What happened to professional courtesy?

[sportsguydave]

Just a brief rant here ...

When did it become standard business practice in the newspaper business to completely blow off job applicants?

I've applied for several positions in the past few months .. some recently, so the jury is still out on those. But some of them were over a month ago, and nothing. Not even a response to say, hey, we got your stuff, we'll be in touch. Nada.

I realize that in our current market, even Podunk papers are getting a ton of applications. But really - how much time does it take to fire off a quick email to an applicant notifying them of the status of the search, or that the position has been filled/frozen? Especially in the summer ... which is down time for many paper.

We had that come up at my shop last year ... I was looking to replace my departed assistant, but then the position was frozen. I emailed all the applicants ... more than 30 .. and let them know. I figured it was the professional thing to do.

Many of these same places will specify, "No calls." Fine. But at least answer emails. We put a lot of time and energy into an application package. It would be nice to have that effort at least acknowledged.

Rant over. :)

 

[sportsjunkie]

Uhh, it's not just newspapers.

 

[TheSportsPredictor]

1991 at least.

 

[Joe Williams]

This crap has been going on forever.

A favorite: Near-panicky SE calls up, says, "Get clips in the mail right away! I've got a spot open and I want to bring you in to fill it." So you stay up all night at Kinko's and FedEx a resume packet to the SE's paper. Weeks go by. Paint peels. You hear nothing. You find out later that a) they went into a hiring freeze or b) the guy moved on to other people without so much as a "Get bent!" in reply. This has happened twice to me and at least one each to three friends in the business.

My experience is, hiring editors have been behaving rudely to job applicants for a long, long time. And sportsjunkie is right, these days -- empowered by the Web and little human interaction -- the screeners for lots of non-newspaper companies are equally bad.

At least in the past, it felt like hazing or something, that if you could just get into the club, you'd achieve a special status. Now it's just a taste of how you'll be treated once you're in -- they treat current employees about as shabbily as applicants.

 

[DanOregon]

I don't have a problem with not getting a response from an application. But if you get to an interview, there really is no excuse.

 

[sportsguydave]

I'd have to agree. Maybe I'm a little more sensitive to this, being on both sides of the table in such a short period of time. But sheesh .. recently we even had a place that apparently thought a post on our message board was a proper way to tell applicants thanks, but no thanks.

I guess it's too much to expect to be treated the way I treat others, huh?? ::)

 

[MileHigh]

Agreed. Interview is one thing. Applying for a job and not hear anything? It's almost expected.

I applied for a job that the person doing the hiring I used to work with and consider a good friend. Haven't heard a word.

Of course, I interviewed at the same place (person wasn't in charge of the hiring, but had a say so in it). I'm still waiting to hear I didn't get the job. It was more than two years ago.

But it happens. I'm happy when I DO get an e-mail or response to a job I applied for. That's the way it is in this market.

 

[MileHigh]

And let's remember, places are getting overrun with applications for any jobs they post.

Here's an example:

http://www.oberjuerge.com/?p=820

163 applications for a job in the first three days. At a weekly.

 

[Fredrick]

We had that come up at my shop last year ... I was looking to replace my departed assistant, but then the position was frozen. I emailed all the applicants ... more than 30 .. and let them know. I figured it was the professional thing to do.

That was the professional thing to do and you did it. It's a low-class move to not respond to applicants, but that's to be expected nowadays. Congrats to you for being professional and doing the right thing.

 

[jagtrader]

And let's remember, places are getting overrun with applications for any jobs they post.

Here's an example:

http://www.oberjuerge.com/?p=820

163 applications for a job in the first three days. At a weekly.

That was sobering to read.

 

[Taylee]

From another perspective. Last job opening we had resulted in almost 300 resumes, about 175 of which came in the first four days. I was doing both the job of the SE and ASE and that doesn't mean sitting on my ass watching the process. My only day off of the week, I spent about 12 hours reading through those 175 and sending replies. For me, it's not enough just to send a note that says, "Resume received." I try to put some individual thought into my responses. The job description was specific as were the job requirements, yet more than half came from those not even close to qualifying for the job. Do I still spend hours replying to those or is a form response OK? It's a tough call, but either one takes significant time. Should the person sending the resume know he/she isn't qualified? It's frustrating to seek, for example, a "copy editor with three years experience at a daily" only to receive resumes from recent college grads with writing experience or from veteran writers in the business who send a list of writing awards they've won and never mention the ability or desire to edit copy? Only a couple noted a lack of qualifications, but added that if the position is filled from within to consider them for that opening. And while I'm on a roll, for those of you sending resumes, make sure to get the names of the person and company correct. I don't think someone deserves a response when a resume is sent to "Steve" when my name is "Scott"
There it is. Have at it.

 

[hondo]

This is all part and parcel of a sad lack of management skills by supervisors within the newsroom. With very few exceptions, none of them took any courses in college in how to relate to people in term of doing job interviews, hiring, firing, etc. It's the same reason why they're also so lacking in knowledge of laws regarding wages, hours and other labor situations, and think they can tell you that you won't be paid for overtime or while you're stuck in an airport, etc. They have no clue. Some of been able to learn on the fly and do good jobs, mainly because they're people persons. Others simply suck at every aspect of dealing with people in a professional work environment.

 

[Mark2010]

Well, I agree with both sides.

I've posted before about the lack of responses. I suspect about 75 percent of places I apply I never hear back from. Sometimes, if I'm truly interested, I'll follow up with a phone call. Other times not.

And, yeah, I can understand the viewpoint of an overworked SE who has far too many respondents to sort through.

In a recent conversation, one issue that came up was the applicant to job ratio. I'm not sure this is limited to media, or even sports in particular. But it does strike me that far too many people out there are aspiring to be sports journalists --- and, of course, that drives down salaries along the way. If I had known 20 years that so many people wanted to be sports journalists, I'd have gone a different route. Back when I was in university, it didn't seem like a highly sought major.

 

[SF_Express]

We're doing OK on this thread, but I simply can't agree all of the negatives toward the editors who aren't acknowledginng every resume received, or notifying every single applicant concerning what's going on.

Not only are managers getting swamped with applications for openings, they're also trying to put out the damn paper with vastly reduced staff, trying to deal with unrest among the people who remain, trying to do the jobs they've always done with far fewer resources elsewhere (space, travel, etc.) and, oh by the way, dealing with an entirely new distribution system in the web.

In a perfect world, would I hope that a manager at least acknowledge each one of the 150 job applications he or she gets? Sure. Is this a perfect world? No.

These are tough times for people out of work. But they're also tough times for the people still working. It's worth remembering and at least cutting a little slack.

Edit: Hondo, upon further review, your post wasn't a good thing to hang mine on, since you were mostly right.

 

[Ace]

Well, I agree with both sides.

I've posted before about the lack of responses. I suspect about 75 percent of places I apply I never hear back from. Sometimes, if I'm truly interested, I'll follow up with a phone call. Other times not.

And, yeah, I can understand the viewpoint of an overworked SE who has far too many respondents to sort through.

In a recent conversation, one issue that came up was the applicant to job ratio. I'm not sure this is limited to media, or even sports in particular. But it does strike me that far too many people out there are aspiring to be sports journalists --- and, of course, that drives down salaries along the way. If I had known 20 years that so many people wanted to be sports journalists, I'd have gone a different route. Back when I was in university, it didn't seem like a highly sought major.

I don't mind not hearing back from mailing in a resume, but I hate having to apply via the web and not even getting an automated reply saying that the application was received.

 

[SF_Express]

Well, I agree with both sides.

I've posted before about the lack of responses. I suspect about 75 percent of places I apply I never hear back from. Sometimes, if I'm truly interested, I'll follow up with a phone call. Other times not.

And, yeah, I can understand the viewpoint of an overworked SE who has far too many respondents to sort through.

In a recent conversation, one issue that came up was the applicant to job ratio. I'm not sure this is limited to media, or even sports in particular. But it does strike me that far too many people out there are aspiring to be sports journalists --- and, of course, that drives down salaries along the way. If I had known 20 years that so many people wanted to be sports journalists, I'd have gone a different route. Back when I was in university, it didn't seem like a highly sought major.

I don't mind not hearing back from mailing in a resume, but I hate having to apply via the web and not even getting an automated reply saying that the application was received.

Agreed...

 

[MrBSquared]

Unsolicited? No reply required. That is an assumption by the sender. People are busy. File it away (no, not in File 13) and pull it out when there are openings.

Solicited? An auto reply, at least: "Got it. Thanks. Will let you know." If it's an obvious "no" from the start, a nice "not right now" would be nice. But, as has been noted, a lot of people looking and a lot of time needed to reply to all the resumes. Still, most people put an e-mail contact. If they don't? Don't feel obligated.

An interview? No less than a letter either updating the status or delivering a "no thanks" message. In fact, if there has been an interview, a 5 minute "we're still mulling it over" or "sorry, it just doesn't seem to be a fit" call would be better. You took the time to go, they can take the time to talk with you.

A few years back, rearranged my work schedule, including some comp time, to fly to Charleston, S.C., for an interview. Spent a day-and-a-half meeting with everyone from the janitor to the publisher, had dinner with the editor and SE, flew home the next morning.

Then ... nada. Nothing. Even called and left a voice message, asking if any decision had been made.

<cricket chirp><cricket chirp><cricket chirp>

X'd that spot off the wish list.

 

[Cosmo]

No way should you expect a response unless you're one of the people making the first cut. If there are 150 applicants and you're one of the 20 who are getting a serious look, then yes, you deserve something. But there's no way you can ask a hiring manager to sent out 150 e-mails for everyone who throws a resume in the mail for a job. That's just unrealistic considering how much work those managers are doing with much less resources.

 

[deskslave]

No way should you expect a response unless you're one of the people making the first cut. If there are 150 applicants and you're one of the 20 who are getting a serious look, then yes, you deserve something. But there's no way you can ask a hiring manager to sent out 150 e-mails for everyone who throws a resume in the mail for a job. That's just unrealistic considering how much work those managers are doing with much less resources.

In fairness, you don't HAVE to send out 150 e-mails. You can send out the same e-mail, and just put all the e-mail addresses on the one e-mail (In the blind carbon field or whatever, so you protect everyone's privacy). It's less personal, naturally, but it's better than nothing. And, sure, it would take a little while to type all the addresses in, but it would be, what, 15, 20 minutes? An awful lot less time than a lot of the applicants probably spent applying, anyway.

 

[RickStain]

The one time I got annoyed: I was told I'd be called within a week after an interview, didn't hear from the SE for three weeks, and then he called me and said he'd assumed I'd call to see what's up. It was some kind of test.

I got the job anyway, and he was an incredible SE and a great guy, but we did not see the world the same way at all, and that should have been my first clue.