'To combat sexual assault, colleges say yes to affirmative consent'

[Dick Whitman]

I'm not sure how an editor allows the following sentence into print. No details about the poll. Reports its finding as fact. Doesn't define "unwanted advances." And what constitutes "widespread"? Who decided that?

As bad as Sabrina Erdely's journalistic malpractice was, this kind of sloppy, biased presentation choice, tucked discreetly into a lengthy piece, also contributes to the serial misinforming of the public.

"Sexual misconduct - including stalking, exploitation and other forms of harassment - is widespread on college campuses. The Association of American Universities recently polled more than 150,000 students at 27 institutions and found that 23.1 percent - nearly 1 in 4 - of undergraduate women and 5.4 percent of men had experienced some kind of unwanted advances."

To combat sexual assault, colleges say yes to affirmative consent

 

[bigpern23]

I'm not sure how an editor allows the following sentence into print. No details about the poll. Reports its finding as fact. Doesn't define "unwanted advances." And what constitutes "widespread"? Who decided that?

As bad as Sabrina Erdely's journalistic malpractice was, this kind of sloppy, biased presentation choice, tucked discreetly into a lengthy piece, also contributes to the serial misinforming of the public.

"Sexual misconduct - including stalking, exploitation and other forms of harassment - is widespread on college campuses. The Association of American Universities recently polled more than 150,000 students at 27 institutions and found that 23.1 percent - nearly 1 in 4 - of undergraduate women and 5.4 percent of men had experienced some kind of unwanted advances."

To combat sexual assault, colleges say yes to affirmative consent

I haven't yet read the piece, but just addressing the sentence you singled out, I agree that "unwanted advances" is far too vague. As for "widespread," the poll finding would support the use of the word.

 

[MisterCreosote]

All those women are lying or too stupid to realize they actually did consent.

Thank god men are getting involved to set the record straight.

 

[Vombatus]

Too vague. Maybe 23.1 percent of campus women are lesbians.

 

[Dick Whitman]

I think there's a kind of arrogance that creeps into journalism: "We cut through the bull****."

You saw it in all the headlines reporting that bacon is "in the same category" of carcinogen "as smoking."

The arrogance actually leads to misinformation, because journalists often think that reporting the nuance in these polls and statistics is just double speak. Simplifying is great. Simplifying something into inaccuracy is not.

It's why Nate Silver was able to step up and kick the **** out of everyone.

 

[MisterCreosote]

 

[Smash Williams]

Lord, do I hate the term mansplaining. As a woman who hates when phrases get unnecessarily gendered to be used as an insult ("You throw like a girl!"), I think perhaps the least useful thing to do is embrace derogatory, gendered phrases aimed at others. It's extra fun when men throw it around as if they expect women not to be able to stand up for themselves if they feel a guy is blowing smoke.

As far as this story, I agree with the premise that polls like this need to be explained more fully, though I do think journalists in general can fall victim to simply parroting study/poll results across all fields without putting in the necessary caveats (a good example from recently is the hot dogs/bacon are carcinogens story without explaining other common things in this class are alcohol, salted fish and medical contraceptives). It's certainly not limited to this field of reporting.

I also think equating sexual harassment to "unwanted advances" is misleading for this particular sentence and doesn't accurately represent the poll itself. Wasn't one of the things that got included as sexual misconduct on this poll actions that occurred without affirmative consent?

 

[da man]

They really blew the lid off nookie.

 

[zagoshe]

"Hey I was wondering if you want to go to the movies tonight?"

"Nope"

UNWANTED ADVANCE!!!!!!

 

[Dick Whitman]

"Hey I was wondering if you want to go to the movies tonight?"

"Nope"

UNWANTED ADVANCE!!!!!!

One of these polls had "unwanted attempted kissing" as a form of sexual assault.

 

[zagoshe]

"I got drunk and had sex. Then I woke up and realized I really didn't want to."

"Well did you say no"

"No, I remember saying yes and taking off my clothes myself, but in retrospect I really didn't want to...."

YOU WERE RAPED!!!

 

[Ace]

One of these polls had "unwanted attempted kissing" as a form of sexual assault.

It certainly would be in certain circumstances.

 

[Big Circus]

One of these polls had "unwanted attempted kissing" as a form of sexual assault.

If you're thinking of the one from the UVA thread, it was "attempted forced kissing," not "unwanted attempted kissing." That's a meaningful distinction.

 

[User 11148]

One of these polls had "unwanted attempted kissing" as a form of sexual assault.

It certainly would be in certain circumstances.

"In a memo that has now been signed by about 70 [American Law Institute] members, ... readers have been asked to consider the following scenario: 'Person A and Person B are on a date and walking down the street. Person A, feeling romantically and sexually attracted, timidly reaches out to hold B’s hand and feels a thrill as their hands touch. Person B does nothing, but six months later files a criminal complaint. Person A is guilty of ‘Criminal Sexual Contact’ under proposed Section 213.6(3)(a).'

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/28/opinion/sunday/judith-shulevitz-regulating-sex.html?_r=0

 

[Ace]

"I got drunk and had sex. Then I woke up and realized I really didn't want to."

"Well did you say no"

"No, I remember saying yes and taking off my clothes myself, but in retrospect I really didn't want to...."

YOU WERE RAPED!!!

I realize you were making a point here. Assuming this scenario is a first-time sexual encounter, would you want your son having sex with a drunk woman he barely knew?

This is a fairly predictable negative outcome and why I have always told my kids to make wise choices.

 

[zagoshe]

Exactly my point - as is usually the case, we have lost our damn minds with way over the top, sweeping laws as opposed to common sense. And we've now changed the definition to the point where a guy trying to hold someone's hand on a date is now viewed in the same light as a guy who actually sexually assaults a woman.

 

[Dick Whitman]

I realize you were making a point here. Assuming this scenario is a first-time sexual encounter, would you want your son having sex with a drunk woman he barely knew?

Not necessarily, although he probably will. I have. It was fun.

And there's a huge difference between it being a less-than-honorable decision - for yourself - and a rape. The fact that we might find it an undesirable course of action doesn't justify criminalizing it.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Study: Casual Sex Only Rewarding For First Few Decades

 

[User 11148]

And there's a huge difference between it being a less-than-honorable decision and a rape.

'Twould be nice if that were so ...

 

[Ace]

Not necessarily, although he probably will. I have. It was fun.

And there's a huge difference between it being a less-than-honorable decision and a rape.

Sure, it's a huge difference. But if the girl later says it was rape, doubt you'd want your son to go through a police investigation, trial, possible jail time and a life of registering as a sexual offender, even though it was fun.