Max Scherzer: HOF

[heyabbott]

Clemens aside, no 3 time winner (not active) is not in the Hall of Fame.
At least 1 in each league, 2 strike out crowns, led his league in wins 3 times. 9 seasons in a row of 31+ starts and 5 in row of 200+ innings . Career 127 ERA+

 

[Moderator1]

Without question

 

[georgealfano]

Clemens aside, no 3 time winner (not active) is not in the Hall of Fame.
At least 1 in each league, 2 strike out crowns, led his league in wins 3 times. 9 seasons in a row of 31+ starts and 5 in row of 200+ innings . Career 127 ERA+

One qualification is that they have to play in the majors 10 years. We used to have a writer who had a Hall of Fame vote on here who would say, "let me see in five years" when someone would ask about a potential HOF candidate when they had just retired.

Don Mattingly looked like he was on track for the Hall of Fame until he hurt his back. You also have to see what other layers do. It took Gary Carter until his 6th year to get into the Hall of Fame. What happened was that in the first years he was on the ballot plus the five-year waiting period, few catchers matched what Gary Carter did.

Hey abbott, just relax and enjoy watching what happens with Scherzer. It should be fun.

 

[georgealfano]

Koufax is another interesting case. His first four years in Los Angeles, he was a left-handed pitcher who played in a park where it was 251-feet down the left-field line and a right-hand hitter could hit a pop fly for a home run. Bill James did an analysis of Koufax and showed his road record to his home record for 1960. It showed he was a really good pitcher in 1960 but was not recognized as such.

 

[MisterCreosote]

Don Mattingly looked like he was on track for the Hall of Fame until he hurt his back.

If Mattingly had won three MVPs, he'd be a Hall of Famer too.

 

[Dick Whitman]

What about Johan Santana?

 

[Michael_ Gee]

Koufax is another interesting case. His first four years in Los Angeles, he was a left-handed pitcher who played in a park where it was 251-feet down the left-field line and a right-hand hitter could hit a pop fly for a home run. Bill James did an analysis of Koufax and showed his road record to his home record for 1960. It showed he was a really good pitcher in 1960 but was not recognized as such.

Koufax was the ultimate eye test guy. You just knew you were seeing historic greatness, not to mention everyone knew he was doing it in tremendous pain. He and Pedro were the best pitchers I ever saw with my own eyes, and I've been lucky enough to see a lot of great pitchers.

 

[heyabbott]

What about Johan Santana?

2 Cy Youngs, Bret Saberhagen country

 

[Dick Whitman]

2 Cy Youngs, Bret Saberhagen country

Because he was robbed of a third.

 

[MisterCreosote]

What about Johan Santana?

He definitely leads the league in coming up in other HOF discussions.

If he'd won a third Cy Young, he'd definitely be in. As it stands, I'd put him in, but I could see the arguments against him.

 

[heyabbott]

Because he was robbed of a third.

Sportswriters? What the **** do they know?

 

[Dick Whitman]

Sportswriters? What the **** do they know?

There is no way that today's BBWAA gives Colon that Cy Young Award. None. The vote would be like the Kluber-Sale vote. At least 28-2. Maybe unanimous. Rivera, in fact, probably finishes second. Buehrle third. Garland fourth. Colon fifth.

I was a "sportswriter" at the time, covering baseball. Here's "what the ****" I knew then: Santana was the best pitcher in the American League that year.

Cliff Lee (3.79 ERA) finished ahead of Mark Buehrle (3.12) in the voting because Lee was 18-5 and Buehrle was 16-8. LOL.

 

[JC]

Sportswriters? What the **** do they know?

Not nearly as much as they think they do.

 

[heyabbott]

There is no way that today's BBWAA gives Colon that Cy Young Award. None. The vote would be like the Kluber-Sale vote. At least 28-2. Maybe unanimous. Rivera, in fact, probably finishes second. Buehrle third. Garland fourth. Colon fifth.

I was a "sportswriter" at the time, covering baseball. Here's "what the ****" I knew then: Santana was the best pitcher in the American League that year.

Cliff Lee (3.79 ERA) finished ahead of Mark Buehrle (3.12) in the voting because Lee was 18-5 and Buehrle was 16-8. LOL.

i was joking a little about “what the **** do they know”. But The BBWAA votes on HOF too? Not the same group, it’s a lot bigger. However it’s the same lake just more fish.
Is the lack of a 3rd CY keeping/kept Santana out?

And thread jack attempt the MtRushmore of HOF mistakes? Not veterans committee votes or old timers or Negro League votes. But the least deserving if not out right mistakes?
I’ll hang up and listen

 

[Della9250]

The worst BBWAA inductions are probably Jim Rice, Goose Gossage, Rollie Fingers, Bruce Sutter, Catfish Hunter and Rabbit Maranville

 

[tapintoamerica]

i was joking a little about “what the **** do they know”. But The BBWAA votes on HOF too? Not the same group, it’s a lot bigger. However it’s the same lake just more fish.
Is the lack of a 3rd CY keeping/kept Santana out?

And thread jack attempt the MtRushmore of HOF mistakes? Not veterans committee votes or old timers or Negro League votes. But the least deserving if not out right mistakes?
I’ll hang up and listen

I heard Bill James say once that the answer to this question is George "High Pockets" Kelly.
A quick look at Kelly's stats: a career .297 hitter who finished third in MVP voting one year. I haven't perused the whole list, but Kelly is probably a candidate for Least Worthy Hall of Famer.

 

[cyclingwriter2]

Morgan Bulkely is the worst candidate in the hall.

For players it's Bobby Wallace.

 

[Neutral Corner]

I really don't know where to throw this, but this is an active baseball thread, so...

My wife's best friend from high school is moving back to town from North Carolina. I helped unload a truck of stuff today, and she had an oooold set of catcher's shin guards. I asked about them, and they belonged to her husband's grandfather. Virgil "Spud" Davis, who was most notably the catcher for the 1934 World Champion St. Louis Cardinals - the Gas House Gang. He played 17 years for four different teams and was a career .308 hitter.

Not really a big deal in some ways, but in others... this guy caught Dizzy and Daffy Dean, you know? It was kinda neat.

 

[manky_jimy]

He might get there but his resume right now is comparable to some great pitchers that didn't get into the Hall, like Guidry and David Cone. Worse, actually since he has yet to win a World Series.

 

[cjericho]

The worst BBWAA inductions are probably Jim Rice, Goose Gossage, Rollie Fingers, Bruce Sutter, Catfish Hunter and Rabbit Maranville

Tony Perez.