Mets suicide watch

[Chef]

With the carnage that has taken place the last two weeks......

Randolph pissing away a seven-game lead in 13 days.....there's no way he's back......is there?

 

[StormSurge]

It's shaping up to be an interesting off-season.

I'm probably jinxing them as I'm currently reading "The Worst Team Money Could Buy". All that negativity...

 

[Moderator1]

Hey, I'm enjoying the fall as much as the next guy - though it thrills me not at all that the Phils will benefit.
But did Randolph **** it away? Is that fair?
Nats TV guys said the other night: Mets fans cannot be excited by the fact that the bullpen has to thrown five innings.

Lots of things are beyond the manager. Perhaps he is the problem or a majro part of it - I truly don't know here.

 

[jagtrader]

How many managers in the history of baseball have been fired with three years left on their contracts one year after making the LCS? It's probably a short list.

People are talking about the historic nature of this collapse. It's not historic. Teams that make the playoffs aren't as good as they once were and there are more playoff spots. We almost saw an even worse collapse last season.

 

[Barsuk]

How many managers in the history of baseball have been fired with three years left on their contracts one year after making the LCS? It's probably a short list.

People are talking about the historic nature of this collapse. It's not historic. Teams that make the playoffs aren't as good as they once were and there are more playoff spots. We almost saw an even worse collapse last season.

Dude, they were up seven games two weeks ago, and now they're tied. It's historic.

 

[mike311gd]

How many managers in the history of baseball have been fired with three years left on their contracts one year after making the LCS? It's probably a short list.

People are talking about the historic nature of this collapse. It's not historic. Teams that make the playoffs aren't as good as they once were and there are more playoff spots. We almost saw an even worse collapse last season.

Dude, they were up seven games two weeks ago, and now they're tied. It's historic.

No team has ever done that before. If they lose, it could be viewed at one of the biggest meltdowns of all time. I don't care how many playoff spots there are, when a team is in sole possession of first for more than four months, then coughs it up in two weeks -- three days before the season ends -- it's a major, major collapse.

But, none of that matters if the Mets win the East. But they don't look like they want it too badly right now.

 

[Pastor]

My concern is entirely based on the bullpen. How many starters have been able to go longer than 6-innings in the past two weeks?

 

[Barsuk]

No team has ever done that before. If they lose, it could be viewed at one of the biggest meltdowns of all time. I don't care how many playoff spots there are, when a team is in sole possession of first for more than four months, then coughs it up in two weeks -- three days before the season ends -- it's a major, major collapse.

But, none of that matters if the Mets win the East. But they don't look like they want it too badly right now.

If I were a betting man, I would not bet on the Mets at this point.

 

[PhilaYank36]

This is what happens when you don't have a reliable, front-line starter that can come in for seven, eight innings and just shut down the opposing team. Someone that isn't 35+ or breaks down easily.

Indians - Sabathia, Carmona
Red Sox - Beckett, Schilling (lone exception)
Yankees - Wang, Pettitte
Angels - Escobar, Lackey
Cubs - Zambrano
Padres - Peavy, Young
D-backs - Webb
Phillies - Hamels

Do the Mets have a guy in their rotation that opens your eyes a little bit? No. El Duque is more like La Diva, Glavine doesn't scare anybody, Maine got sunk in the second half, and you can't count on Petey anymore. That being said, there goes the bullpen. It also doesn't help when your first baseman aged five years in the off-season, Reyes has forgotten to get on base, the mental mistakes occuring at an exponential rate and the second-best hitter on your team is a 40-year-old who pisses on his hands. Some of the blame should fall at Willie's feet, some should go to Omar's (Mota was a greaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat signing, huh?), but the players are just as guilty for failing to execute. This might waste one hell of an MVP-effort from D-Wright, one of the few (only?) consistently good players the Mets have had over the last two months.

As for the off-season, should the Mets use some of their farm system depth and trade for an established starter (under 30, mind you)? I think it would be foolish not to. The pitching in their system isn't churning out any Chamberlains, Kennedys or Verlanders so far.

 

[hockeybeat]

My concern is entirely based on the bullpen. How many starters have been able to go longer than 6-innings in the past two weeks?

Maybe Pedro?

 

[hockeybeat]

Hey, I'm enjoying the fall as much as the next guy - though it thrills me not at all that the Phils will benefit.
But did Randolph **** it away? Is that fair?
Nats TV guys said the other night: Mets fans cannot be excited by the fact that the bullpen has to thrown five innings.

Lots of things are beyond the manager. Perhaps he is the problem or a majro part of it - I truly don't know here.

I don't think it's fair to blame Randolph for the Mets' lack of a starter than can go deep into games. That's Minaya's fault; he stood pat in the offseason.

But you can blame Randolph for running out the same guys--Mota, Schoenweiss--who can't get anyone out; it's fair to criticize Randolph for not using any of the call-ups in relief situations.

 

[Armchair_QB]

Hey, I'm enjoying the fall as much as the next guy - though it thrills me not at all that the Phils will benefit.
But did Randolph **** it away? Is that fair?
Nats TV guys said the other night: Mets fans cannot be excited by the fact that the bullpen has to thrown five innings.

Lots of things are beyond the manager. Perhaps he is the problem or a majro part of it - I truly don't know here.

I don't think it's fair to blame Randolph for the Mets' lack of a starter than can go deep into games. That's Minaya's fault; he stood pat in the offseason.

But you can blame Randolph for running out the same guys--Mota, Schoenweiss--who can't get anyone out; it's fair to criticize Randolph for not using any of the call-ups in relief situations.

So Willie likes young players about as much as Dusty Baker did?

 

[hockeybeat]

Hey, I'm enjoying the fall as much as the next guy - though it thrills me not at all that the Phils will benefit.
But did Randolph **** it away? Is that fair?
Nats TV guys said the other night: Mets fans cannot be excited by the fact that the bullpen has to thrown five innings.

Lots of things are beyond the manager. Perhaps he is the problem or a majro part of it - I truly don't know here.

I don't think it's fair to blame Randolph for the Mets' lack of a starter than can go deep into games. That's Minaya's fault; he stood pat in the offseason.

But you can blame Randolph for running out the same guys--Mota, Schoenweiss--who can't get anyone out; it's fair to criticize Randolph for not using any of the call-ups in relief situations.

So Willie likes young players about as much as Dusty Baker did?

Willie aced his Joe Torre Bullpen Management Grad School courses. We'll leave it at that.

 

[beefncheddar]

I still insist the single most amazing thing about the Mets' collapse is that it's the Phils that caught them. It's also the reason I'm STILL not convinced they're going to finish the job.

And Phila, Hamels hasn't been that guy for the Phils for awhile now. He'll need to be tonight, though. By far, the Phils rock (of late) has been Kyle Kendrick ... a guy that wasn't even invited to major-league spring training.

 

[boots]

Hey, I'm enjoying the fall as much as the next guy - though it thrills me not at all that the Phils will benefit.
But did Randolph **** it away? Is that fair?
Nats TV guys said the other night: Mets fans cannot be excited by the fact that the bullpen has to thrown five innings.

Lots of things are beyond the manager. Perhaps he is the problem or a majro part of it - I truly don't know here.

The Mets have the same problem as the Phillies. NO PITCHING. There are three games left. The team that gets the best out of its stsaff will win the NLeast.
All of this blaming people is bull****. Two days ago, Charlie Manuel was toast in Philly. The Phils won and pulled even, now he's OK.
Willie's team is going down in a funk and all of a sudden, people are looking for someone to blame. When they were rolling on Sept. 12, he was OK.
Enough with the fanboy bull****. If you know the game and understand it, even Stevie Wonder can see what the problem is.

 

[Armchair_QB]

The Mets are fine. Florida shot its wad the last three days. They'll roll over this weekend.

Remain calm.

All is well.

 

[boots]

The Mets are fine. Florida shot its wad the last three days. They'll roll over this weekend.

Remain calm.

All is well.

No all is not well in Mets land. If they sweep and the Phillies sweep, there is a playoff game for the division. The Phillies have spanked their ass all season.
All is not well.

 

[beefncheddar]

The Mets are fine. Florida shot its wad the last three days. They'll roll over this weekend.

Remain calm.

All is well.

 

[PhilaYank36]

Nice pull

 

[casty33]

As others have said on here, there is plenty of blame to be spread around the Mets. And while the manager is certainly part of it, he's hardly alone. At some point in a team's life, players have to do what they're paid to do. Mets relievers have been completely horse**** and there isn't much a manager can do but use what the GM has put together for him. Omar Minaya should also share the blame but neither Willie nor Omar will be fired because Fred Wilpon doesn't believe in paying someone for not working, and that's what would happen since both are under contract.

The most intriguing part of the Mets' collapse, as I see it, is what has happened to Jose Reyes. He is swinging these days -- other than that two HR anomaly -- like Rey Ordonez ... or Mark Belanger ... or Mario Mendoza. What happened to him?