Smart Home

[Evil ... Thy name is Orville Redenbacher!!]

We haven't moved back in yet, and they were only installed on Monday, so they're not fully set up. We haven't yet set up the Wi-Fi, which will give us the full functionality.

Yes, they are smart thermostats. Did mean they're just programmable thermostats? The Nest tracks your movement and your habits, so it learns when you are typically away from home or sleeping, turns down the heat automatically during the hours you're gone or snoozing, and it turns the heat back up in anticipation of your return or waking up. I read a report (not sponsored by Nest) that says that only about 6 percent of homeowners actually program their programmable thermostats, so the idea with Nest is that it doesn't require you to program it.

Also, the Wi-Fi capability and the app allow you to control the thermostat from anywhere, so if you're away on vacation but you forgot to turn down the thermostat before you left, you can do it remotely.

We move in next Friday and Nest says it takes about three weeks for it to learn your patterns, so we'll see. Right now, they probably assume we sleep from 3:30 p.m. until 7 a.m., since there's basically no movement in the house during those hours.

Ours are programmed. And they are somewhat efficient. Not so much when we leave the weekend or on vacation (then I just turn them off).
I like the wi-fi app, idea though.

 

[YankeeFan]

Smart bulbs:

Get ready to dust off the old jokes about how many (fill in the blank) people it takes to change a light bulb. I just spent a week changing some of the bulbs in my house, and the complexity was enough to give me a migraine.

Programmable light bulbs — you never knew you needed such things, but maybe you do — are among the latest offerings of a technology industry that wants to fill homes with new Internet-connected appliances. So now the humble bulb of old is no longer a throwaway commodity.

It’s a smartbulb, complete with a computer-chip and wireless technology that connects it to the great hive brain in the sky.

The punch line, I suppose, is that these bulbs are worth considering if you ever fantasized about living in a Jetsons-type household, and if you have enough disposable income to pay the early-adopter tax currently being levied on them. For that price, you’ll enjoy features that may impress your friends, lower your electric bills and possibly even save the life of a loved one. But more on that later.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/22/g...tbulb.html?partner=socialflow&smid=tw-nytimes

 

[SpeedTchr]

Open up another avenue for some 16-year-old hackin' asshat to mess with my life? No thanks! I'll keep the good old dial thermostat and light bulbs that don't bankrupt me if I drop them.

 

[Iron_chet]

We built a new house 18 months ago that is "green". All of the light fixtures except the pot lights have CFL which gives off a light that I do not really like.

We are looking at swapping out with LED bulbs but they were running about 40 bucks a piece if you bought 10, up to 55 if you only bought one. They were supposed to last 20+ years so eventually recoup the cost.

What really appealed to us was that they were completely dimmable and had an enormous color range. Realistically we probably would not have programmed them for different colors but the ability to set precise light is very appealing.

As far as a Nest goes I have heard good reviews. In our case though we have a lot of people living in the house so basically keep the house at the same temperature all the time. Fortunately natural gas is cheap right now.

 

[Dyno]

I don't understand how to buy light bulbs anymore. I stockpiled a bunch of incandescent bulbs and don't know what I'm going to do when I run out. None of the newer ones are as bright as like. Or the lumens aren't high enough. Or something.

 

[93Devil]

Pern, is your power company a cooperative or one of the huge power companies?

I ask because if you are on a cooperative, they are much friendlier with the customer than the big guys.

Try to get a historical usage printout of your home for as long back as they can give you. Then baseline those numbers against what you are currently using.

Then use these or what's available to you...
Rappahannock Electric Cooperative - Residential
http://myrec.apogee.net/comcalc1/specialty/myrec_ServiceSchedAU.aspx

That will give you an accurate picture of what you have invested and what you have saved. If your payback is less than a year, then you are doing very well.

And your investment will be even more valuable if we start to see demand-based residential billing.

Understanding Peak Demand Charges

Light bulbs, HVAC, air leaks and hot water... those are the ones to get under control.

 

[BTExpress]

Wanted to replace our 4 40-watt ceiling fan bulbs with some 60-watt to make reading easier.

All the "efficient" bulbs in the store have some kind of designation like "25 watts of energy = 60 watts of brightness"

Never know whether I can believe these claims or not.

Light bulbs, HVAC, air leaks and hot water... those are the ones to get under control.

I just never thought of light bulbs as making any kind of difference in my electric bill. HVAC, refrigerator, hot water, yes.

 

[Guy_Incognito]

My favorite MIL joke:

MIL comes to visit. While bringing in her bags, says to SIL,
"don't worry, I'm only staying as long as you want me to."
He says,
"you wan't even have a cup of coffee?"

 

[bigpern23]

Pern, is your power company a cooperative or one of the huge power companies?

I ask because if you are on a cooperative, they are much friendlier with the customer than the big guys.

Try to get a historical usage printout of your home for as long back as they can give you. Then baseline those numbers against what you are currently using.

Then use these or what's available to you...
Rappahannock Electric Cooperative - Residential
http://myrec.apogee.net/comcalc1/specialty/myrec_ServiceSchedAU.aspx

That will give you an accurate picture of what you have invested and what you have saved. If your payback is less than a year, then you are doing very well.

And your investment will be even more valuable if we start to see demand-based residential billing.

Understanding Peak Demand Charges

Light bulbs, HVAC, air leaks and hot water... those are the ones to get under control.

Good info, Devil, thanks. Our power company is not a Co-op, but I would think I can get a usage printout for the last three years, which is how long we've been in the house. Do peak demand charges typically apply to residential? I see the example in that link is based on commercial usage.

 

[bigpern23]

Wanted to replace our 4 40-watt ceiling fan bulbs with some 60-watt to make reading easier.

All the "efficient" bulbs in the store have some kind of designation like "25 watts of energy = 60 watts of brightness"

Never know whether I can believe these claims or not.



I just never thought of light bulbs as making any kind of difference in my electric bill. HVAC, refrigerator, hot water, yes.

Using the example I gave earlier of a 60W bulb generating an average annual energy cost of $5.18 vs. $1.87 for the smart bulbs, the savings aren't gigantic, but they're still there.

I need a minimum of 27 bulbs for my home, so my AAEC using the smart bulbs would be approximately $50 per year (a little more than $4 per month), as compared to $140 (about $12 per month) for the 60W bulbs. Total cost on the smart bulbs will be about $400. A Phillips 60W bulb is about $2 per bulb, so $54 total. At a savings of $90 per year, it will take less than three years to recoup the cost of the bulbs.

I like being as efficient as possible and the savings are a little bonus. Plus I like the way you can program and automate them through the app and your smartphone. I'll admit to being a bit wowed by the "cool" factor. I just like this kind of stuff.

On a macro scale, if most Americans used such bulbs, our energy consumption would drop pretty significantly.

 

[bigpern23]

We built a new house 18 months ago that is "green". All of the light fixtures except the pot lights have CFL which gives off a light that I do not really like.

We are looking at swapping out with LED bulbs but they were running about 40 bucks a piece if you bought 10, up to 55 if you only bought one. They were supposed to last 20+ years so eventually recoup the cost.

What really appealed to us was that they were completely dimmable and had an enormous color range. Realistically we probably would not have programmed them for different colors but the ability to set precise light is very appealing.

As far as a Nest goes I have heard good reviews. In our case though we have a lot of people living in the house so basically keep the house at the same temperature all the time. Fortunately natural gas is cheap right now.

I've seen the color changing lights, which are pretty neat, but I don't think I can justify the cost on those. The $15 outlay on the smart bulbs is fine, but when you're getting up into the $40 range, it would probably take 8-10 years to recoup the costs. The smart bulbs are dimmable, which is another nice feature.

On the Nest, I had read really good reviews, which is what prompted us to choose them. Since ordering them, several of our subcontractors have mentioned that they're best smart thermostats available, which kind of confirmed to us that we made a solid choice. The plumber who installed them said he has them in his house and swore by how well they work.

 

[93Devil]

Good info, Devil, thanks. Our power company is not a Co-op, but I would think I can get a usage printout for the last three years, which is how long we've been in the house. Do peak demand charges typically apply to residential? I see the example in that link is based on commercial usage.

I would get as much data as you can. The house is still the house.

Data like that can tell you if the compressor of your HVAC is going or other crap.

I think peak demand is coming eventually to our homes. It's just a matter of time.

The grid can only hold so much, so they are going to make people aware of the peak times through their bills.

30% of a large service utility bill is earned in 15 seconds.

 

[bigpern23]

I would get as much data as you can. The house is still the house.

30% of a large service utility bill is earned in 15 seconds.

Whoa.

Good idea, though, I'll get in touch with the energy company and see where we're at.

 

[93Devil]

I don't want to scare you because right now homes are not on the demand metering (at least in VA they are not), but a decent sized high school will have an electric bill of $24,000 a month. $8,000 of that is earned if they peak demand around 750 KW.

 

[trifectarich]

When my wife and I bought our current house in the fall of '13, we paid $8,000 for solar panels; the solar company guaranteed we wouldn't pay for electricity for 20 years. It's been incredible. The only thing we pay the utility is the $10 monthly charge that everyone gets for the privilege of being one of its customers. But we generate more power than we use, so at the start of the new year, it'll take us five or six months to use up our surplus and for that time period we won't even have the $10 monthly charge, and all the while we'll be generating more surplus. Our roof shingles are black, so the panels blend in nicely. Here in Florida it's not uncommon to have a monthly electric bill of $250-$300 or more for half the year, so we'll make up our initial outlay lickety split.

 

[93Devil]

When my wife and I bought our current house in the fall of '13, we paid $8,000 for solar panels; the solar company guaranteed we wouldn't pay for electricity for 20 years. It's been incredible. The only thing we pay the utility is the $10 monthly charge that everyone gets for the privilege of being one of its customers. But we generate more power than we use, so at the start of the new year, it'll take us five or six months to use up our surplus and for that time period we won't even have the $10 monthly charge, and all the while we'll be generating more surplus. Our roof shingles are black, so the panels blend in nicely. Here in Florida it's not uncommon to have a monthly electric bill of $250-$300 or more for half the year, so we'll make up our initial outlay lickety split.

Wow.

I know the solar technology is moving forward quickly, but this is a hack of an example. You are working on less than a four-year payback for those.

I am helping on a project in another school division when they are looking at putting solar panels on a field house.

At some point on the next 4-5 years, we will have to put a new roof on our home, I wonder if adding solar panels to that job would be the right time?

 

[bigpern23]

When my wife and I bought our current house in the fall of '13, we paid $8,000 for solar panels; the solar company guaranteed we wouldn't pay for electricity for 20 years. It's been incredible. The only thing we pay the utility is the $10 monthly charge that everyone gets for the privilege of being one of its customers. But we generate more power than we use, so at the start of the new year, it'll take us five or six months to use up our surplus and for that time period we won't even have the $10 monthly charge, and all the while we'll be generating more surplus. Our roof shingles are black, so the panels blend in nicely. Here in Florida it's not uncommon to have a monthly electric bill of $250-$300 or more for half the year, so we'll make up our initial outlay lickety split.

That's awesome. I interviewed a coach about eight years ago at his house and it was completely off the grid. He used solar to power the home, had a water reclamation system that gave him potable water from rainfall, and heated his home with a pellet stove. His solar was efficient enough that he was able to sell back electricity to the power company (and, no, I have no idea how that works), so he paid virtually nothing for heat, water and electricity.

 

[User 11148]

When my wife and I bought our current house in the fall of '13, we paid $8,000 for solar panels; the solar company guaranteed we wouldn't pay for electricity for 20 years. It's been incredible. The only thing we pay the utility is the $10 monthly charge that everyone gets for the privilege of being one of its customers. But we generate more power than we use, so at the start of the new year, it'll take us five or six months to use up our surplus and for that time period we won't even have the $10 monthly charge, and all the while we'll be generating more surplus. Our roof shingles are black, so the panels blend in nicely. Here in Florida it's not uncommon to have a monthly electric bill of $250-$300 or more for half the year, so we'll make up our initial outlay lickety split.

I'd be interested in how much electricity your household consumes (in kwh) per month. My household averages about 2,000 kwh, and to get even 75% of our power from solar, we'd need a system that runs around $20,000.

 

[bigpern23]

So far the Nest is working as advertised. Construction is just about complete (installation of the shower door, final cleanup and final inspection are all that's left), so there haven't been many people in the house this week. We've gone in a few times to take pictures and show my in-laws, and each time we walk in, the Nests sense us and immediately raise the target temperature to 63 degrees (from 55). Presumably they're dropping back to 55 when they sense we are gone. Looking forward to getting them hooked up to the Wi-Fi and exploring them more.

 

[BB Bobcat]

We have the Nest thermostats. They are neat gadgets but I'm not sure they really save you much money. Depends how smart you had programmed your old thermostat (assuming it was programmable as almost all of them are).