Should Everyone Be Held Accountable for Libel Laws?

[DanOregon]

With the rise of social media and its potential reach and impact, should individuals that spread false and defaming information be held to the same standards of legacy media?

I'd argue "yes" - particularly if their audience/followers/etc. is of a significant size. 5k, 10, whatever. I'm tired of a lot of internet people reaping all the rewards of spreading false info without being held accountable. Just wondering what other people thought.

 

[Shropshire Slasher]

Public figures have to be pr9ven to show intent of malice, which is an order of magnitude of proof. But yes, social media posters are subject to the same defamation rules as print and TV media entities.

 

[justgladtobehere]

Misinformation isn't necessarily libelous.

 

[Batman]

Absolutely not.
In fact, absolutely ****ing not.
Who gets to decide what is "false" or "misinformation"? What constitutes those things? Does a funny or silly meme, like some of the ones from the White House dust-up with Zelensky, constitute "misinformation" or "false information"?
If you repost something that looks legit, but turns out to be wrong, are you guilty of spreading false information? As a reporter, if you write a story that has a bad typo or needs a correction, can you be sued or put in jail?
This kind of thinking is spreading across Europe right now, and it's beyond terrifying if you give a damn at all about free speech.

 

[Azrael]

Europe

Yes.

Europe.

 

[Deskgrunt50]

No one who voted for trump actually gives a flying **** about free speech, or anything else in the Constitution. Being lectured by a trump voter about free speech is ****ing laughable.

 

[DanielSimpsonDay]

when just asking questions is outlawed only outlaws will just ask questions

 

[2muchcoffeeman]

If you repost something that looks legit, but turns out to be wrong, are you guilty of spreading false information?

Yes.

 

[sgreenwell]

In general, I think it's a bad idea to make libel or slander suits easier to pursue, because what it'll really lead to is more bludgeoning of free speech by any entities with the means to sue. Look at all of the bull**** going on with Trump vs. CBS, Meta and so on. If you lower the bar to pursue a slander or libel case, you will get a lot more entities with deep pockets willing to pursuit lawsuits, and it will paradoxically lead to more misinformation being out there.

 

[Batman]

Yes.

So if you go to the politics thread and repost an Aaron Rupar tweet of a story on the Trump administration that's misleading, slanted or outright false, you're OK with going to jail for it? Or someone suing you for sharing a meme that's funny but obviously untrue?

 

[Deskgrunt50]

So if you go to the politics thread and repost an Aaron Rupar tweet of a story on the Trump administration that's misleading, slanted or outright false, you're OK with going to jail for it? Or someone suing you for sharing a meme that's funny but obviously untrue?

Do you have an iota of self awareness of what you voted for? You’re still a fellow “enemy of the people,” right?

Did the ruthless authoritarian Obama ever throw you in jail for spreading misinformation that he was going to declare martial law to stop trump in 2016?

 

[Batman]

Do you have an iota of self awareness of what you voted for? You’re still a fellow “enemy of the people,” right?

Did the ruthless authoritarian Obama ever throw you in jail for spreading misinformation that he was going to declare martial law to stop trump in 2016?

The question was, should a post like that get someone thrown into jail or sued? It certainly appears that some folks here think it should, without an iota of self awareness that whatever the party in power happens to be at the moment would be the ones deciding what is "true" and what is "false."

 

[Azrael]

NYT v. Sullivan: Will the Landmark Defamation Ruling Survive?

 

[Deskgrunt50]

The question was, should a post like that get someone thrown into jail or sued? It certainly appears that some folks here think it should, without an iota of self awareness that whatever the party in power happens to be at the moment would be the ones deciding what is "true" and what is "false."

I know what the question is. And I think it should be an incredibly high standard to meet. What I'm saying is that you don't actually care about it. As much as you scream and cry about "liberals" you support the people who are actually trying to do it.

 

[dixiehack]

Jesus Christ. I really don’t like the way Batman voted either but 1) he’s actually willing to talk through things unlike a YF-caliber troll or a zombie Facebook meemaw and B) at first glance I agree with him that this is a terrible time to contemplate knocking out even more of the load-bearing walls holding up what’s left of the republic.

 

[FileNotFound]

Jesus Christ. I really don’t like the way Batman voted either but 1) he’s actually willing to talk through things unlike a YF-caliber troll or a zombie Facebook meemaw and B) at first glance I agree with him that this is a terrible time to contemplate knocking out even more of the load-bearing walls holding up what’s left of the republic.

This is spot-on and needs to be amplified. @Batman is a challenge for those of us who want to snap-hate Trump supporters, because I can see from his writing that he -- unlike so many people -- is coming from a place of integrity. I don't agree with his ballot, and I've explained in other posts why it's personal to me. But that doesn't mean that every damn thing he says is wrong. That kind of discourse is straight out of the Trumpublican playbook, and that's a trap into which we must not fall.

 

[Azrael]

I'll take the contra here, sort of.

Is the greatest threat to US libel law some click farmer from Belarus?

Or is it a US president who's been loudly and proudly vocal about "opening up" US libel law almost from the moment he rode down that brass-plated escalator?

https://www.politico.com/blogs/on-media/2016/02/donald-trump-libel-laws-219866

https://legal-forum.uchicago.edu/pr...libel-law-time-fake-news-and-enemies-american

https://legal-forum.uchicago.edu/pr...libel-law-time-fake-news-and-enemies-american

The greatest threat to Sullivan - and to free speech and the press and the 1st Amendment - is Donald Trump.

So I'm not sure 'self-awareness' is the card to play here.

 

[Deskgrunt50]

B) at first glance I agree with him that this is a terrible time to contemplate knocking out even more of the load-bearing walls holding up what’s left of the republic.

This is my issue. I also tend to agree with Batman’s argument. But ending press freedom and libel protection is a stated goal of this administration. So it’s a damn hollow argument coming from anyone who voted for that.

The press under a viscous attack. It’s already dominated by the sycophantic hard-right and dishonest trump-supporting outlets. The biggest social media platforms are owned by trump supporters who amplify his message. And the so-called “liberal” outlets have fallen in line and paid extortion money to trump via frivolous lawsuits they would have easily won.

Anyone can argue anything they want. But don’t wrap yourself in a flag of virtuous ideals when the one action you can take to preserve those things is the direct opposite of what you claim to believe in.

 

[swingline]

No matter what you think of @Batman, he did give us the Vin Scully story, so there’s that.

 

[Deskgrunt50]

I'll take the contra here, sort of.

Is the greatest threat to US libel law some click farmer from Belarus?

Or is it a US president who's been loudly and proudly vocal about "opening up" US libel law almost from the moment he rode down that brass-plated escalator?

https://www.politico.com/blogs/on-media/2016/02/donald-trump-libel-laws-219866

https://legal-forum.uchicago.edu/pr...libel-law-time-fake-news-and-enemies-american

https://legal-forum.uchicago.edu/pr...libel-law-time-fake-news-and-enemies-american

The greatest threat to Sullivan - and to free speech and the press and the 1st Amendment - is Donald Trump.

So I'm not sure 'self-awareness' is the card to play here.

This is far more concise as to what I’m trying to convey.

And on top of trump wanting to end press freedom, he’s also wiping ass with the First Amendment as he threatens to arrest protesters and fire anyone from a government job who doesn’t pledge absolute loyalty.