thoughts on writing first book?

[Rookie23]

I'm looking to start writing a book. I want it to be semi-autobiographical and I have a ton of ideas. What is the best way to outline your thoughts before you start? Obviously, this will take time to complete, but it would be great to have a solid structure before I start writing. Any comments are appreciated.

 

[WaylonJennings]

So we're talking a memoir here or a novel? What does "semi-autobiographical" mean?

 

[Rookie23]

I guess it would be more of a memoir...I hope this doesn't sound stupid...but what is the difference between a memoir and a novel?

 

[funky_mountain]

a novel is generally considered fiction and a memoir is generally a true story involving the writer, unless you are james frey, and then all generalities are off.

 

[Mayfly]

I would spend your time making an outline of each year that you can remember in your life, or important moments. A lot of my poetry comes from outlines that I write after having a bad moment. The more you write about your feelings, the easier the pages will come.

 

[Willie-Butch]

People serious and talented enough to write a book probably do not come here for advice. Don't take that the wrong way; I'm not saying you're not talented enough to write a book. I just find it odd that you would come here for advice. I'm guessing most wannabe authors have people around them to answer those questions. As usual, I could be way off in my assumption.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

 

[torrie_wilson]

I'd be interested to hear some responses on this, too. Let's say you've covered a beat for, like, 15 years and you want to write a memoir type book about your experiences, including lots of interesting things you know that never got into print.

What's your first step? (And second and third, for that matter)

 

[WaylonJennings]

I would spend your time making an outline of each year that you can remember in your life, or important moments. A lot of my poetry comes from outlines that I write after having a bad moment. The more you write about your feelings, the easier the pages will come.

I disagree. It's craft, not therapy. This is why most people don't get past the query letter in this genre.

 

[jgmacg]

For anyone with book writing questions - practical or philosophical - we've got a running Authors' Thread on the Writers' Workshop board. Look for it and bump it back up the page. You'll find advice there from a group of experienced book wrestlers. Trust me, they're fantastically happy to take time off from their own deadline miseries to answer your questions.

 

[Mayfly]

I would spend your time making an outline of each year that you can remember in your life, or important moments. A lot of my poetry comes from outlines that I write after having a bad moment. The more you write about your feelings, the easier the pages will come.

I disagree. It's craft, not therapy. This is why most people don't get past the query letter in this genre.

It is a craft, but also it is therapy. Frank McCourt wrote a bunch of his books about the death of his mother, so that obviously hurt him. A lot of great war writers wrote books after they came back from the war and the horrors they have seen. Writing is a way to get thoughts out, and many a time, getting out angry or sad thoughts leads to greater works.

 

[WaylonJennings]

I would spend your time making an outline of each year that you can remember in your life, or important moments. A lot of my poetry comes from outlines that I write after having a bad moment. The more you write about your feelings, the easier the pages will come.

I disagree. It's craft, not therapy. This is why most people don't get past the query letter in this genre.

It is a craft, but also it is therapy. Frank McCourt wrote a bunch of his books about the death of his mother, so that obviously hurt him. A lot of great war writers wrote books after they came back from the war and the horrors they have seen. Writing is a way to get thoughts out, and many a time, getting out angry or sad thoughts leads to greater works.

I guess what I'm saying is that your misery won't carry the day. You have to think about the reader first, yourself second. Otherwise it's JUST therapy.

 

[Smasher_Sloan]

What's your first step?

Find someone who wants to publish it so you can make money from it.

 

[T&C]

If you don't know the difference between a novel and a memoir, you probably aren't ready or qualified to write either one.

 

[KnuteRockne]

What's your first step?

Find someone who wants to publish it so you can make money from it.

Actually for a first-timer, a publisher probably wouldn't even look at it until they had a full manuscript. Then you've got about one page to keep 'em going. And every page after it better keep them going. Or else they'll toss it and not think twice.

You think this is a tough business we're in? This is nothing.

 

[JR]

Actually for a first-timer, a publisher probably wouldn't even look at it until they had a full manuscript. Then you've got about one page to keep 'em going. And every page after it better keep them going. Or else they'll toss it and not think twice.

You think this is a tough business we're in? This is nothing.

Since I'm from that biz, I can tell you categorically that a publisher NEVER wants to see a full ms. at the beginning. What they want to see is a sample of your writing. Most editors can tell after about 500 words whether you've got a book in you.

What you need are two things: an agent and an a proposal/outline

Agents for authors with no experience are as difficult to nail down as a publisher.

The outline is a sales pitch for your book and forces you to think about what your book is about.
It's a cliche but true: if you can't describe your book in 25 words or less, then you don't know have a handle on it.

Lots of sites that explain how you structure an outline. Some authors claim it's harder to write than the book.

Unfortunately, as T&C said, if you don't know the difference between a novel and a memoir, you're probably not ready to write either.

It's an unforgiving biz these days. New books have the shelf life of a loaf of bread.

And unless you're over 50, won the Nobel Prize or screwed Britney Spears, forget about a memoir.

 

[swenk]

Actually for a first-timer, a publisher probably wouldn't even look at it until they had a full manuscript. Then you've got about one page to keep 'em going. And every page after it better keep them going. Or else they'll toss it and not think twice.

You think this is a tough business we're in? This is nothing.

Actually, not necessary for non-fiction. A publisher needs to love the idea, see the size of the market, and read enough of an overview to be confident that the market will buy the book.

Not a small thing, buying a book--sports fans have a lot of other choices. They buy hats and jerseys and expensive tickets; books are expensive and they had better be worth it. Especially when there might be a shelf full of similar books on the same subject.

I've been doing sports books for (too many) years--mainly as an agent--and all I know for sure is that no one knows anything for sure. One publisher pays a half million dollars for a book, it sells 8,000 copies. Another publisher takes a gamble on a first-timer, pays $25k, and it sells millions of books. See Feinstein, John and Smith, Sam.

So what do you do? First, ask yourself, and be honest: is anyone going to be interested enough to buy it? Not, 'well, my barber says it's a great idea,' but really, can you stand in the bookstore or search Amazon, look at the competition, and say, 'There is definite niche here, and I'm going to fill it.'

If you're still encouraged, get yourself an agent. It's a big lie that first time writers can't get agents; ALL agents are looking for great ideas they can sell. I love finding a smart, sharp, talented first-time author--especially when he or she knows the subject better than anyone else out there. A good agent will tell you how to shape your idea, develop a proposal, and tell you the truth.

Your proposal: I've seen hundreds zillions, and I still don't think there's one right way to do them. I like to see a drop-dead opening scene that just grabs you by the throat, and drags you through every page. Think about it as a lengthy magazine piece--you get to the end and you want more. That's how you want a publisher to feel. Crazed for more. Add a chapter outline with some wild anecdotes, and then just pray.

There's some 15% worth of advice, and you got it for free. Hope it helps someone!

 

[JR]

Swenk nailed it.

You've got 15 seconds to grab the reader's attention with a proposal.

No one knows nothing in publishing because it's still a gut-feel based biz.

And there are still things you can't control

A number of years ago I worked for a (Canadian) publishing house and we published George Bell's memoir after his MVP season. We advanced 25,000 copies (the equivalent of 250,000 in the U.S), had a great launch, sold through like crazy for a month and then three weeks before Xmas he got traded to the Cubs.


End of book and a warehouse full of returns.

 

[swenk]

A number of years ago I worked for a (Canadian) publishing house and we published George Bell's memoir after his MVP season. We advanced 25,000 copies (the equivalent of 250,000 in the U.S), had a great launch, sold through like crazy for a month and then three weeks before Xmas he got traded to the Cubs.

End of book and a warehouse full of returns.

It's always the Cubs. My first bestseller came during my rookie year as an editor in Chicago--1984. The book was called 'Cubs Win!', sold 100,000 copies in two days. Until the title became a lie, and that was the end of that.

I did later work with Steve Garvey, and that book didn't sell either, so I guess there was some justice there, but damn. You never forget your first disaster.

I need to go throw up now.

 

[Clever username]

For anyone with book writing questions - practical or philosophical - we've got a running Authors' Thread on the Writers' Workshop board. Look for it and bump it back up the page. You'll find advice there from a group of experienced book wrestlers. Trust me, they're fantastically happy to take time off from their own deadline miseries to answer your questions.

Is there anything on there about screenwriting?

 

[Mayfly]

I would spend your time making an outline of each year that you can remember in your life, or important moments. A lot of my poetry comes from outlines that I write after having a bad moment. The more you write about your feelings, the easier the pages will come.

I disagree. It's craft, not therapy. This is why most people don't get past the query letter in this genre.

It is a craft, but also it is therapy. Frank McCourt wrote a bunch of his books about the death of his mother, so that obviously hurt him. A lot of great war writers wrote books after they came back from the war and the horrors they have seen. Writing is a way to get thoughts out, and many a time, getting out angry or sad thoughts leads to greater works.

I guess what I'm saying is that your misery won't carry the day. You have to think about the reader first, yourself second. Otherwise it's JUST therapy.

Misery won't carry the day. But if you put your misery through the eyes of a character that you build, it becomes that much more powerful.