Ichiro -- discuss

[BB Bobcat]

I covered Ichiro's 2,000th hit today, which got me thinking about his place in history. It's an interesting issue because he spent some time in Japan. Still, where do you think he stands? Think he'll get to 3k hits? (he's 35.)

he's a first ballot HOF to me. Anyone disagree?

Just thought I'd throw it out for debate, if there is one.

 

[da man]

I covered Ichiro's 2,000th hit today, which got me thinking about his place in history. It's an interesting issue because he spent some time in Japan. Still, where do you think he stands? Think he'll get to 3k hits? (he's 35.)

he's a first ballot HOF to me. Anyone disagree?

Just thought I'd throw it out for debate, if there is one.

I'm not a baseball guy, but I'll take a shot at these questions.

3,000 hits? No. Started too late and I can't imagine he'll still be cranking out 200-hit seasons at 40. Speed is a big part of his game and that's going to go eventually. I think.

Hall of Famer? Abso-****ing-lutely.

 

[outofplace]

I agree with da man on both counts. Unless he can sustain something close to his current level into his 40s, It's going to be very difficult for him to get to 3,000 hits. But he is a Hall of Famer even without it.

 

[mocheeks10]

Agree he's a HOFer right now; it is, after all, the BASEBALL Hall of Fame, not the AMERICAN Baseball Hall of Fame.

And while I don't think he will reach 3K, I wouldn't rule it out. That's five more years, and he's beaten the actuarial tables to this point.

 

[Stoney]

he spent some time in Japan. Still, where do you think he stands? Think he'll get to 3k hits? (he's 35.)

Not meaning to dispute you here, just pointing this out to clarify just how amazing this guy's career has been: Ichiro did not just "spend some time" in Japan, in only 8 full seasons season there he had one of the greatest Japanese careers ever--winning several MVPs, several batting titles, a gold glove every year, and amassing around 1300 hits. It was after doing this that he STARTED his major league career.

I witnessed some of it first hand, I spent a year in japan around 95-96, and saw Ichiro carry a small market small budget team (Orix) to the Japan World Series title, winning the series MVP along the way, I'd say he was probably the most popular athlete in Japan when I left. And, to my embarrassment, I remember voicing the opinion that he was too small and frail to have the same sort of success over here--needless to say, I was VERY wrong.

He might be too old to get there now, but I've no doubt he'd have already passed 3k if he'd spent his career here. People might even now be talking about whether he has a shot at Rose.

When you add his Major League career to his Japan career to his international career winning the first two World Baseball Classics, Ichiro has had one of the most uniquely successful baseball careers ever.

 

[Trey Beamon]

I think his consistency -- and the sheer number of hits in such a short amount of time -- should earn him a place.

Will it happen? I'm not sure.

Also (this is for a friend ):

 

[imjustagirl]

I wasn't your friend any more.

Until that.

Re: Ichiro, it's sometimes surreal to me to remember how long he's been in the majors. Because I don't follow baseball that closely, time can slip by. It seems like it was just a handful of years ago he came over, and I remember all the hoopla. But now to kind of think about him being 35 and having been here so long is weird in trying to think about how his game might be affected as he gets older.

That being said, I was a big fan even before I knew about the stretching. I hope he's a HOF guy.

 

[ServeItUp]

If Sadaharu Oh is in the Hall, Ichiro is a cinch. And I don't like the talk of him "possibly" getting to 3,000 hits. If he had 1,300 in Japan when he left and he has 2,000 in MLB now... well, even a moron like me can work that out.

 

[BB Bobcat]

Stoney, I don't mean to diminsh what he did in Japan. I'm just curious as to how relevance others give it.

Frankly, he'd probably be a HOFer if he never played a game before arriving with the Mariners and never played another after this year.

I actually think he will get the 980ish huts he needs to pass Pete Rose for the global record. I'm curious to see how people treat that.

 

[BYH]

Ichiro will join the elite class of "if he's not in the Hall they oughta close the ****ing place down" players the second he completes his 10th big league season next September or October.

And if I had to bet on 3,000, I'd bet he gets it.

 

[albert77]

I think Ichiro will not only get to 3,000 hits, he'll probably get to 3,500. Even if he loses a couple of steps and starts to decline a little, with the way he takes care of himself, I can see him playing until he's 45.

And his first-ballot Hall of Fame credentials shouldn't even merit a discussion.

 

[BB Bobcat]

I think Ichiro will not only get to 3,000 hits, he'll probably get to 3,500. Even if he loses a couple of steps and starts to decline a little, with the way he takes care of himself, I can see him playing until he's 45.

And his first-ballot Hall of Fame credentials shouldn't even merit a discussion.

Apparently it doesn't, which is cool.

 

[Stoney]

Stoney, I don't mean to diminsh what he did in Japan. I'm just curious as to how relevance others give it.

I guess it's up to the individual to decide how much weight to give his non-major league accomplishments.

But I think any intelligent voter has to take it into consideration. Ichiro's career is inherently different than any other HOF candidate before him, nobody else ever conquered baseball on two different continents to the degree he has. And he's obviously not like 2k players of the past, he's accomplished far more overall than anyone before at the 2k point and would easily be past 3k by now if he'd spent his whole career here.

 

[BYH]

I don't think it has to be taken into consideration.

He's a .333 lifetime hitter with 2,000 hits in a shade under nine seasons. That's Hall of Fame, as soon as he meets the 10-year requirement.

 

[Crash]

I think he gets to 3,000 American hits.

I also think he's a first-ballot Hall guy, not just because of his on-field accomplishments, either. Ichiro basically paved the way for Japanese position players to come to America. He proved it could be done. Along with Nomo (who came, what, five seasons earlier?) and Matsui, I think Ichiro has to be considered one of the most important ambassadors for MLB in East Asia.

 

[da man]

I don't think it has to be taken into consideration.

He's a .333 lifetime hitter with 2,000 hits in a shade under nine seasons. That's Hall of Fame, as soon as he meets the 10-year requirement.

Don't forget two batting titles (and three other top 5s), six hits titles, nine All-Star teams and an MVP in his first season.

 

[bigpern23]

Agree he's a HOFer right now; it is, after all, the BASEBALL Hall of Fame, not the AMERICAN Baseball Hall of Fame.

Actually, it's the NATIONAL Baseball Hall of Fame.

But I do think he'll undoubtedly be enshrined there, whether you consider his Japanese exploits or not.

If Sadaharu Oh is in the Hall, Ichiro is a cinch. And I don't like the talk of him "possibly" getting to 3,000 hits. If he had 1,300 in Japan when he left and he has 2,000 in MLB now... well, even a moron like me can work that out.

Sadaharu Oh is not in the Hall.

 

[Football_Bat]

The question for me is, guess the hack that leaves Ichiro off the first ballot.

 

[novelist_wannabe]

F_B: Just take all the evidence to Hoover, Ala. ...

To get to 3000 MLB hits, he has to average

a shade under 200 for five years

a shade under 166 for six

a shade under 142 for seven

(shaded because we don't know how many more hits he'll get this year)

I think his chances are excellent, and I'd project that 3,000 will come some time in June, 2015.

As for Hall of Fame, he's a mortal lock as soon as he's eligible. With six more hits this year, he'll have as many 200-hit seasons as Ty Cobb, and he's averagin 232 hits a year. The guy is unblievable.

 

[Michael_ Gee]

I can tell you all this: The Hall of Fame voter who leaves Ichiro off their ballot will not be me. I could not admire a player more.
The guy is great fun to watch play. A-Rod (to take a random example, and this not a knock) is a greater player, but if you're not a Yankee fan, how much pure entertainment does he provide? I look at Ichiro and I think "You know, the way they played the game in 1906 probably made for a good day at the ballpark for fans."