone who has ever compared to him popularity-wise.

Michael Jordan? Wayne Gretzky in Canada.

Or, are you just talking about people who played in the NFL?

Well, Jordan and Gretzky are the widely considered to be the best players to ever play their sports. That level of popularity is to be expected...

Tebow is probably the most popular college player of all-time. But with a lot of players who were popular in college, usually that does not carry over to the NFL unless you have a similar level of success. That was never the case with Tebow. I was stunned when I saw the Broncos jerseys flying off the shelves after he was drafted, because I just assumed he'd never make a NFL start.

What he did in Denver last season was unlike anything I've ever seen in the NFL. I certainly never thought he'd be a decent NFL QB, but his team was better with him last season than it was without him.

What's also interesting is that some of the media circuses that the NFL has seen in recent years, most of them have to do with a player who is considered to be difficult, like Terrell Owens in Philly and Dallas... From what I can tell, Tebow appears to be the real deal with his charity work and I've yet to meet a reporter who dealt with him who didn't like him. He's a distraction, but not because of anything he's done wrong.

 

[Mizzougrad96]

We're not seriously comparing Tim Tebow to Vince Young are we?

Vince Young is a headcase. There are a lot of headcases in the NFL, but very few of them play quarterback.

Is there a NFL starting QB who could be considered a headcase? Some would say Cutler. I think Cutler has his issues, but he's definitely not a headcase the way VY is a headcase. I don't know if Vick can be considered a headcase anymore.

 

[Norrin Radd]

Scoreboard, Fridge.

In a league where you HAVE to have a good to elite QB, Young's phone didn't ring. Or maybe it has but it's been disconnected.

https://twitter.com/VinceYoung/status/277919637893681153

 

[outofplace]

Why does anybody owe him anything? There are plenty of guys with borderline ability that never get much of a shot, including ones who had damn good college careers. The only difference in this case is his high profile.

I would be surprised if there is another quarterback in the history of the NFL who had a 300-yard game in a playoff victory and then never started another game. Maybe somebody who retired soon after, but I'd be surprised if there was someone who wanted to keep playing and couldn't find a spot. That's a big difference. He does have some body of work that indicates he might have a chance.

You are basing way too much on one playoff game. And I still don't see why any team owes him anything. Seems to me that the Jets are far from the only team in the NFL to think Tebow can't do the job.