WIN?

[ltrain1127]

I had a copy editor tonight leave a large message on my page, saying "Win is a verb, victory is a noun."
I have tried to argue with him that win is also a noun, as in "Podunk got the 55-39 win by shooting lights out."
Am I wrong or is he being ultra-elitist about the English language. I have cited the two online dictionaries that say win is acceptable as a noun.
Have at it guys (and gals).

 

[The Good Doctor]

I prefer victory and change it when I can. But I won't fight with a writer over it.

 

[imjustagirl]

It's old school, but it's not wrong. Like Doc, I prefer victory, but win's easier in tight spaces. It's one of those words with a meaning that has kind of shifted.

 

[buckweaver]

It's one of those fights that probably aren't worth fighting anymore, since "win" as a noun has become so acceptable to most.

Used to be, your editor was 100 percent correct. There are many editors who still feel that way.

I'm with Doc and IJAG. "Victory" is more acceptable than "win," but I'm not going to blow a gasket over it.

My first ME felt the same way about using "host" as a verb and I inherited it from him. That one, I will blow a gasket over.

 

[forever_town]

If I were a desker, I'd be more inclined to argue about using impact as a verb than I would be about using win as a noun.

 

[Lollygaggers]

Win's fine as a noun. It's a noun in every AP standings for every sport. You don't get Victories and Losses, it's Wins and Losses. It's not your V-L record, it's your W-L record. I like using victory, too, but win is just fine.

 

[Some Guy]

This was a standing rule at our place for a while. I don't neccesarily agree with it, but I got in the habit of using "victory" and never really got out of it.

 

[Some Guy]

Win's fine as a noun. It's a noun in every AP standings for every sport. You don't get Victories and Losses, it's Wins and Losses. It's not your V-L record, it's your W-L record. I like using victory, too, but win is just fine.

Our editor will argue the W and L in your standings page stand for "Won" and "Lost"

 

[buckweaver]

I have cited the two online dictionaries that say win is acceptable as a noun.

Oh, and I don't know about your place of employment, but everywhere I've worked, the only acceptable dictionary after the AP stylebook was Merriam-Webster's New College Dictionary.

Dictionary.com doesn't cut it. (Neither does urbandictionary.com. )

 

[Lollygaggers]

Win's fine as a noun. It's a noun in every AP standings for every sport. You don't get Victories and Losses, it's Wins and Losses. It's not your V-L record, it's your W-L record. I like using victory, too, but win is just fine.

Our editor will argue the W and L in your standings page stand for "Won" and "Lost"

Fair point, can't argue that. I will say that if an editor were adamant about it, it's not worth going to blows over. If it were my shop, though, using win as a noun wouldn't even be on my radar as something to worry about.

 

[zebracoy]

There are a lot of words, I've learned in recent months, that apply in some cases, don't in others, will be used by some people and not used by others.

I've also learned, as a result, that it's not worth arguing over on many occasions - mostly because there never will be any change.

 

[slappy4428]

I'd take it all in context.. "in a 7-6 win" doesn't bother me

 

[pallister]

My first ME felt the same way about using "host" as a verb and I inherited it from him. That one, I will blow a gasket over.

Didn't AP changes its style regarding that a few years back?

 

[Basil Exposition]

Oh, and I don't know about your place of employment, but everywhere I've worked, the only acceptable dictionary after the AP stylebook was Merriam-Webster's New College Dictionary.

Not Webster's New World College Dictionary?

 

[The Good Doctor]

The one thing I will argue for is consistency. If you use win, then use it. Don't go back and forth, and don't allow writers to do it.

 

[pallister]

Just use triumph.

 

[buckweaver]

My first ME felt the same way about using "host" as a verb and I inherited it from him. That one, I will blow a gasket over.

Didn't AP changes its style regarding that a few years back?

Yes, after Webster's changed its definition.

I'm a little hard-line about that one, though.

 

[pallister]

Well, I'm up for a hearty debate, buck. But who will host it?

 

[dooley_womack1]

Win as a noun and host as a verb are fine with me; there are more important things to worry about in copy than that. Heck, I'd even accept "chair" as a verb.

 

[Frank_Ridgeway]

We had a good discussion about this a couple years ago:

http://www.sportsjournalists.com/forum/threads/30953/

As a practical matter, does your paper have a stylebook and is this covered in it? If it is, argument is settled. If it isn't covered, you probably won't change the copy editor's mind, anyway. And it's not like following this "rule" is going to ruin your copy.

There's a guy named Kenn Finkel, referred to in the old thread, who does copy editing seminars. His argument about the dictionary allowing win as a noun (etc.) is the dictionary reflects popular usage, not necessarily correct usage, and that newspapers should have higher standards (haha). Anyway, that's the reasoning from the old school. My feeling is it's like a cop pulling someone over for driving 61 mph in a 55 mph zone -- there are better ways for a copy editor to spend his/her time.