All Purpose NASCAR Thread

[jimmyu]

the AP story said he is ``widely considered the best crew chief in the garage.''

I thought the AJC lede was terrific on Hamlin and proves my point that Hamlin was a shocker.

DAYTONA BEACH, Fla. _ Denny who won what?

 

[2muchcoffeeman]

This thread is a great idea (until some idiot comes in and ruins it -- but for now it's good).

Anyway, it's interesting how even in an AP story I saw the other day, Chad Knaus is labeled "the best crew chief in the sport," but he's constantly getting caught in things like this, it seems. Isn't this the third time? Jimmie Johnson and the 48 team are getting the cheaters label, and it might stick after this.

As an update, NASCAR has "ejected" Knaus from any further D500 activities this week and additional penalties may be levied next week. The penalties brought against Hall of Fame Racing (that's Aikman and Staubach, with Terry Labonte driving) won't be as severe but will also be levied at that time.

This is not nearly as harsh as the penalties brought against Kevin Harvick's crew chief last fall, but it's headed that way.

 

[Double J]

The twin 125s won't be as competitive either, since 35 teams are assured berths, leaving 8 positions open. I wish they'd make an exception for Daytona and make everybody earn their spot.

They're 150 miles now. And there are 23 teams gunning for those eight spots.

It's actually 19 teams gunning for four spots (two in each of Thursday's qualifying races). By virtue of a procedure way, way, too long to explain here, the following guys also locked in spots yesterday based on qualifying speed: Bill Elliott, Travis Kvapil, Hermie Sadler and Terry Labonte.

Every time I see or hear the name Hermie, I can't help but be reminded of "Summer of '42."

 

[Moderator1]

This thread is a great idea (until some idiot comes in and ruins it -- but for now it's good).

Anyway, it's interesting how even in an AP story I saw the other day, Chad Knaus is labeled "the best crew chief in the sport," but he's constantly getting caught in things like this, it seems. Isn't this the third time? Jimmie Johnson and the 48 team are getting the cheaters label, and it might stick after this.

We will do our best to keep it from being ruined.

 

[Jeff Gluck]

Hey, just surviving Hamlin's first experience with bump drafting would have been impressive enough. But to get pounded and still win the Shootout when EVERYONE is being aggressive and going for the money? CoolPapa, I think that is a surprise. Maybe not to insiders, but definitely to the rest of the world.

And I do think that if Truex wins the 500, that WOULD be a surprise, even though he has the backing (although Vegas lists him at 15 /1 odds). It's still about the drivers...and Truex hasn't won anything yet. To win the biggest race of the year would be a big shock.

 

[2muchcoffeeman]

Hamlin winning was not a shock, anymore than if Martin Truex Jr. wins the Daytona 500 next Sunday.

When someone who's never finished higher than seventh in a race defeats an all-star field at a track he's never raced a Cup car at before, it's a shock.

This team was 33rd in owner's points last year, and in the 29 races Hamlin didn't drive the car last year, the car finished in the top 10 only twice, with a best of eighth.

And failed to qualify at the Coke 600. Add to that the facts that Hamilin had never run a Cup race before last fall, had just one top-5 finish in his only year in the Busch Series and never run a Cup restrictor-plate race until Sunday afternoon and yes, Hamlin winning is a shock. Maybe even a miracle.

Regarding Hall of Fame Racing, from the team links page over at Jayski, it appears HOFR is not being written about overly much. I think a lot of people are viewing the Aikman-Staubach operation with suspicion because big names from other arenas have come in, talked big and then sucked royally. The fact that they couldn't --- or refused to --- field a car for Terry Labonte in the Bud Shootout last weekend is not exactly a feather in their caps, unless Terry simply didn't want to run that race.

It's funny watching Harvick trying to defend his crew chief, considering his crew chief is as big a cheater as Chad Knaus.

And if Truex wins the 500, that would go down as a bigger shock.

 

[lono]

Hamlin winning was not a shock, anymore than if Martin Truex Jr. wins the Daytona 500 next Sunday.

When someone who's never finished higher than seventh in a race defeats an all-star field at a track he's never raced a Cup car at before, it's a shock.

This team was 33rd in owner's points last year, and in the 29 races Hamlin didn't drive the car last year, the car finished in the top 10 only twice, with a best of eighth.

And failed to qualify at the Coke 600. Add to that the facts that Hamilin had never run a Cup race before last fall, had just one top-5 finish in his only year in the Busch Series and never run a Cup restrictor-plate race until Sunday afternoon and yes, Hamlin winning is a shock. Maybe even a miracle.

Regarding Hall of Fame Racing, from the team links page over at Jayski, it appears HOFR is not being written about overly much. I think a lot of people are viewing the Aikman-Staubach operation with suspicion because big names from other arenas have come in, talked big and then sucked royally. The fact that they couldn't --- or refused to --- field a car for Terry Labonte in the Bud Shootout last weekend is not exactly a feather in their caps, unless Terry simply didn't want to run that race.

It's funny watching Harvick trying to defend his crew chief, considering his crew chief is as big a cheater as Chad Knaus.

And if Truex wins the 500, that would go down as a bigger shock.

Yep, you are correct on all fronts.

 

[Jeff Gluck]

Hmm, I didn't realize Terry Labonte was eligible but didn't start the Bud Shootout. What's up with that? Wow, you'd think that would be a golden opportunity for a new sponsor to really get some exposure...maybe they couldn't afford to build two superspeedway cars?

 

[2muchcoffeeman]

Hmm, I didn't realize Terry Labonte was eligible but didn't start the Bud Shootout. What's up with that? Wow, you'd think that would be a golden opportunity for a new sponsor to really get some exposure...maybe they couldn't afford to build two superspeedway cars?

Don't know. At the draw, his name was on the plastic backdrop behind the stage and there were 22 spaces for the bottlecap replicas they used for the starting positions, but only 21 of the bottlecaps themselves. He wasn't on stage there, and there's been no explanation for his absence.

You would think somebody would have found a car for him, at Hendrick if nowhere else. But it doesn't bode well for the HOFR effort. They have to have at least 2 speedway cars, if only to have one as a backup car. Several of the teams in the Shootout ran their 500 backup cars.

Bill Saunders, the managing partner at HOFR, is a former SCCA Trans-Am racer himself. That's why the decision to skip the Shootout surprised me so much.

 

[Jeff Gluck]

Seems like the deal they announced today about bump drafting spotters is pretty half-assed. They won't do anything in the 500, just probably penalize one guy in the Gatorades and say, "See? We're doing something about it!"

Stewart had a good idea about making the bumpers soft so it would damage the car if you bump-drafted. That's probably the best solution.

 

[lono]

And, can we stop calling it an "all-star" race? I know that's technical NASCAR term, but it's not like it was an all-star game with the best of the best. It was against a limited field of the same guys who race week in and week out. The only difference is there's no chance to get taken out by a backmarker -- because they're not there.

Isn't that the very definition of an all-star event? The best guys are there, the backmarkers aren't.

 

[dog428]

They don't have a choice but to bump draft. You want to see a bad situation? Make them stop doing it, and then take a look a driver No. 5 in a 10-car chain in which driver No. 1 checked up instead of bumping the guy in front of him. And right now, there's really no way to fix it. They can screw with aerodynamics and keep the cars off each other's bumpers, but that creates a situation where nobody can pass, and the drivers ***** about that. They can take the restrictor plates off, but that turns the cars into brightly-colored missles, and the fans in rows 25 thru 75 probably don't want to leave the track dead.

As for Knaus, running a NASCAR team is just like running a major college football team -- if you ain't cheatin', you ain't trying.

There are all sorts of gray, murky areas when it comes to design, setup and pretty much everything else in the sport. Every good crew chief is pushing the limits, figuring out how much he can do and still get away with it. Because know this: If that car makes it through pre-race inspection and your "special" adjustments put it in victory lane, that win ain't coming off the record. And you ain't losing much money. Oh, you might be sanctioned and lose 25 points and a few grand in cash, but what's that up against winning Daytona and $2 million?

And if there's anybody in the garage who should shut up about cheating and being allowed to slide by with questionable setups, it's Harvick. For damn near two solid years, the 29 did whatever the hell it wanted to and nobody said a word. Without those breaks, Kevin Harvick would be the guy who screwed up Earnhardt's race team.

Also, I disagree with coolpapa's prediction of failure for the Aikman/Staubach team. Simply because of who they are, they're gonna attract sponsorship. Because Labonte is automatically making these first few races, that guarantees money. If they do the right thing and dump that money back in the business, they could be OK. I'll confess that I don't know much about their organization -- who's running the shop, where they're getting their engines -- but from a money standpoint, they're five or six steps ahead of most one-car startups.

 

[Big Buckin' agate_monkey]

And if there's anybody in the garage who should shut up about cheating and being allowed to slide by with questionable setups, it's Harvick. For damn near two solid years, the 29 did whatever the hell it wanted to and nobody said a word. Without those breaks, Kevin Harvick would be the guy who screwed up Earnhardt's race team.

You have any proof of that? I'm not saying it's untrue, but I'd find that very interesting reading.

 

[dog428]

And if there's anybody in the garage who should shut up about cheating and being allowed to slide by with questionable setups, it's Harvick. For damn near two solid years, the 29 did whatever the hell it wanted to and nobody said a word. Without those breaks, Kevin Harvick would be the guy who screwed up Earnhardt's race team.

You have any proof of that? I'm not saying it's untrue, but I'd find that very interesting reading.

That Atlanta setup -- Harvick's first win -- is legendary. Had Bill Elliott say point blank one day: "I don't know if there was a legal part on that car." If Wild Bill is bitchin', you know something ain't right.

 

[spnited]

They don't have a choice but to bump draft. You want to see a bad situation? Make them stop doing it, and then take a look a driver No. 5 in a 10-car chain in which driver No. 1 checked up instead of bumping the guy in front of him. And right now, there's really no way to fix it. They can screw with aerodynamics and keep the cars off each other's bumpers, but that creates a situation where nobody can pass, and the drivers ***** about that. They can take the restrictor plates off, but that turns the cars into brightly-colored missles, and the fans in rows 25 thru 75 probably don't want to leave the track dead.

Couldn't they alleviate some of the problem by shortening the fields? I mean, do you really need 43 cars, especially on some of the mile or shorter tracks? Isn't that an invitation to disaster, a 25-car wreck waiting to happen?
Wouldn't it be easier to maneuver and pass wiht 10 or 12 fewer cars in the race? Wouldn;t the race be a whole lot safer?

 

[dog428]

They don't have a choice but to bump draft. You want to see a bad situation? Make them stop doing it, and then take a look a driver No. 5 in a 10-car chain in which driver No. 1 checked up instead of bumping the guy in front of him. And right now, there's really no way to fix it. They can screw with aerodynamics and keep the cars off each other's bumpers, but that creates a situation where nobody can pass, and the drivers ***** about that. They can take the restrictor plates off, but that turns the cars into brightly-colored missles, and the fans in rows 25 thru 75 probably don't want to leave the track dead.

Couldn't they alleviate some of the problem by shortening the fields? I mean, do you really need 43 cars, especially on some of the mile or shorter tracks? Isn't that an invitation to disaster, a 25-car wreck waiting to happen?
Wouldn't it be easier to maneuver and pass wiht 10 or 12 fewer cars in the race? Wouldn;t the race be a whole lot safer?

NASCAR could reduce the field, and they've actually talked about doing so, but for different reasons. Having a problem getting 43 cars to show up at some races.

But it won't solve the bump drafting problem. Having 30 or 33 cars running nose-to-tail isn't much different than having 43, especially when you factor in that at least 10 or so cars in every race have absolutely no shot at even keeping up with the rest of the field, much less winning.

To be honest, I don't know what the damn big deal is. Yeah, bump drafting has caused a few wrecks over the last few years, but stack it up against somebody just screwing up and I guarantee you that the numbers are about even, if not in favor of the screw ups.

It all boils down to this: Drivers like to *****. It goes in cycles on different topics. One year it's restrictor plates. The next year it's the tires. The next it's the bump drafting. Then it's back to the plates. Then the tires again.

It's always gonna be something. I liked Dale Jr.'s quote after the Shootout: "Yeah, it's dangerous. But they pay us pretty well to do this."

 

[Jeff Gluck]

Yeah, but I think you have to listen to what they're saying about the bump drafting getting increasingly aggressive.

Mark Martin was on Cold Pizza this morning and said he had never been beat around in any race in his entire life as much as he was at the Bud Shootout last weekend.

I mean, come on, I don't think this is some made-up issue here.

 

[dog428]

Yeah, but I think you have to listen to what they're saying about the bump drafting getting increasingly aggressive.

Mark Martin was on Cold Pizza this morning and said he had never been beat around in any race in his entire life as much as he was at the Bud Shootout last weekend.

I mean, come on, I don't think this is some made-up issue here.

You're right, do listen to what they're saying. That's how you know it's just drivers whining.

You've got some drivers thanking the other drivers who "pushed" them up through the field. You've got the guys who wrecked bitching about the unnecessary risks. You got the usual bitchers -- Tony Stewart, Rusty Wallace, Kurt Busch -- bitching about everything under the sun. Then you've got guys like Dale Jr., Elliott Sadler, Jeff Gordon, Dale Jarrett, Jimmie Johnson, Jeff Burton and Matt Kenseth driving their cars and not bitching about anything.

The fact is a fatal wreck is no more likely at Daytona and Talladega today, with the bump drafting, than it was 10 years ago without it. You've still got 43 cars going 190+ mph six inches apart. The fact that they're hitting each other in the ass 50 times per race isn't causing nearly as many wrecks as its preventing.

 

[fmrsped]

My initial reaction to the "watchingthe bumping," although perhaps simple, is this: You set the cars up this way, make it unavoidable to bumpdraft, and then you're going to penalize people for doing it?

That makes no sense.

 

[Inky_Wretch]

Trailer for the new Will Farrell NASCAR movie is out...

http://www.sonypictures.com/movies/talladeganights/

I can't tell if it will mock NASCAR or if it's just a comedy set within the sport.