Defining Transphobia Down

[YankeeFan]

I think I've made myself pretty clear that the trans community deserves compassion and acceptance.

No one who is trans should face discrimination in the workplace, in housing, etc.

But, even as acceptance of the trans community grows, the goalpost look to be moving.

In the last several days alone, we saw a cis actress bullied out of an acting role, and an article defending the original casting pulled, because some were uncomfortable it.

Is one transphobic if you believe that a cis actor can play a trans role, if you aren't comfortable with dating a woman with a penis (or a man without one), or if you aren't onboard with statements that aren't backed by science?

Some examples:

 

[TheSportsPredictor]

The point of the criticism of Scarlett Johansson in that role is that straight actors are regularly offered roles like that while transgender actors rarely if at all get offers to play straight people.

Now, I'm sure that has mostly to due with economics, as Scarlett Johansson is a movie star who will draw people to the box office based on her name. Are there any big name transgender actors or actress? I can only think of Laverne Cox from Orange is the New Black, and she's not exactly a big name. Of course, there will never be a big name transgender actor or actress if they never get a chance. It would make you transphobic if you believe a transgender actor or actress can't play a straight role.

 

[YankeeFan]

The point of the criticism of Scarlett Johansson in that role is that straight actors are regularly offered roles like that while transgender actors rarely if at all get offers to play straight people.

Now, I'm sure that has mostly to due with economics, as Scarlett Johansson is a movie star who will draw people to the box office based on her name. Are there any big name transgender actors or actress? I can only think of Laverne Cox from Orange is the New Black, and she's not exactly a big name. Of course, there will never be a big name transgender actor or actress if they never get a chance. It would make you transphobic if you believe a transgender actor or actress can't play a straight role.

I don't think that was the point of the criticism at all.

 

[TheSportsPredictor]

I do, since I read some criticism by people which explicitly stated it.

 

[MisterCreosote]

Hilary Swank should give back her Oscar from Boys Don’t Cry.

 

[TyWebb]

Genitals aren't very important?

 

[YankeeFan]

Genitals aren't very important?

Apparently not.

Sure, you like having vaginal sex with your wife, but if she suddenly had a penis, you could just give her a blow job. What's the big deal?

 

[MisterCreosote]

One of the most critically acclaimed shows about trans life features a female lead character played by:

It’s a really good show, too. But that might just be my heteronormativity talking.

 

[TyWebb]

One of the most critically acclaimed shows about trans life features a female lead character played by:

It’s a really good show, too. But that might just be my heteronormativity talking.

And that show is fairly recent, yet I don't remember a similar outcry when Tambor was cast (and then nominated for awards, I believe). Has the general attitude changed that quickly or is there a difference between the two I'm missing?

 

[MisterCreosote]

It’s infinitely more likely that Twitter is just full of psychos of all stripes who need to ***** about something constantly.

 

[YankeeFan]

It’s infinitely more likely that Twitter is just full of psychos of all stripes who need to ***** about something constantly.

Well, they're getting results.

A major actress just got forced out of a movie.

 

[TyWebb]

I'm sure there were at least some people outraged over Tambor playing a trans role at the time. I think it is at least partially because people are more aware of trans issues now and that movement is gaining support. But I also think that movement hasn't found its limits yet, so anything that could potentially touch a trans topic is fodder for outrage.

 

[Jake_Taylor]

I can certainly understand the frustration if you are a trans actor and struggle to get rolls.

But stories about trans people don't get to the mainstream without star power behind it. That's important too. And it's acting. It kind of defeats the purpose if actors only can play roles similar to themselves.

Actors who have taken on these parts have generally done so thoughtfully and kindly. I don't think it has the same kind of ugly history as, say, blackface. I could be wrong.

 

[Spartan Squad]

I'm not sure what YF is trying to do here, because it's some subtextual thing, but this movement has been coming for a while in Hollywood. There has been a a backlash against whitewashing. Emma Stone as a mixed Chinese-Hawaiian character, Johnny Deep as Tonto and Tilda Swinton as the Ancient One in Dr Strange who is supposed to be from an Asian country. Basically Hollywood goes the easy money-making way rather than find a good actor who actually fits the demographic they're playing.

 

[Batman]

This might be a dumb question, but is there an abundance of transgender actors that Scarlett Johansson's role could have gone to?
I mean, the perception is that every third person is transgender but in reality it's a very small demographic. Something like 0.6 percent of the U.S. population or about 2 million people on the high estimates. Figure that the overwhelming majority of them are not actors, and the ones that are would need to be 1) openly transgender; and 2) good enough at their craft to star in a movie to get a part like that.
I'm guessing that's not exactly a deep bench.

 

[YankeeFan]

How many trans actors have successfully opened a movie?

Hollywood would cast the devil if they thought they would make money.

Trans actors certainly should be given opportunities, but has anyone specifically been mentioned as an appropriate replacement in this role?

 

[TyWebb]

I'm not sure what YF is trying to do here, because it's some subtextual thing, but this movement has been coming for a while in Hollywood. There has been a a backlash against whitewashing. Emma Stone as a mixed Chinese-Hawaiian character, Johnny Deep as Tonto and Tilda Swinton as the Ancient One in Dr Strange who is supposed to be from an Asian country. Basically Hollywood goes the easy money-making way rather than find a good actor who actually fits the demographic they're playing.

I don't think YF is trying to do anything but bring an interesting topic up for discussion.

And all the examples you mentioned center around race/nationality and were certainly worthy of criticism (in my opinion, at least). So there is clearly a line. But are we saying that transsexual roles are the same kind of "protected" role where only people who are them can play them?

What about gay roles? (I know, gay and trans issues are very different. I just think it illustrates a point.)

 

[da man]

I don't think YF is trying to do anything but bring an interesting topic up for discussion.

And all the examples you mentioned center around race/nationality and were certainly worthy of criticism (in my opinion, at least). So there is clearly a line. But are we saying that transsexual roles are the same kind of "protected" role where only people who are them can play them?

What about gay roles? (I know, gay and trans issues are very different. I just think it illustrates a point.)

Gay people have played straight people and vice-versa countless times in the past, and still do.

 

[TyWebb]

Gay people have played straight people and vice-versa countless times in the past, and still do.

I know, that's my point. Why is it different?

The thing I've heard that seems like the bigger issue is that trans people are rarely offered cis roles.

 

[QYFW]

I can certainly understand the frustration if you are a trans actor and struggle to get rolls.

But stories about trans people don't get to the mainstream without star power behind it. That's important too. And it's acting. It kind of defeats the purpose if actors only can play roles similar to themselves.

Actors who have taken on these parts have generally done so thoughtfully and kindly. It don't think it has the same kind of ugly history as, say, blackface. I could be wrong.

The mob torpedoed their movie for Twitter pwns.