RIP Dan Gurney

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maumann

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Writing my manifesto in the woods
First American to win in Formula 1, Indianapolis-style cars and NASCAR. Co-drove with A.J. Foyt to victory in the 1967 LeMans. Absolutely owned Riverside International Raceway in anything and everything. Designed some of the best-looking race cars ever.

He's on my short list of greatest all-around American drivers ever.

http://www.racer.com/f1/item/146728-dan-gurney-1931-2018#!1959_Portugal_Ferrari
 
First American to win in Formula 1, Indianapolis-style cars and NASCAR. Co-drove with A.J. Foyt to victory in the 1967 LeMans. Absolutely owned Riverside International Raceway in anything and everything. Designed some of the best-looking race cars ever.

He's on my short list of greatest all-around American drivers ever.

F1 Racing News - Dan Gurney, 1931-2018
Who is the greatest American driver?
 
I never saw him race, although I did get to see some of his drivers race in the 80s when he was running All American Racing. Some of the old-timers I grew up around used to rave about how good he was in the 60s. Always heard him described as the greatest driver to race the 500 without winning.

As to the greatest American driver? I don't know how you get around Mario Andretti's F1 title, multiple IndyCar titles, Indy 500 and Daytona 500 wins.
 
Who is the greatest American driver?

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Seriously? Foyt.
 
Who is the greatest American driver?
Gurney stepped out of the cockpit while still young. Same with Penske. Both had incredible accomplishments after giving up driving.
I didn't realize until reading the LA Times obit that Gurney started the trend of spraying with champagne from the victory podium in 1967.
I'd forgotten half of Gurney's accomplishments. It's too bad how most racers today stick to one type of racing. That's why it's so refreshing to see guys like Alonso, Larson, etc.
 
Gurney stepped out of the cockpit while still young. Same with Penske. Both had incredible accomplishments after giving up driving.
I didn't realize until reading the LA Times obit that Gurney started the trend of spraying with champagne from the victory podium in 1967.
I'd forgotten half of Gurney's accomplishments. It's too bad how most racers today stick to one type of racing. That's why it's so refreshing to see guys like Alonso, Larson, etc.

I know next to nothing about racing. But my reservation with calling Foyt the greatest ever is that I don't know how much road racing he did. Foyt was great in USAC and did well when he drove NASCAR. If you want to call Foyt the greatest oval track driver I think I would agree. But Andretti accomplished a lot on ovals and won a Formula One Championship.
 
Foyt and Gurney paired up to win the 1967 LeMans in the Ford GT, but because Gurney overslept and missed a driver change, Foyt drove 18 of the 24 hours. He's won the 24 Hours of Daytona, including setting the fastest lap of the race in a heavy rain. He's won the 12 Hours of Sebring. He won the Bahamas Speed Week, joining names like Gurney, Roger Penske and Phil Hill. He won multiple road course races in USAC.

That makes Foyt the only driver to have won the Indianapolis 500, Daytona 500, 24 Hours of Daytona, 24 Hours of Le Mans and 12 Hours of Sebring.

He drove in 35 consecutive Indy 500s, is the only driver to win the 500 in both rear-engined and front-engined cars, has seven Indy-car championships (including 10 wins in 13 races in 1964) and his 67 career victories is 15 more than second-place Mario Andretti and 25 more than third-place Michael Andretti. His 138 USAC victories remains a record, even though he hasn't competed in USAC for almost 35 years. He won four USAC stock car titles, seven NASCAR races, is a two-time winner of the International Race of Champions and was named as one of NASCAR's 50 greatest drivers despite never running that circuit full-time. He also owns the world closed-course speed record at 257.123 mph, which he set at age 52.

Plus he co-designed the Coyote and was heavily involved in the design of the Ford racing engine that powered his cars in the 1970s. He's also won the Indy 500 as a car owner, and fielded a NASCAR team for several seasons.

My favorite line -- and don't know who wrote it -- has always been, "If the Indianapolis 500 was determined by the first driver to put together the car and then race the 500 miles, A.J. Foyt would be sipping milk in Victory Circle before the other 32 drivers found out where the tool box was located."
 
If I'm picking a short list ...

1a. Foyt
1b. Mario (born in Italy, but counts as an "American driver" in this context)
3. Gurney
4. Mark Donohue
5. Phil Hill

David Pearson, Richard Petty, Cale Yarborough, Bobby Allison, Dale Earnhardt, Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart and Bill Vukovich are also worthy of inclusion as greatest American drivers, but this is "all-around" best.
 
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If I'm picking a short list ...

1a. Foyt
1b. Mario (born in Italy, but counts as an "American driver" in this context)
3. Gurney
4. Mark Donohue
5. Phil Hill

David Pearson, Richard Petty, Cale Yarborough, Bobby Allison, Dale Earnhardt, Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart and Bill Vukovich are also worthy of inclusion as greatest American drivers, but this is "all-around" best.

Kind of a depressingly old list, isn't it? Really shows you how NASCAR-centric racing has become for American drivers. I would have loved to have seen Jeff Gordon competing in F1 or Le Mans, and it's hard to rate him higher without that kind of experience.
 
Kind of a depressingly old list, isn't it? Really shows you how NASCAR-centric racing has become for American drivers. I would have loved to have seen Jeff Gordon competing in F1 or Le Mans, and it's hard to rate him higher without that kind of experience.

Very depressing. And sad that someone like young'un Josef Newgarden, the reigning IndyCar champion with a boatload of talent, might not get those kinds of experiences either. All the series now are so territorial too, a guy like Newgarden isn't likely to try the Daytona 500 due to politics and such. There will still be one-offs at Indy, but those aren't completely satisfying either. If Kurt Busch could finish sixth as a rookie, what might he have done if he came back the next year?

I miss IROC too.
 
Kind of a depressingly old list, isn't it? Really shows you how NASCAR-centric racing has become for American drivers. I would have loved to have seen Jeff Gordon competing in F1 or Le Mans, and it's hard to rate him higher without that kind of experience.

1. Technology: The skill set needed to drive a rear-engine, high-downforce car now -- as compared to the 1970s -- is significantly different than a front-engine, low downforce or high horsepower-to-weight ratioed car. Blame engineers, wind tunnels and exotic composite materials if you wish.

That's somewhat the reason why some midget and sprint car drivers found more success in NASCAR than open-wheel racing. And why Danica Patrick (see also Dario Franchitti, Sam Hornish, et al) knows how to point the nose and hold the pedal down, which works in qualifying at Daytona and Talladega, but she doesn't have the car control to run on the edge while feathering the throttle. That the skill Gordon and Stewart brought from USAC dirt track racing.

2. Money: During NASCAR's heyday, owners were signing dozens of young drivers to "futures contracts." Why spend years in Formula Fords and Indy Lights, hoping to catch someone's eye in open-wheel when most of the owners there are hiring failed F1 drivers and Brazilians -- unless you bought a helmetful of your own cash or a sponsor. If Roush, Hendrick and Gibbs were willing to pay you $150,000 a year to drive Late Models or maybe a couple of Truck or Busch starts, you couldn't turn that down. However, that's gone, so the ladder to NASCAR isn't very well-defined right now.

3. Sponsors: The name of the front of your driver uniform means a lot more than the one on the back. If Honda isn't in NASCAR, they don't want you racing in a Toyota at Darlington. It's not that drivers wouldn't like the opportunity to cross over -- they can't without negotiating a mountain of paperwork, bringing in a bevy of lawyers to protect a bunch of motorsports executives with massive egos and fiefdoms.

It was enlightening to see McLaren allow Alonso to run Indy in a non-McLaren car. That's rare in this day and age.

4. Opportunities: There may be no more than six cars on an F1 grid with any reasonable hope of winning. None of those have much interest in hiring an inexperienced American to sit in a billion-dollar race car. Michael Andretti was probably the best hope in the past three decades, and that ended poorly. A lot of talented American drivers have gone to Europe and run F2 without a sniff of a big-time ride -- thinking specifically about Alexander Rossi. Ferrari gravitates toward Italians, Williams prefers English drivers, and so on. The Haas team has shown absolutely no interest in grooming a Ryan Hunter-Reay, Josef Newgarden or Rossi. Their loss.
 
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I'm too young to really know much about Gurney, other than he was great and designed some great cars. Step back and look at his accomplishments, though: pretty amazing.

And IROC was good until they stopped running road courses and started packing the field with stock car guys. Didn't Steve Kinser drive IROC one year? Sure, a great driver, but maybe make space for someone other than him, nine NASCAR drivers, and maybe someone from an Indycar series. Sorry, the Busch series champ shouldn't have been in IROC. Watch some of the early IROC races, they had F1 guys!
 
The Haas team has shown absolutely no interest in grooming a Ryan Hunter-Reay, Josef Newgarden or Rossi. Their loss.

This is the part that's really frustrating for me. The team said early on it would field an American driver but eventually changed and said it would field the two most competitive drivers it could. Fair enough -- and its initial number two driver was Mexican, so there was a solid North American driver getting an opportunity.

But Romain Grosjean and Kevin Magnussen? Grosjean is ok, and has shown he's competitive in a quick car. Magnussen is mediocre. Neither guy is bad, but neither guy is going to make that car halfway competitive. Having an American team seemed like such a step forward, and somehow they've created the least interesting team in the field. Boring car, boring drivers, ugly livery... blech.

Why on earth would they not give that second drive to Rossi or Hunter-Reay or Newgarden? Rossi has even shown he can hold his own in a dog of an F1 car. Please, give me a reason to care about your boring back marker team!
 
I'm too young to really know much about Gurney, other than he was great and designed some great cars. Step back and look at his accomplishments, though: pretty amazing.

And IROC was good until they stopped running road courses and started packing the field with stock car guys. Didn't Steve Kinser drive IROC one year? Sure, a great driver, but maybe make space for someone other than him, nine NASCAR drivers, and maybe someone from an Indycar series. Sorry, the Busch series champ shouldn't have been in IROC. Watch some of the early IROC races, they had F1 guys!

You're right, near its end IROC became basically a support race on a few NASCAR weekends. That was the easiest way to fill 3/4ths of the field if not more.
 
I'm too young to really know much about Gurney, other than he was great and designed some great cars. Step back and look at his accomplishments, though: pretty amazing.

And IROC was good until they stopped running road courses and started packing the field with stock car guys. Didn't Steve Kinser drive IROC one year? Sure, a great driver, but maybe make space for someone other than him, nine NASCAR drivers, and maybe someone from an Indycar series. Sorry, the Busch series champ shouldn't have been in IROC. Watch some of the early IROC races, they had F1 guys!

They also drove identical Porsche Carreras the first season. Talk about some expensive wreckage! The following season, Penske built custom Camaros with Mark Donohue's help.

The First IROC Chevrolet Camaros Built by Roger Penske and Mark Donohue in 1974
 

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