RIP Cory Monteith

[Dick Whitman]

Data can be manipulated to support any argument.

False.

That wasn't a question.

Do you believe that climate change is occurring?

 

[Riptide]

Data can be manipulated to support any argument.

False.

That wasn't a question.

Do you believe that climate change is occurring?

I believe I'm keeping you from your Important Lawyer Work.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Data can be manipulated to support any argument.

False.

That wasn't a question.

Do you believe that climate change is occurring?

I believe I'm keeping you from your Important Lawyer Work.

Do you believe that climate change is occurring?

 

[Charlie Brown]

Or as The Atlantic reminds us today:

To paraphrase the old Sidney Harris cartoon, the formula for weak-sauce goes something like this

(Forced Labor + Mass Rape)AUCTIONING YOUR CHILDREN
+ (Poll tax + Segregation + Grandfather clause)THE KLAN
+ (Redlining + Blockbusting + Race Riots)CUTTING YOU OUT OF THE NEW DEAL
- THEN A MIRACLE OCCURS
= "Meh, you figure it out."

 

[Dick Whitman]

No one writing about addiction can claim to be an expert. Expertise comes from first-hand experience.

A hypothetical cardiologist has never had a heart attack.

Is he disqualified to be an expert on heart attacks?

 

[Bodie_Broadus]

No one writing about addiction can claim to be an expert. Expertise comes from first-hand experience.

A hypothetical cardiologist has never had a heart attack.

Is he disqualified to be an expert on heart attacks?

Not even close to the same argument. Try again.

 

[Dick Whitman]

No one writing about addiction can claim to be an expert. Expertise comes from first-hand experience.

A hypothetical cardiologist has never had a heart attack.

Is he disqualified to be an expert on heart attacks?

Not even close to the same argument.

Distinguish them then.

 

[Iron_chet]

No one writing about addiction can claim to be an expert. Expertise comes from first-hand experience.

A hypothetical cardiologist has never had a heart attack.

Is he disqualified to be an expert on heart attacks?

Hi ****

While I agree with you that you do not need to be a former addict to be an expert on addiction I think the point you are trying to make gets lost when you wrap up your arguemnets in word games and one word answer/questions.

I don't know if it is your rhetorical style and this is how you are in real life or you edit down for message boards but your message routinely gets lost in the douchy way you try to (not always successfully) pin people down on their arguement.

 

[Bodie_Broadus]

A writer who happens to spend time with someone who is an addict didn't go to school to study the workings of addiction.

The MD did.

 

[Dick Whitman]

A writer who happens to spend time with someone who is an addict didn't go to school to study the workings of addiction.

The MD did.

This is what you wrote: "Expertise comes from first-hand experience."

 

[DanOregon]

People get into drugs the same way they think they can drive home from a bar after six drinks.

Which is how?

There is a real level of stupidity and carelessness needed for that (and this) that is kind of difficult to explain away, or to believe possible among most people -- especially people who already know, to boot, that this is a danger.

I think that was hondo's point, and it's not totally irrelevant.

How and why someone gets into drugs does matter. In fact, I'd say it's of critical importance.

Bad judgement tends to build on itself. Your judgement is impaired, you make a bad choice. Maybe there was no consequence, so you double down. Then you double down again. etc. Pretty soon you are so far from the shore of "normal" that the "life raft" of drugs doesn't seem so bad. And then one day you look up and think, how the hell did I get here?

 

[Bodie_Broadus]

A writer who happens to spend time with someone who is an addict didn't go to school to study the workings of addiction.

The MD did.

This is what you wrote: "Expertise comes from first-hand experience."

In many cases it does. Just cause you hang out with someone who is an addict doesn't make you an expert.

I hang out with my dad who is a certified arborist (tree expert) does that make me a tree expert?

Or better yet, if I interview my dad and write a story about what makes certain trees grow the way they do, I am an expert right?

 

[Dick Whitman]

Bodie is trying to argue that marijuana is not a "gateway drug" because it does not lead to harder drugs for everybody who tries it. That's simply a terrible argument. Provably, there is a strong correlation between marijuana use and later use of harder drugs. People who experiment with marijuana tend to move onto harder drugs with greater frequency than the general, non-marijuana-using public. Is this honestly in dispute?

 

[Bodie_Broadus]

Bodie is trying to argue that marijuana is not a "gateway drug" because it does not lead to harder drugs for everybody who tries it. That's simply a terrible argument. Provably, there is a strong correlation between marijuana use and later use of harder drugs. People who experiment with marijuana tend to move onto harder drugs with greater frequency than the general, non-marijuana-using public. Is this honestly in dispute?

Yes.

 

[Dick Whitman]

A writer who happens to spend time with someone who is an addict didn't go to school to study the workings of addiction.

The MD did.

This is what you wrote: "Expertise comes from first-hand experience."

In many cases it does. Just cause you hang out with someone who is an addict doesn't make you an expert.

I hang out with my dad who is a certified arborist (tree expert) does that make me a tree expert?

Or better yet, if I interview my dad and write a story about what makes certain trees grow the way they do, I am an expert right?

What we're talking about is the amount of expertise required to make a credible comment on the topic. I'd have to see your tree story to make that determination. Certainly, some journalists become experts in their topic. John Clayton is an expert on the NFL, no? Ryan Lizza is an expert on current American politics, no? Hanna Rosin is an expert on feminist issues, no? A.O. Scott is an expert on movies, no?

 

[Dick Whitman]

Provably, there is a strong correlation between marijuana use and later use of harder drugs. People who experiment with marijuana tend to move onto harder drugs with greater frequency than the general, non-marijuana-using public. Is this honestly in dispute?

Yes.

According to the National Institute on Drug Abuse, a person who has smoked marijuana is 104 times more likely to use cocaine than a person who never smokes marijuana.

 

[LongTimeListener]

Isn't the standard story from an addict that they were at a party one time, smoking and drinking, and someone offered them a hit of the powerful stuff? And then they were hooked. So, as marijuana and alcohol inhibit good decision-making, they're central to the process.

I doubt a lot of otherwise clean people said "you know what? I've always liked the sound of heroin" and went and found some.

 

[Bodie_Broadus]

http://healthland.time.com/2010/10/29/marijuna-as-a-gateway-drug-the-myth-that-will-not-die/

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/07/11/d-c-councilmember-marijuana-does-not-do-harm-its-not-a-gateway-drug/

http://www.ibtimes.com/nobel-prize-winner-says-tobacco-not-marijuana-gateway-drug-heels-legalization-bill-pa-1008368

http://www.drugpolicy.org/drug-facts/10-facts-about-marijuana

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/07/05/study-the-gateway-drug-is-alcohol-not-marijuana/

http://news.ufl.edu/2012/07/10/alcohol-gateway/

 

[Dick Whitman]

http://healthland.time.com/2010/10/29/marijuna-as-a-gateway-drug-the-myth-that-will-not-die/

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/07/11/d-c-councilmember-marijuana-does-not-do-harm-its-not-a-gateway-drug/

http://www.ibtimes.com/nobel-prize-winner-says-tobacco-not-marijuana-gateway-drug-heels-legalization-bill-pa-1008368

http://www.drugpolicy.org/drug-facts/10-facts-about-marijuana

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/07/05/study-the-gateway-drug-is-alcohol-not-marijuana/

http://news.ufl.edu/2012/07/10/alcohol-gateway/

How do any of those stories - particularly the one on alcohol, which no one is disputing is also a gateway drug - disprove this passage that I wrote?

"Provably, there is a strong correlation between marijuana use and later use of harder drugs. People who experiment with marijuana tend to move onto harder drugs with greater frequency than the general, non-marijuana-using public."

 

[LongTimeListener]

Provably, there is a strong correlation between marijuana use and later use of harder drugs. People who experiment with marijuana tend to move onto harder drugs with greater frequency than the general, non-marijuana-using public. Is this honestly in dispute?

Yes.

According to the National Institute on Drug Abuse, a person who has smoked marijuana is 104 times more likely to use cocaine than a person who never smokes marijuana.

“Well, Rickey’s not one of them, so that’s 49 percent right there.” -- Rickey Henderson, on the report that half of baseball players were using steroids