Baseball HOF: Who makes it in addition to Ripken and Gwynn?

[Flying Headbutt]

I'm just curious, how the hell did someone vote for Cal and not for Gwynn? Just stuck out as pretty odd to me.

 

[GB-Hack]

It's a bloody shame that Gossage JUST missed. I also feel that Tommy John and Canseco should also get in, not only for their stats, but also what they contributed beyond the playing field. Hell, both of their careers got a little extra help. B/c of John and Dr. Frank Jobe, countless of pitchers went on to be come All-Stars and a couple of future HOFers. Canseco, as slimy as he comes off, used what little of the balls he has left to blow the whistle on MLB's steroid problem. Doesn't that carry some merit?

On Canseco, there is a little merit for ratting people out, but then you look at the one-dimensional player he was, capped by the baseball off the head homerun.

It won't be an issue, he got less than 5% of the vote. He won't appear again on the ballot.

 

[Ellis Redding]

It's a bloody shame that Gossage JUST missed. I also feel that Tommy John and Canseco should also get in, not only for their stats, but also what they contributed beyond the playing field. Hell, both of their careers got a little extra help. B/c of John and Dr. Frank Jobe, countless of pitchers went on to be come All-Stars and a couple of future HOFers. Canseco, as slimy as he comes off, used what little of the balls he has left to blow the whistle on MLB's steroid problem. Doesn't that carry some merit?

On Canseco, there is a little merit for ratting people out, but then you look at the one-dimensional player he was, capped by the baseball off the head homerun.

It won't be an issue, he got less than 5% of the vote. He won't appear again on the ballot.

During his absolute prime, though, Canseco wasn't one-dimensional. He went 40-40 in 1988. He had speed.

 

[GB-Hack]

It's a bloody shame that Gossage JUST missed. I also feel that Tommy John and Canseco should also get in, not only for their stats, but also what they contributed beyond the playing field. Hell, both of their careers got a little extra help. B/c of John and Dr. Frank Jobe, countless of pitchers went on to be come All-Stars and a couple of future HOFers. Canseco, as slimy as he comes off, used what little of the balls he has left to blow the whistle on MLB's steroid problem. Doesn't that carry some merit?

On Canseco, there is a little merit for ratting people out, but then you look at the one-dimensional player he was, capped by the baseball off the head homerun.

It won't be an issue, he got less than 5% of the vote. He won't appear again on the ballot.

During his absolute prime, though, Canseco wasn't one-dimensional. He went 40-40 in 1988. He had speed.

Yes, but that didn't last long enough before he decided to turn into Gigantor.

 

[PhilaYank36]

It's a bloody shame that Gossage JUST missed. I also feel that Tommy John and Canseco should also get in, not only for their stats, but also what they contributed beyond the playing field. Hell, both of their careers got a little extra help. B/c of John and Dr. Frank Jobe, countless of pitchers went on to be come All-Stars and a couple of future HOFers. Canseco, as slimy as he comes off, used what little of the balls he has left to blow the whistle on MLB's steroid problem. Doesn't that carry some merit?

On Canseco, there is a little merit for ratting people out, but then you look at the one-dimensional player he was, capped by the baseball off the head homerun.

It won't be an issue, he got less than 5% of the vote. He won't appear again on the ballot.

During his absolute prime, though, Canseco wasn't one-dimensional. He went 40-40 in 1988. He had speed.

Plus, he contributed home runs in a multitude of ways: with his bat, on the mound and on the field! What a weapon! As far as being a rat, yeah, no one likes a cheese-eater, but can you come up with another scenario in which either MLB or Congress finally cracks down on steroid usage?

Also, why isn't Tommy John in the Hall? I mean, put his left elbow in at least!

 

[Chef]

Damn......poor Bobby Witt.

I thought he had a chance. [sarcasmfonton]

 

[Smasher_Sloan]

Had Blyleven played in New York, he'd have been a first-ballot person. He should also be in.

Tommy John did play in NY (and LA) and has one more career victory than Blyleven, despite losing a full season to surgery.

So maybe that "didn't play in NY" argument isn't that strong.

 

[X-Hack]

In addition to Gwynn and Ripken, I'd like to see Gossage, Rice, Concepcion and Dawson get in.

How can you possibly vote for Concepcion without voting for the far superior Alan Trammell?

 

[kingcreole]

Had Blyleven played in New York, he'd have been a first-ballot person. He should also be in.

Tommy John did play in NY (and LA) and has one more career victory than Blyleven, despite losing a full season to surgery.

So maybe that "didn't play in NY" argument isn't that strong.

Consider Blyleven's numbers, then consider him in a NY uniform.

The fact that people like Tommy John or "Donny Baseball" get any consideration ... ugh.

 

[Johnny Dangerously]

Canseco was adorable as the little boy in "Sleepless in Seattle."

 

[WSKY]

It's a goddamned shame McGwire didn't make it.

 

[Montezuma's Revenge]

Blyleven's lack of support is a head-scratcher.

His biggest problem is that he wasted his best years pitching for those miserable Twins teams. By the time he got on good teams, he wasn't the same.

He deserves better.

 

[Smasher_Sloan]

Blyleven spent nine full seasons with the Twins. They had winning records in four of those seasons (two first-place finishes), were .500 in two seasons and had losing records in three.

In three of the four winning seasons, someone other than Blyleven led the staff in wins.

With the 1979 WS Pirates, he was fourth in wins. The following year he was five games under .500 for a team that finished four games over.

But he had a lot of strikeouts.

 

[Smasher_Sloan]

Had Blyleven played in New York, he'd have been a first-ballot person. He should also be in.

Tommy John did play in NY (and LA) and has one more career victory than Blyleven, despite losing a full season to surgery.

So maybe that "didn't play in NY" argument isn't that strong.

Consider Blyleven's numbers, then consider him in a NY uniform.

The fact that people like Tommy John or "Donny Baseball" get any consideration ... ugh.

Are you actually saying that Tommy John, with 288 career wins, doesn't even deserve <i>consideration?</i>

 

[buckweaver]

Hell, I'll say it.

Without the surgery, Tommy John's name is less relevant than Old Hoss Radbourne. He was the definition of a journeyman.

No way in hell he should get in to the Hall.

 

[Oz]

Sorry for avoiding this but spnited is right about one thing. I'm sure by posting, someone out there will call me pompous for bragging about having a vote. I don't brag, there's nothing to brag about. But I do have a vote and it went to Ripken, Gwynn and Gossage, who I have supported for as many years as he has been on the ballot. I was very close on Rice but didn't check the box, primarily since I haven't done so for the last dozen years. Sorry.

Casty, no need to apologize for anything. Just always happy to see you add your two cents.

 

[BYH]

Hell, I'll say it.

Without the surgery, Tommy John's name is less relevant than Old Hoss Radbourne. He was the definition of a journeyman.

No way in hell he should get in to the Hall.

Without the surgery? Why not say without the 300-odd wins, Don Sutton woul dbe less relevant than Old Hoss Radbourne and the definition of a journeyman?

When Tommy John dies, the first line in his obit will be about his surgery and how it extended the careers of thousands of pitchers. It defines him. He shouldn't be punished because it gave him the chance to rack up 288 wins.

I don't think John's a HOFer, but he certainly deserves discussion...for both the procedure he inspired and his career.

 

[buckweaver]

I wasn't clear enough.

I meant without his name being attached to the surgery, few know who he is as a pitcher. Being the namesake of the surgery is the reason he's a household name, and still in the discussion. If it was called "elbow ligament replacement surgery" or some such procedural name, Tommy John the pitcher doesn't sniff Cooperstown.

I didn't mean anything about John himself having the surgery. Sorry.

 

[jagtrader]

Blyleven was a good pitcher who accumulated numbers by sticking around a long time. Some folks like those kinds of candidates. Not me. I prefer greatness. Blyleven made two All-Star teams, finished in the Top 5 in the Cy Young voting three times and had an ERA+ of 118. That's not great.

Frankly, he's Don Sutton without the 300 wins. And Sutton shouldn't be in.

 

[BYH]

I wasn't clear enough.

I meant without his name being attached to the surgery, few know who he is as a pitcher. Being the namesake of the surgery is the reason he's a household name, and still in the discussion. If it was called "elbow ligament replacement surgery" or some such procedural name, Tommy John the pitcher doesn't sniff Cooperstown.

I didn't mean anything about John himself having the surgery. Sorry.

Even if the surgery doesn't bear his name he still ends up with 288 wins...worthy of consideration, but ultimately, short of enshrinement.

I do think the surgery makes him a more serious candidate.