Jones/ESPNMAG

[JayFarrar]

I love Dave Eggers. Seriously, a man crush.
Odd that you quoted him, it was Eggers that came up with the original design for the ESPN the Magazine. Created the whole thing, all the templates.
I don't think much of what he did is still in use, but still.

This could be an interesting conversation. Is it better to throw stones than to to try to make something better? Is it better to take the gig and make it better or is it better to be the man outside?
But, I suspect, we won't get that.
Instead, it will be some name calling and some other nonsense.
*sigh*

 

[jgmacg]

Before this veers off into something irretrievable, it's worth noting that The Jones still works for Esquire, too.

 

[Cousin Jeffrey]

I think a lot of people have been ripping ESPN The Mag for a long time even though they don't read it, which is a strange way to critically judge something. The feature writing in The Mag, especially by Friend, Keown, Thompson, Wickersham, Bradley, Adelson, Olney has been very good for quite awhile. If you chuck the magazine because you can't get past the Mike and Mike blurbs or the Stu Scott chat in the beginning, you're missing out on a lot of good sports writing.

I rip it because I read it, or try to anyway.

Here's the newest issue I received: It's 80 pages. Nothing worth reading until page 42, a story on the A-11 offense. It's Ok, but for someone who reads a lot of sports it's not very interesting and way late. Then a decent sidebar on what the Steelers D thinks on the offense.

Then a story on Prince George's County and prep basketball. Good idea, good story.

Then some shilling on "why the bowls matter." a few good anecdotes, just two pages though.

A boring q&a with oklahoma star courtney paris

an e60 story on an MMA fighter (not interested, but it looks good)

and then on to the super-useless league by league notes and rick reilly's knee slapper.

that's the issue. i left out all the beginning nonsense for obvious reasons.

ESPN does have great writers working for them, and they put out good stories, but i'm not so sure about the people working behind them (editors off all kinds; seems like some fine-tuning would make the stories and content sing a little better, and the layout is too distracting for most adults)

 

[dooley_womack1]

Allow me to paraphrase noted author Mick Foley:

• 
  
  Focusing your life solely on making a buck shows a poverty of ambition. It asks too little of yourself. And it will leave you unfulfilled.
  
  BARACK OBAMA, speech, Jul. 12, 2006
  
  
  • I like to write.
    
  • I like to write well and have many people read my writing.
    
  • I like to be paid well for doing so.
    

• 
  
  Clever. When you don't have an argument, you quote those who are far more intelligent than you.
  
  There is nothing wrong with being ambitious. Most people are. That said, a person can be ambitious, can want to write the hell out of a story and still be paid for it. That does not make them a sellout, no matter what you say.

And you try and support your position by quoting Mick Foley- wow.

I did not quote him. I paraphrased Mick Foley.

Let me ask you. Have you written a NY Times No. 1 best seller? Because I know I haven't. I'm pretty sure you haven't. But I do know that Mr. Foley has.

The sock puppet ghostwrote it for him.

 

[pseudo]

I love Dave Eggers. Seriously, a man crush.
Odd that you quoted him, it was Eggers that came up with the original design for the ESPN the Magazine. Created the whole thing, all the templates.
I don't think much of what he did is still in use, but still.

This could be an interesting conversation. Is it better to throw stones than to to try to make something better? Is it better to take the gig and make it better or is it better to be the man outside?
But, I suspect, we won't get that.
Instead, it will be some name calling and some other nonsense.
*sigh*

I've never met Jones, much less gotten to know him well enough to consider him a friend. Nevertheless, I share jgmacg's disbelief that anyone could consider CJ "above it all," something I can't say I've seen in his posts here. Maybe that makes me clueless, maybe not. Your call.

But if ESPN wants to give him money to write for them, more power to him. And whether or not he ever had any noble intentions about making the magazine "better," his presence in its pages ensures that.

Just so long as I don't have to read anything by DJ Stu.

 

[Songbird]

Before this veers off into something irretrievable, it's worth noting that The Jones still works for Esquire, too.

Indeed. The Jones is one of my two favorite writers right now. Taibbi is the other.

 

[PeteyPirate]

Before this veers off into something irretrievable, it's worth noting that The Jones still works for Esquire, too.

You mean that counter-culture publication?

 

[93Devil]

I want to re-chime that writing the centerpiece for ESPN in the Outside the Line feature is very freeking impressive journalistically.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=drjandalexandra

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=sandiegohs

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=buffalo58

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=3047543

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=ghanasoccer

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=pata

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/otl/news/story?id=3672808

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=willows

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=phiri

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=bostock

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=cerda

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=wilsonhigh

Do you notice a trend?

 

[shotglass]

As far as the magazine itself goes, I subscribe to 21's theory, that the hip-hop graphics lend themselves to an assumption that the product is shallow.

That said, if they wanted me to write a feature for them, I'd be honored, because I know who has been.

 

[beardpuller]

Why should intelligent readers HAVE to 'get past' the hollas and the insane graphics and the insipid chats and other promotional junk?

Well, that's my point. I get the magazine in the mail only because they force it on you if you subscribe to Insider and I never read it because you get sensory overload trying to find the good stuff through overdone design and filler crap.

And I'd humbly suggest that the TV side has the same problem. The talent is fine but the problem is someone is telling them they have to be gimmicky and snarky and oh-so-clever all of the time.

They've been trying to out-clever one another ever since the Olbermann-Patrick days. Someone mistakenly decided it was more about the catch phrases than good work. That same guy is probably in charge of the magazine's layout and design. That same guy also goes to a lot of meetings where they talk about "capturing" the younger demographic. That same guy is probably a 57-year-old white male who couldn't point out cool if you spotted him Antarctica.

This is very, very well said, Cran. Exactly what I think.

 

[Double Down]

That Eggers thing is the best damn thing I've read this week, and a good reminder to stop being such a damn coward in my own professional life.

 

[Boom_70]

Hey, I'm proud to be out of touch, the same way I'm proud to be an elitist. At least I don't have to step into another ******* Wal-Mart again.

 

[jgmacg]

Hey, I'm proud to be out of touch, the same way I'm proud to be an elitist. At least I don't have to step into another ******* Wal-Mart again.

What. The. ****.

Boom, seriously. What's your point here?

 

[hockeybeat]

Other than he doesn't like Jones?

 

[Inky_Wretch]

And?

 

[Boom_70]

Hey, I'm proud to be out of touch, the same way I'm proud to be an elitist. At least I don't have to step into another ******* Wal-Mart again.

What. The. ****.

Boom, seriously. What's your point here?

You raised the question and I think that quote supports my reasoning as to why it was odd to see Jones show up in ESPN. In a way its kind of the Walmart of Magazines.

 

[hockeybeat]

Has ESPN The Mag put people out of business? Has it intentionally lowered its rates to hurt the competition?

Boom, I think you're very much reaching here.

 

[playthrough]

I think Jones kicked Boom's dog a long time ago.

 

[pseudo]

Hey, I'm proud to be out of touch, the same way I'm proud to be an elitist. At least I don't have to step into another ******* Wal-Mart again.

Lotsa people don't shop in Walmart, Boom.

 

[jgmacg]

I raised what question?

And yes, in 2003 and 2006 when ESPN the Magazine won the National Magazine Award for General Excellence in the 1,000,000 to 2,000,000 circulation category (beating The New Yorker in the process), it was said again and again at the luncheon that it was just...like...Wal-Mart.

Again. What unfunny point are you trying to make here?