Is Lance Armstrong the biggest fraud in the history of sports?

[TigerVols]

To answer my own question, I'd argue yes.

I know naysayers will argue that he was only doing what everyone else was doing...but no one was doing it as much, or demanding others doing it, or, more importantly, crushing the competition while doing it, as Lance was. And that's just on the "field of play." Off the bike, he became an icon, a brand name, and massively wealthy.

And now, it's all come crashing down.

There has never been anyone in sports who achieved bigger heights more fraudulently.

 

[LongTimeListener]

Votes Lance all the way

 

[Dick Whitman]

I think TigerVols is right.

The difference being that Armstrong was universally loved, for the most part. (Save for a few cynics.)

Maybe Tiger Woods?

But I think that infidelity is a completely different ballgame than PED's. Plus, the Tiger infidelity story was a shocker to exactly nobody at this corner of the Internet, right?

What about Kirby Puckett? Still not even close to Armstrong, though.

 

[JC]

I think TigerVols is right.

The difference being that Armstrong was universally loved, for the most part. (Save for a few cynics.)

Maybe Tiger Woods?

But I think that infidelity is a completely different ballgame than PED's. Plus, the Tiger infidelity story was a shocker to exactly nobody at this corner of the Internet, right?

What about Kirby Puckett? Still not even close to Armstrong, though.

Wait til the Tiger PED story comes out.

 

[wicked]

If Lance hadn't been so adamant about not being a doper, the uproar would be far less.

This guy is in the running, too.

 

[Dick Whitman]

I think TigerVols is right.

The difference being that Armstrong was universally loved, for the most part. (Save for a few cynics.)

Maybe Tiger Woods?

But I think that infidelity is a completely different ballgame than PED's. Plus, the Tiger infidelity story was a shocker to exactly nobody at this corner of the Internet, right?

What about Kirby Puckett? Still not even close to Armstrong, though.

Wait til the Tiger PED story comes out.

There would honestly be a not insignificant percentage of the country - a lot of casual type fans - who might never watch another sporting event after that.

 

[Meatie Pie]

 

[JC]

I think TigerVols is right.

The difference being that Armstrong was universally loved, for the most part. (Save for a few cynics.)

Maybe Tiger Woods?

But I think that infidelity is a completely different ballgame than PED's. Plus, the Tiger infidelity story was a shocker to exactly nobody at this corner of the Internet, right?

What about Kirby Puckett? Still not even close to Armstrong, though.

Wait til the Tiger PED story comes out.

There would honestly be a not insignificant percentage of the country - a lot of casual type fans - who might never watch another sporting event after that.

Interesting, I can't see that happening at all. Tiger's Dr has been linked to HGH would you really be surprised if he took something? He might be the most competetive man in sports, if I had to bet on it I would definitely bet he has used. No OOP, I have no proof.

 

[TigerVols]

All of the baseball players noted above were great ballplayers BEFORE they PED'ed out.

Lance was a middle-to-back of the pack cyclist who took cancer-causing PEDS, got cancer, lost 40 pounds as a result, came back while using state of the art PEDs...and suddenly crushed the field in ways no one ever had before.

 

[LongTimeListener]

But he was also a cyclist. We didn't care in 1998 and we again didn't care in 2006.

 

[MileHigh]

Was thinking of this over the weekend and I'm with TigerVols -- yes, he is. Because of what he was off the bike, how he had this great story of beating cancer and winning seven Tours and what an inspiration he was to so many people and how much money he raised -- and it was all built on a lie and that he cheated his way to that "story." And he defended that lie for over a decade no matter how much smoke there was near that fire.

 

[Dick Whitman]

I think TigerVols is right.

The difference being that Armstrong was universally loved, for the most part. (Save for a few cynics.)

Maybe Tiger Woods?

But I think that infidelity is a completely different ballgame than PED's. Plus, the Tiger infidelity story was a shocker to exactly nobody at this corner of the Internet, right?

What about Kirby Puckett? Still not even close to Armstrong, though.

Wait til the Tiger PED story comes out.

There would honestly be a not insignificant percentage of the country - a lot of casual type fans - who might never watch another sporting event after that.

Interesting, I can't see that happening at all. Tiger's Dr has been linked to HGH would you really be surprised if he took something? He might be the most competetive man in sports, if I had to bet on it I would definitely bet he has used. No OOP, I have no proof.

No, I wouldn't be surprised.

But you're talking about a populace that was shocked that a professional athlete cheated on his wife.

I just think a major Woods PED scandal, after people finished blaming "the media," would turn away a large amount of casual sports fans. Essentially - and we already know this is the case, but not everyone does - every major sports accomplishment of the last two decades would feel tainted, or potentially tainted. I think a large, "What's the point?" feeling would set in.

 

[deskslave]

By the time Bonds was breaking the HR records, was there anyone paying even the slightest bit of attention who thought he was really clean?

You'd have to think most everyone thought Armstrong was clean, or they wouldn't all have been buying Livestrong bracelets. I guess it's easy to say now that the entire cycling game was (and is) crooked, but I don't think we had any idea back in about 2002.

 

[93Devil]

Bonds, McGwire, Clemens

This could be a very long list.

 

[YGBFKM]

But he was also a cyclist. We didn't care in 1998 and we again didn't care in 2006.

I think the point is that he transcended cycling. That's what makes his fall so huge. He was an example of all that is great in sports and life. Except he wasn't. I don't see any argument that he is not the biggest fraud in sports history.

 

[TigerVols]

But he was also a cyclist. We didn't care in 1998 and we again didn't care in 2006.

 

[JC]

By the time Bonds was breaking the HR records, was there anyone paying even the slightest bit of attention who thought he was really clean?

You'd have to think most everyone thought Armstrong was clean, or they wouldn't all have been buying Livestrong bracelets. I guess it's easy to say now that the entire cycling game was (and is) crooked, but I don't think we had any idea back in about 2002.

Man people are naive when it comes to PED's. Did people really believe he was clean or just not give a ****? The dirtiest sport in the world and somehow he was dominating it clean.

 

[Dick Whitman]

By the time Bonds was breaking the HR records, was there anyone paying even the slightest bit of attention who thought he was really clean?

You'd have to think most everyone thought Armstrong was clean, or they wouldn't all have been buying Livestrong bracelets. I guess it's easy to say now that the entire cycling game was (and is) crooked, but I don't think we had any idea back in about 2002.

Man people are naive when it comes to PED's. Did people really believe he was clean or just not give a ****? The dirtiest sport in the world and somehow he was dominating it clean.

I honestly think that fanbois in the public thought he was clean. A huge percentage of them honestly and earnestly believe that their heroes aren't just better athletes than us, but that they are the best people among us, too.

 

[YGBFKM]

Not sure they thought he was clean, but once he became more than just an athlete, I think most people wanted him to be clean and kind ignored all evidence to the contrary.

 

[LongTimeListener]

But he was also a cyclist. We didn't care in 1998 and we again didn't care in 2006.

I think the point is that he transcended cycling. That's what makes his fall so huge. He was an example of all that is great in sports and life. Except he wasn't. I don't see any argument that he is not the biggest fraud in sports history.

Yeah, you're probably right. I'll go with it.

I guess it's just a personal bias but I have an especially hard time getting worked up about something I didn't care about before or after. Plus by the end I never thought he was clean anyway so I wasn't exactly fooled.