Bye, Bye Rudy

[Lamar Mundane]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/03/05/politics/main2535939.shtml

It doesn't look like Rudy Giuliani's two children will have a role in his presidential campaign. According to media reports, the GOP frontrunner's third marriage has alienated his son, Andrew, 21, and daughter, Caroline, 18, from their father.

Giuliani's 21-year-old son, Andrew, told The New York Times that he would be too busy working on his golf game to participate in his father's presidential campaign.

"There's obviously a little problem that exists between me and his wife," the younger Giuliani told the newspaper. "And we're trying to figure that out. But as of right now it's not working as well as we would like."

Giuliani's marriage to his third wife, Judith Nathan, followed his divorce from Donna Hanover, the mother of Andrew and Caroline.

In 2000, Giuliani announced during a live TV interview that he planned to divorce Hanover. She responded by publicly accusing Giuliani of adultery.

 

[Ace]

I really hope he doesn't get the nomination. What did he ever do besides stand on a pile of rubble and put on a show?

 

[BYH]

That's so sad. They were so close when Rudy won the mayoral election in 1993.

 

[hockeybeat]

Much like Hilary, Rudy won't win a Presidential election. He's far too polarizing.

 

[melock]

I really hope he doesn't get the nomination. What did he ever do besides stand on a pile of rubble and put on a show?

Here, here.

 

[ThomsonONE]

I really hope he doesn't get the nomination. What did he ever do besides stand on a pile of rubble and put on a show?

Here, here.

I'm guessing neither of you lived in NYC during his time as mayor. If you did you'd know how incredibly stupid both comments are.

 

[westcoastvol]

NYC experienced quite a renaissance during his stint as mayor. Most notably, homelessness was attacked, and the city became a lot cleaner, working hard to reverse its decades-long rep as being a dirty town. OTOH, people will argue that it's just not as interesting any more, and to an extent, they're right. It has become a lot more homogenous and milquetoast.

Sure, he became the face of NYC, the face of grief. He's played that tune very nicely in public speaking and such. Even with all the good, I don't think it's enough to warrant serious consideration as a presidential candidate.

 

[spnited]

Good to know the rest of the country caught up with a story that was in the NY Times on Saturday and an interview with Andrew that was on Good Morning America weekend Sunday morning.

This, however, will, not mean bye, bye Rudy in the race to the primaries. There are a lot worse things the country has yet to learn about Rudy.
Too many people see only his performance in the aftermath of 9/11 or they come to NYC and see the Disney-fication of 42nd Street and think he did a great job cleaning up the city.
They don't know about all the dirt in Rudy's background.

 

[Lamar Mundane]

Yeah, this pales against his thoughts of ignoring the law and sitting for a third term.

He deserves credit for his strength leading post Sept. 11 but he has done nothing to warrant foreign policy approval. The wingers won't vote for a pro-choice, gay-rights advocate in his third marriage.

He'd do better in the general.

So, bye-bye Rudy.

 

[The Big Ragu]

NYC experienced quite a renaissance during his stint as mayor. Most notably, homelessness was attacked, and the city became a lot cleaner, working hard to reverse its decades-long rep as being a dirty town. OTOH, people will argue that it's just not as interesting any more, and to an extent, they're right. It has become a lot more homogenous and milquetoast.

Sure, he became the face of NYC, the face of grief. He's played that tune very nicely in public speaking and such. Even with all the good, I don't think it's enough to warrant serious consideration as a presidential candidate.

He also was a tenacious DA. He got a hard on for getting organized crime out of the Fulton Fish Market, something that seemed impossible at the time, and likely had him taking on much of NYC's corrupt political establishment. I don't have a beef with people who are put off by his style, but to say all he ever did was stand on a pile of rubble and put up on a show, is either uninformed, or willfully ignores what he did as a DA and the stark difference between quality of life in NYC before he was mayor and while he was mayor.

EDIT: That comment also aggravated me a bit. That "show" he put on was one of the only reassuring things people saw on a daily basis for months. The guy was ubiquitous. We were openly wondering when he slept. He'd be at a funeral of a victim, then at a press conference with the fire chief, then at a baseball game trying to make people feel like it was OK to go on. Way to minimize the energy and leadership he showed at a time most people would have crumbled.

 

[wickedwritah]

The best was when Rudy was banging his personal assistant, Christine something or other, and Donna got to watch it all unfold on the front pages.

Rudy has the ability to find good people to take on important jobs. I thought Kerik did a good job after 9/11, but what do I know? Force easily could've fallen apart. He wiped the house clean of most of Dinkins' lackeys. His record in social services is far from stellar -- where'd all those homeless folk go? -- but he did take on a lot of the Mobsters when he was in the U.S. Attorney's office.

 

[spnited]

The best was when Rudy was banging his personal assistant, Christine something or other, and Donna got to watch it all unfold on the front pages.

Rudy has the ability to find good people to take on important jobs. I thought Kerik did a good job after 9/11, but what do I know? Force easily could've fallen apart. He wiped the house clean of most of Dinkins' lackeys. His record in social services is far from stellar -- where'd all those homeless folk go? -- but he did take on a lot of the Mobsters when he was in the U.S. Attorney's office.

And then Donna got to stay home with the kids while he was taking his new "friend" Judi Nathan to official City functions.
And then Donna got to hear Rudy's lawyers rip her to shreds during the divorce proccedings when she wanted too much money for child support and private school education for the kids.

 

[The Big Ragu]

One more thing... Every freeze-dried, full of **** candidate is "crafting" positions right now and not taking a stand on anything, lest they put their asses on the line. I'm not saying Giuliani is going to be able to play the game as a national candidate, the way he could as mayor of NYC, but geez, the guy has proven that when he believes in something, he'll stand up for it, without lies or bull****. The two instances that come to mind and make me smile:

1) When the UN was having that 50th Anniversary event, Giuliani invited everyone but Yasser Arafat and Fidel Castro to a performance at Lincoln Center. That in itself was beautiful. But Arafat showed up anyhow, and tried to take a seat by the stage, and Giuliani had him booted and ordered kept off the premises. You can call it a bull**** bully tactic--if you really want to cry tears for Arafat and Castro. Or you can call it a street fighter who understood how to throw an effective dirty punch. It took balls the size of melons, and during the beating he took from the liberal establishment in the aftermath, he didn't once flinch.

2) After 9/11, when that Saudi prince showed up in NYC with a $10 million check and then implied that the U.S. brought the attack upon itself, Giuliani wouldn't accept the check and was strong in his statement that there is no moral equivalent for that kind of terrorist attack. Think of all the "nuanced" presidential candidates out there. How many would have reacted the same way in his shoes--not even a second thought, just an "F U very much!"?

 

[Lamar Mundane]

How principled is Guiliani on partial-birth abortions? I'm betting the Christian right remembers his position in 1999 and 2000.

 

[dooley_womack1]

That U.N. thing is about the most petty thing I can think of. Not think I'm gonna vote for somebody who would be that flippant about diplomacy.

 

[spnited]

Well, Dools, Rudy is a petty, petulant bully.

And, Lamar, it is just like the Religious Right to excoriate Rudy for his stand on abortion but not be concerned with his total lack of morality in having very public affairs while the still-married, high-profile mayor of NYC.

 

[wickedwritah]

spnited, you know I respect you, but I ask, who the hell better do we have?

If you listen to the righty-right, they'll tell you that McCain lost his marbles years ago. Oops, they're writing him checks now.
Obama has no foreign policy experience.
Hillary had Vince Foster and Ron Brown offed.
(Figuring I didn't need to use the sarcasm font there, it was blatant enough.)

Really, though, I don't know who else you could say would be a good, not-very-flawed candidate.

 

[The Big Ragu]

How principled is Guiliani on partial-birth abortions? I'm betting the Christian right remembers his position in 1999 and 2000.

I guess I should repeat what I wrote: I'm not saying Giuliani is going to be able to play the game as a national candidate, the way he could as mayor of NYC, but geez, the guy has proven that when he believes in something, he'll stand up for it, without lies or bull****.

Do you honestly believe partial birth abortion is something he feels passionately about?

You know... the things he has taken bold, unpopular actions over, in the past?

You completely missed the point of my post. WHEN HE BELIEVES IN SOMETHING, i.e. the stuff he feels strongly about.

Yeah. It's obvious to anyone who has followed his public life that partial birth abortion is what he's all about.

 

[User 1019]

I have a question: who cares?

 

[The Big Ragu]

Ha. He wasn't diplomatic with Yasser Arafat and Fidel Castro. Wah wah wah. Good stuff.