Talk about your Faustian bargains (pun totally intended)

[Steak Snabler]

The Indians' Fausto Carmona was arrested in the Dominican Republic for using a false identity. Apparently, his name is actually Roberto Hernandez Heredia.

Oh ... and he's 31, not 28.

http://sbn.to/zCq0Lc


To me, this kind of fraud is as bad — if not worse — than using PEDs. I understand why the players do it, but the teams end up getting cheated out of a lot of money on guys that "age" faster than they should.

 

[Versatile]

So, you think cheating billionaires out of a little money is as bad or worse than gaining a competitive advantage through illegal (by both federal law and MLB rules) means?

 

[TheSportsPredictor]

Fausto Carmona anagram = A Scam Afoot, Run.

 

[Steak Snabler]

So, you think cheating billionaires out of a little money is as bad or worse than gaining a competitive advantage through illegal (by both federal law and MLB rules) means?

It's all fraud.

And a "little money" is relative. Carmona signed a $43 million contract before the 2008 season. Would he have gotten that if he'd been known to be 27 (in the middle of his prime) rather than 24 (still on the upswing career-wise)?

 

[Evil Bastard (aka Chris_L)]

Fausto Carmona anagram = A Scam Afoot, Run.

Golf clap

 

[Starman]

Wouldn't identity fraud be grounds to utterly void (as in, 'not another cent') a contract?

If I were the team's lawyers, I'd go on the grounds that we were fraudulently induced to sign a contract with a fictional person 28 years old rather than the real person who is 31. Bang-zoom no more money for you.

 

[sgreenwell]

Wouldn't identity fraud be grounds to utterly void (as in, 'not another cent') a contract?

If I were the team's lawyers, I'd go on the grounds that we were fraudulently induced to sign a contract with a fictional person 28 years old rather than the real person who is 31. Bang-zoom no more money for you.

I think teams have voided contracts for this, yes. Because Carmona is a pitcher, this probably hurts his future value, but he probably would have gotten similar contracts if he was 24 or 27 at his last contract signing.

 

[Steak Snabler]

Carmona's 2008 contract was for four years, with three club options tacked onto the end.

http://blog.cleveland.com/sports/2008/04/cleveland_indians_fausto_carmo.html

Something tells me they'll decline those ...

 

[Versatile]

Carmona's 2008 contract was for four years, with three club options tacked onto the end.

http://blog.cleveland.com/sports/2008/04/cleveland_indians_fausto_carmo.html

Something tells me they'll decline those ...

So they lost no money at all. Even knowing his age, they would have loved to have him for a four-year contract.

 

[cjericho]

How is it that guys are always caught after playing 5 or more years in the majors.

 

[Starman]

Wouldn't identity fraud be grounds to utterly void (as in, 'not another cent') a contract?

If I were the team's lawyers, I'd go on the grounds that we were fraudulently induced to sign a contract with a fictional person 28 years old rather than the real person who is 31. Bang-zoom no more money for you.

I think teams have voided contracts for this, yes. Because Carmona is a pitcher, this probably hurts his future value, but he probably would have gotten similar contracts if he was 24 or 27 at his last contract signing.

I'm sure it's already happening, but this is going to induce teams to go TOTALLY Orly Taitz on anybody they even think about offering a big free-agent contract.

In fact I wouldn't be surprised to see MLB, as in the assembled owners, contract with some kind of deep-black-ops intelligence firms to dig deep into the birth records of players. It's really an issue for ALL the owners since it fundamentally distorts the market value of players by inaccurately depicting them as younger (i.e. more valuable) than they really are.

 

[Football_Bat]

Wouldn't identity fraud be grounds to utterly void (as in, 'not another cent') a contract?

If I were the team's lawyers, I'd go on the grounds that we were fraudulently induced to sign a contract with a fictional person 28 years old rather than the real person who is 31. Bang-zoom no more money for you.

I think teams have voided contracts for this, yes. Because Carmona is a pitcher, this probably hurts his future value, but he probably would have gotten similar contracts if he was 24 or 27 at his last contract signing.

I'm sure it's already happening, but this is going to induce teams to go TOTALLY Orly Taitz on anybody they even think about offering a big free-agent contract.

In fact I wouldn't be surprised to see MLB, as in the assembled owners, contract with some kind of deep-black-ops intelligence firms to dig deep into the birth records of players. It's really an issue for ALL the owners since it fundamentally distorts the market value of players by inaccurately depicting them as younger (i.e. more valuable) than they really are.

A lot of times with Latin players, there are no records to dig deep into. The only birth record in a lot of places is a name and date written in the family Bible, if even that.

Because of that, I'm a little surprised that using a false ID isn't more commonplace. I bet we'll start seeing a rash of these now.

 

[bigpern23]

I still don't think it will be long before we find out Albert Pujols is 35, not 32.

 

[Mystery Meat II]

I still don't think it will be long before we find out Albert Pujols is 35, not 32.

If nothing else, we'll find out in the next three years.

 

[Starman]

I think teams have voided contracts for this, yes. Because Carmona is a pitcher, this probably hurts his future value, but he probably would have gotten similar contracts if he was 24 or 27 at his last contract signing.

No way in hell players with precisely equivalent past performance records have the same value at age 27 vs. 24.

A 24-year-old has 3-5 years of peak performance in front of him. A 27-year-old is going to enter decline phase in the next 2-3 seasons.

 

[Mystery Meat II]

I guess I'd change my name too to make it less obvious I was the love child of Roberto Hernandez and Gil Heredia

 

[sgreenwell]

I think teams have voided contracts for this, yes. Because Carmona is a pitcher, this probably hurts his future value, but he probably would have gotten similar contracts if he was 24 or 27 at his last contract signing.

No way in hell players with precisely equivalent past performance records have the same value at age 27 vs. 24.

A 24-year-old has 3-5 years of peak performance in front of him. A 27-year-old is going to enter decline phase in the next 2-3 seasons.

He's a pitcher. They don't really have a "decline" phase a lot of the times, more like a "I hurt my arm and I'm going to immediately start sucking" phase. For every guy like Livian Hernandez, who puts up cartoonish inning and pitch totals each year, there is a Johan Santana, who just suddenly breaks down after years of good health, or Mark Prior, who broke down despite fairly careful management and very good mechanics.

 

[cjericho]

I think teams have voided contracts for this, yes. Because Carmona is a pitcher, this probably hurts his future value, but he probably would have gotten similar contracts if he was 24 or 27 at his last contract signing.

No way in hell players with precisely equivalent past performance records have the same value at age 27 vs. 24.

A 24-year-old has 3-5 years of peak performance in front of him. A 27-year-old is going to enter decline phase in the next 2-3 seasons.

Most guys at 24 aren't even free agents. Way more guys sign their biggest contract at 27-29.

 

[spikechiquet]

So when does the REAL Fausto Carmona show up for spring training? Can he sue for character assassination?

Actually, the Indians should sue Heredia for impersonating a major league pitcher for the amount of money they have paid on him.

 

[Brian]

So, how the hell is Tom Withers at the AP supposed to refer to this guy now? I hope AP style is to simply put quotation marks around his name for the rest of his career.

Or The Pitcher Formerly Known As Fausto.