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"Only option" a million times a year. Also, abortions take a bit more of a toll on the baby.

OK. Again I ask you, how much of your pay check are you willing to give in taxes to ensure babies have what they need in terms of healthcare, food, shelter and clothing? If you are so worried about saving beating heartbeats in the womb, I'd imagine your answer will be significantly north of 0 percent.
 
What difference does that make? Where exactly does your money go? I pay my taxes like (most) everyone) else. Money goes to plenty of things I don't agree with. But, social contract. Your twisting yourself to make excuses for supporting a practice that YOU admit you abhor. It's heinous, and it happens every day countless times. Your argument is bull****. Are we only supposed to support or not support an issue based on how much we may or may not benefit financially? Do you enjoy the extra money you apparently think you get for all the babies that are killed in America? Does that make your occasional trip to Sizzler all the more sweet?
 
How many beating hearts stopped?

So, when does your big rescue plan happen? You've got one, right? You claim to believe that babies are being murdered, so you must be doing something about it other than typing away at your keyboard. Right?
 
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What difference does that make? Where exactly does your money go? I pay my taxes like (most) everyone) else. Money goes to plenty of things I don't agree with. But, social contract. Your twisting yourself to make excuses for supporting a practice that YOU admit you abhor. It's heinous, and it happens every day countless times. Your argument is bull****. Are we only supposed to support or not support an issue based on how much we may or may not benefit financially? Do you enjoy the extra money you apparently think you get for all the babies that are killed in America? Does that make your occasional trip to Sizzler all the more sweet?

He doesn't think babies are being murdered. Neither do you. Now if you would only own up to your rhetorical bull****, you can go back to taking your political dump on this thread with a rare, tiny shred of integrity.
 
My mother owns an old, old shotgun my father inherited from his father. If the gun control folks had the first little bit of moral courage, they'd be busting down her front door and hauling her off in cuffs.
 
And locking up all the women. If abortion is murder and a woman pays someone else to perform the abortion, how is she different from a woman who pays a hit man to kill her husband? If abortion is murder, she must be guilty of conspiracy at least. Right?
 
And locking up all the women. If abortion is murder and a woman pays someone else to perform the abortion, how is she different from a woman who pays a hit man to kill her husband? If abortion is murder, she must be guilty of conspiracy at least. Right?

Likewise, if the guy helps pay for the woman's abortion, or even just drives her to the clinic, shouldn't he be charged with aiding and abetting murder?
 
What difference does that make? Where exactly does your money go? I pay my taxes like (most) everyone) else. Money goes to plenty of things I don't agree with. But, social contract. Your twisting yourself to make excuses for supporting a practice that YOU admit you abhor. It's heinous, and it happens every day countless times. Your argument is bull****. Are we only supposed to support or not support an issue based on how much we may or may not benefit financially? Do you enjoy the extra money you apparently think you get for all the babies that are killed in America? Does that make your occasional trip to Sizzler all the more sweet?

I would hope you pay your taxes. My point with the question is to point out that the people who scream the loudest about outlawing abortion and how we must preserve the sanctity of life scream equally as loud about the need to cut welfare programs that would go toward providing for those babies who were saved from abortion. The "save the babies" crowd usually goes away once the baby actually is birthed and quickly turns into the "get a job" crowd.

What I want is no abortion, but I also am not so full of myself as to tell a woman in a situation I couldn't fathom what she should do. I'd rather abortions be legal and safe than to be done in some garage where the mother dies as well. I also know that legalized abortions don't equal mandatory abortions, which some bumper stickers would have you believe.

This isn't some twisting of myself to accommodate a position, it's understanding that this world is drawn in shades of gray and the answer isn't as simple as "ban it all and arrest those who try!"

1) Let's make sex ed in schools comprehensive and include contraception education. Enough of this abstinence only.
1b) Make contraceptives freely available. Free condoms at schools. Birth control should be easy to obtain for those under 18 and dispenses in supplies of more than three months.

2) Incentivize adoptions for adoptive parents. It costs thousands of dollars to go through the adoption process. Prospective parents should be able to be reimbursed for the cost of adoptions or receive grants if they can't afford the upfront costs (all contingent upon passing a rigorous background check which would require full repayment of grant money if parents fail the checks).

3) Social welfare programs are expanded to help women with the cost of a child with education programs available to help get women into work. Contingent on staying clean and actually following through with the education program and seeking a job.

4) Keep abortion legal for rape/incest or to save the life of a mother.
 
...people who scream the loudest about outlawing abortion and how we must preserve the sanctity of life scream equally as loud about the need to cut welfare programs that would go toward providing for those babies who were saved from abortion. The "save the babies" crowd usually goes away once the baby actually is birthed and quickly turns into the "get a job" crowd.

Proof? No bull****, either. I want a presentation of cold, hard facts to back up your ridiculous assertion.
 
Proof? No bull****, either. I want a presentation of cold, hard facts to back up your ridiculous assertion.

It's a nonsensical talking point that liberals use to make themselves feel better about their support for the abortion mill industry.
 
Proof? No bull****, either. I want a presentation of cold, hard facts to back up your ridiculous assertion.

Here's an example of Ted Cruz's positions on both abortion and welfare. From his campaign web site (Life, Marriage, and Family | Ted Cruz for Senate) he states

Life is a precious gift from God. We must cherish and defend it. Without life, there is no liberty; without life, there is no pursuit of happiness.

And on welfare he quotes the "Ode to the Welfare State"



I'll need a week to get together a fully sourced paper expounding on my thesis, so you'll have to forgive me.
 
Do you think being on welfare is a good thing for any able-bodied American? Shouldn't the government want individual, long-term dependence to be as rare as liberals say they want abortions to be? Supporting a Nanny State isn't altruistic.
 
Do you think being on welfare is a good thing for any able-bodied American? Shouldn't the government want individual, long-term dependence to be as rare as liberals say they want abortions to be? Supporting a Nanny State isn't altruistic.

Do you think abject poverty with people--including children--starving to death for lack of a job and absence of assistance is an ideal state for a nation?
 
I'm convinced that we should turn over our children and our paychecks to the government and let Uncle Sugar take care of everything. It's the only way. You on board?
 
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