Why photographers aren't writers....

[slappy4428]

Here's an AP cutline sent today and posted by the Freep.... not picking on the Freep. Could have been any paper.
"Former Pittsburgh Steelers running back Jerome Bettis, left, and Tiger Woods embrace on the 18th hole after completing play in the Pro-Am day for the Buick Open golf tournament at Warwick Hills Golf & Country Club in Grand Blanc, Mich., Wednesday. (CARLOS OSORIO/Associated Press)"

Would someone tell me who is on the left and where exactly the embrace is?

 

[SF_Express]

Frankly it looks like they're lining up a putt or whatever.

With AP, you really have to rely on your judgment and not what they write. Simple stuff, like describing somebody as "chipping" out of a bunker, when that's not typically what you do from there. Etc.

 

[slappy4428]

Note: This has been fixed on the home page, to show they are lining up a putt. However, when you click on the link for a larger photo, the original cutline still remains...\


Nice job all around.....

 

[DyePack]

Frankly it looks like they're lining up a putt or whatever.

With AP, you really have to rely on your judgment and not what they write.

Even though newspapers are paying AP to write and send correct material.

This has to be the only product in the United States that's sent broken to the users, who are just expected to fix it.

 

[joe king]

Come on guys, you know what you're getting. Anyone who uses AP cutlines in the paper (or on the web site) deserves what they get. Someone use a fraction of your brain and write your own cutlines. It's pretty freakin' easy. I started at a paper no too long ago and was stunned to watch them just cut and paste AP cutlines onto the page. Even if the information is all correct, surely you can write better cutlines than AP. You can use cutlines to be creative, provide information that's not in the story, have a little fun, etc. Come on guys, just takes a minute to write a cutline.

That is all.

 

[PEteacher]

They don't let photographers write cutlines at my shop. We, the reporters, have to write them, and 99.99% of the times, it's a responsibility we really could do without.

 

[DyePack]

I started at a paper no too long ago and was stunned to watch them just cut and paste AP cutlines onto the page.

That's what happens when newspapers hire people with no initiative. In their mind, cutting and pasting AP cutlines IS the job.

 

[Songbird]

When I've been at dailies I always re-wrote AP cutlines. That's half the fun.

 

[STLIrish]

When I was at a place where I (not the photog) wrote the cutlines, I bitched and moaned and grumbled (well, I wasn't there, I don't know what the picture's of).
Now that I'm at a place where the photogs (not me) write the cutlines, I ***** and moan and grumble ("that's so boring," or "he has no idea what the story's about").
Either way, I guess I can't win.  ;)

 

[SF_Express]

This is a bit odd, considering how long I've been around. But I've never worked at a place where the photographers wrote cutlines -- except in extremely rare circumstances where they participated in the process for some big photo spread or something -- and I've never been at a place that cut-and-pasted AP cutlines. From the under-20,000 place to the million-plus place, the desk always wrote the cutlines. I kind of assumed it was that way everywhere, surprised to find it isn't.

 

[Claws for Concern]

I think a photographer should, for sure at a sporting event, get a copy of the roster and should be able to ID properly every time. It's an example of pure laziness on the photog's part. As for AP, yeah, they aren't known for great cutlines. Ugh.

 

[slappy4428]

This is a bit odd, considering how long I've been around. But I've never worked at a place where the photographers wrote cutlines -- except in extremely rare circumstances where they participated in the process for some big photo spread or something -- and I've never been at a place that cut-and-pasted AP cutlines. From the under-20,000 place to the million-plus place, the desk always wrote the cutlines. I kind of assumed it was that way everywhere, surprised to find it isn't.

Maybe, but AP photographers DO and SHOULD have to write cutlines... they dont have to be perfect, but Jebus,,, they should somewhat accuratly reflect what is going on... chipping out of the bunker is one thing... confusing Tiger Woods with Jerome Bettis and a non-existent arm around the other is another

 

[mose]

It has long since occurred to me that schools that offer photo journalism degrees must put the program under the domain of their vo-tech departments. A lot of award-winning photogs can't spell their own names, let alone write a grammatically correct cutline. I'm guessing most of them took welding as a prerequisite rather than English or history.

Photogs at this shop are responsible for cutlines, which for sports basically means they ID the individuals in the shot. You don't dare depend on them to describe what is going on in the photo -- and you can't with AP shooters, either.

 

[Flip Wilson]

If you want to see many (bad) examples of photographers' writing, go to www.SportsShooter.com and visit the message board. You have to be a member to post but you can browse all you like.

 

[audreyld]

If you want to see many (bad) examples of photographers' writing, go to www.SportsShooter.com and visit the message board. You have to be a member to post but you can browse all you like.

As a ss.com member, I can attest to the poor spelling and grammar there, but would like to at least offer SOME defense for us poor photogs.

I write perfectly good cutlines, on top of writing stories and taking (quite literally) hundreds of photos each week.

I think photographers SHOULD write cutlines. They ought to be able to supply well-written cutlines for all of their photos. To those of you whose photographers don't, all I can say is that I'm sorry. But we're not all like that.

 

[Starman]

Come on guys, you know what you're getting. Anyone who uses AP cutlines in the paper (or on the web site) deserves what they get. Someone use a fraction of your brain and write your own cutlines. It's pretty freakin' easy. I started at a paper no too long ago and was stunned to watch them just cut and paste AP cutlines onto the page. Even if the information is all correct, surely you can write better cutlines than AP. You can use cutlines to be creative, provide information that's not in the story, have a little fun, etc. Come on guys, just takes a minute to write a cutline.

That is all.

****in' bull**** on that. We ain't here "to have a little fun" -- we're here to get the ******* paper out.

AP cutlines should, at the very least, be USABLE -- identify everyone in the photo, first and last name spelled correctly, and a bare-bones description of what is going on in the photo.

It doesn't have to be terrifically descriptive, colorful or exciting, but it should be basically functional. Of course you should take 30 seconds to write a more optimal cutline, but the AP cut should be minimally passable.

While we're at it, is there any particular reason to keep identifying non-USA athletes by nation of residence in AP cutlines? Does anybody really care if Ivan Dunkalotivich is from the Ukraine?

 

[Batman]

Most of the time our photogs don't bother with IDs of a game we're covering. If we're there, we (the reporter) usually has a roster so it's no big deal. It blew me away a couple weeks ago, though, when we shot some stand alone art of a little league game and the photog turned a  picture with no IDs. When asked about it, she said the photo editor had told her not to worry about it because we'd have it.

On a side note, you could make up some fun cutlines for that picture:
Jerome: Geez...I didn't mean to kill this guy. I yelled "Fore!" Didn't he hear me!? DIDN'T HE HEAR ME!?
Tiger: Yep, he's dead all right.

 

[joe king]

Come on guys, you know what you're getting. Anyone who uses AP cutlines in the paper (or on the web site) deserves what they get. Someone use a fraction of your brain and write your own cutlines. It's pretty freakin' easy. I started at a paper no too long ago and was stunned to watch them just cut and paste AP cutlines onto the page. Even if the information is all correct, surely you can write better cutlines than AP. You can use cutlines to be creative, provide information that's not in the story, have a little fun, etc. Come on guys, just takes a minute to write a cutline.

That is all.

****in' bull**** on that.  We ain't here "to have a little fun" -- we're here to get the ******* paper out.

AP cutlines should, at the very least, be USABLE -- identify everyone in the photo, first and last name spelled correctly, and a bare-bones description of what is going on in the photo.

It doesn't have to be terrifically descriptive, colorful or exciting, but it should be basically functional. Of course you should take 30 seconds to write a more optimal cutline, but the AP cut should be minimally passable.

While we're at it, is there any particular reason to keep identifying non-USA athletes by nation of residence in AP cutlines? Does anybody really care if  Ivan Dunkalotivich is from the Ukraine?

Lighten up, Francis.

You can get all the necessary information in there and still say it in an interesting way -- yes, even in a wee little cutline. Sure, you use the AP cutline to get the names and the situation. Then you use your writing skills, such as they are, to do a better job of it.

A cutline doesn't have to be a throwaway. In my copy editing days, I tried to make sure a reader could get something out of it. Perhaps a little tidbit that didn't make it into the story or even (gasp!) a little chuckle.

Actually, you are correct that a cutline must be functional, and no, it doesn't have to be terrifically descriptive, colorful or exciting. But it can be, and if you're not slammed on deadline, why shouldn't it be?

 

[joe king]

****in' bull**** on that.  We ain't here "to have a little fun" -- we're here to get the ******* paper out.

Yeah, God forbid we should try to let our readers (or ourselves) have a little fun. ::)

 

[Bob_Jelloneck]

****in' bull**** on that. We ain't here "to have a little fun" -- we're here to get the ******* paper out.

Yeah, God forbid we should try to let our readers (or ourselves) have a little fun. ::)

NO MORE FUN OF ANY KIND.