WSJ editorial: Boehner and McConnell handing Obama relection

[TigerVols]

Take the name calling to PMs and let's try again.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/21/payroll-tax-cut-boehner-mcconnell_n_1162633.html

 

[YankeeFan]

The GOP finally has some elected officials willing to stand by their guns. The Dems have always had people like this.

As a result, we've gotten the Dems to compromise a number of times, and we've moved the conversation.

Many Republicans truly don't see a downside to not getting some of these deals done. They don't see some government bill as the answer to every problem.

And, unfortunately, that freaks out the GOP establishment as much as it does anyone on the left.

 

[YankeeFan]

It's funny how some people can argue any side of an argument with no shame. (Not you MisterCreosote.)

Is letting a temporary tax break expire a tax increase or not?

And, if the payroll taxes are how we fund Social Security, MediCare, and MediCaid, why isn't it a concern to continue to not fund them?

Aren't we robbing these programs with these "cuts"?

 

[cranberry]

Is letting a temporary tax break expire a tax increase or not?

That's a good question for Grover Norquist, since he's apparently the person who has most tried to redefine the issue in this manner, especially when it's most convenient for the very wealthy.

Unfortunately, we actually need to pay our bills and fix the deficit to get the economy humming again and that will require tax revenue in addition to budget cuts.

At this point, the only group to which I favor cuts or an extension of cuts is the middle class, which has been the engine of growth in our country since WWII, not the "job creators."

I believe the most sensible way to achieve this is to dramatically increase capital gains taxes so that people who make their living as investors pay a similar rate to the rest of us.

 

[Flying Headbutt]

Exactly. You spend years saying you can't let taxes raise on the wealthy (Bush tax cuts, especially) AND THEN you let taxes on the middle class go up, you're nothing but a fraud.

 

[YankeeFan]

You can call it hypocrisy. I'm fine with that.

But, both sides are hypocrites.

And, as for the fine print, it's about the actual votes. If you vote for a tax increase, then you've broken the "Pledge".

If a temporary tax cut expires without a vote, you did not violate the "Pledge".

And, the Republicans were willing to extend the tax cuts. But, in exchange they wanted the "Keystone Pipeline" to be approved.

That put it in Obama's court. What's it worth?

The current GOP House is willing to bargain. They just drive a hard bargain. I'm a fan. It's how I would (and have) negotiated.

 

[cranberry]

You can call it hypocrisy. I'm fine with that.

But, both sides are hypocrites.

And, as for the fine print, it's about the actual votes. If you vote for a tax increase, then you've broken the "Pledge".

If a temporary tax cut expires without a vote, you did not violate the "Pledge".

And, the Republicans were willing to extend the tax cuts. But, in exchange they wanted the "Keystone Pipeline" to be approved.

That put it in Obama's court. What's it worth?

The current GOP House is willing to bargain. They just drive a hard bargain. I'm a fan. It's how I would (and have) negotiated.

As long as Harry Reid doesn't blink and the hostage takers don't get with the program and pass the extension that was overwhelming approved by the Senate in bipartisan fashion, the House GOP will add a nice final chapter for their clownery in this debacle of a Congress and be responsible for taking $1,000 each from hostages middle-class taxpayers.

 

[cranberry]

The Pipeline deal is included in the bill they voted against. Also absent from the bill was the millionaire surcharge they fought hard against.

That's what is so laughable about this. They had an opportunity to declare victory.

 

[YankeeFan]

The Pipeline deal is included in the bill they voted against. Also absent from the bill was the millionaire surcharge they fought hard against.

That's what is so laughable about this. They had an opportunity to declare victory.

Oh, well then that was dumb politically.

 

[Big Circus]

You can call it hypocrisy. I'm fine with that.

But, both sides are hypocrites.

And, as for the fine print, it's about the actual votes. If you vote for a tax increase, then you've broken the "Pledge".

If a temporary tax cut expires without a vote, you did not violate the "Pledge".

And, the Republicans were willing to extend the tax cuts. But, in exchange they wanted the "Keystone Pipeline" to be approved.

That put it in Obama's court. What's it worth?

The current GOP House is willing to bargain. They just drive a hard bargain. I'm a fan. It's how I would (and have) negotiated.

But they've shown on multiple occasions that they won't bargain in good faith. That's different than a tough negotiation.

 

[LongTimeListener]

It sure looks like the Tea Party was all set for a fight, and since two months vs. a year is the ONLY thing left to fight about, that's what they're going to do. And YF, the point is not that this isn't their right to do it, but that people are really noticing this and it is all falling on the GOP. With the big election 11 months away, we're now getting to stuff people are actually going to remember when they fill out the ballot.

From AP yesterday:

However, Boehner and the Republican leadership prevented a direct vote on the Senate's two-month extension, signaling they may lack enough GOP support to defeat it in the face of unrelenting pressure from the White House, Democrats and some Senate Republicans.

It sounds like the plan would pass even in the House, but the squawkers rule the day.

 

[Gehrig]

Isn't this the real article from WSJ?

http://online.wSportsJournalists.com/article/SB10001424052970204791104577110573867064702.html?mod=ITP_opinion_2

 

[Inky_Wretch]

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/charles-krauthammer-the-republicans-have-been-entirely-outplayed-on-payroll-tax-cut/

 

[TheSportsPredictor]

McConnell's only goal -- his and the Republicans ONLY goal -- is to boot Obama for office. Their ONLY goal. **** what's good for America, **** what's good for the American people, **** anything that stands in the way of these assholes and power.

 

[Michael_ Gee]

It's a simple problem. If Boehner compromises to pass ANYTHING Obama wants, the majority of his caucus will kick him out of his job. But this may come to that. Wonder if we'll hear from Romney on this issue? Just kidding. He won't say boo.
TSP, that's the point of this issue. Preventing an extension of the payroll tax cut is apparently HELPING Obama get re-elected, and more to the point for Republican Senators and Reps, helping them get de-elected.

 

[micropolitan guy]

To paraphrase LBJ, if the Republicans have lost Krauthammer on this issue, they've lost America.

 

[TheSportsPredictor]

It's a simple problem. If Boehner compromises to pass ANYTHING Obama wants, the majority of his caucus will kick him out of his job. But this may come to that. Wonder if we'll hear from Romney on this issue? Just kidding. He won't say boo.
TSP, that's the point of this issue. Preventing an extension of the payroll tax cut is apparently HELPING Obama get re-elected, and more to the point for Republican Senators and Reps, helping them get de-elected.

Their way of getting their goal is to obstruct anything Obama wants. Obama wants to give every American a cookie? Can't have a cookie, they are bad.

 

[Bob Cook]

You can call it hypocrisy. I'm fine with that.

But, both sides are hypocrites.

And, as for the fine print, it's about the actual votes. If you vote for a tax increase, then you've broken the "Pledge".

If a temporary tax cut expires without a vote, you did not violate the "Pledge".

And, the Republicans were willing to extend the tax cuts. But, in exchange they wanted the "Keystone Pipeline" to be approved.

That put it in Obama's court. What's it worth?

The current GOP House is willing to bargain. They just drive a hard bargain. I'm a fan. It's how I would (and have) negotiated.

Actually, it's the opposite. The GOP House is NOT willing to bargain. The reason the House **** the bed is because the Tea Party howler monkeys squealed once it appeared Boehner would agree to the two-month extension. They don't want a speaker who can get the best deal possible. They want their way or the highway.

What these idiots don't realize is that not only will their attempts to lard up the payroll tax extension with the Keystone pipeline and other crap cause a backlash, but they are cutting down their negotiating position for extending the Bush tax cuts. After all, how can the House GOP (not that they won't try) with a straight face argue that any tax increase is bad for the economy, and that tax cuts will get us out, and then explain why the wealthiest need their tax breaks when they didn't vote for (or put all sorts of conditions on) a tax break for people who aren't wealthy?

What the Tea Party doesn't get, too, is that the world is moving under its feet. While there certainly is still a feeling that government spending is unsustainable, there is also a feeling that the so-called "job creators" are contributing to the problem, not solving it. Even six months ago, you didn't hear politicians, particularly those from the right, acknowledging income inequality, but you hear it now.

 

[BrianGriffin]

It's a simple problem. If Boehner compromises to pass ANYTHING Obama wants, the majority of his caucus will kick him out of his job. But this may come to that. Wonder if we'll hear from Romney on this issue? Just kidding. He won't say boo.
TSP, that's the point of this issue. Preventing an extension of the payroll tax cut is apparently HELPING Obama get re-elected, and more to the point for Republican Senators and Reps, helping them get de-elected.

Their way of getting their goal is to obstruct anything Obama wants. Obama wants to give every American a cookie? Can't have a cookie, they are bad.

Obama: "These guys oppose everything I do and don't give in. If I wanted to pass a bill giving everybody $1,500, they'd oppose it, they're so stubborn."

Advisor: "Then do it."

 

[Bob Cook]

By the way, those Tea Party seniors screaming about keeping government away from their Medicare are going to scream once their doctor stops taking the plan (or stops taking new patients) because of a 27% pay cut coming Jan. 1 that was supposed to be reversed in the payroll tax bill.

I'm sure that, and the payroll tax itself, will be taken care of (and made retroactive to Jan. 1) when Congress comes back in mid-January. Check that -- I'm not so sure, unless those seniors once waving Tea Party signs now beat their representatives start beating their heads with them when the Congresscritters are home for the holidays.

Unfortunately, where we're going to have more gridlock comes courtesy of those 2010 elections, which allowed Republicans to draw district lines in many states. So if people want to see the worst of the Teahadists out, it's probably going to have to come through a primary, not a general election.