Hearst papers to use Bleacher Report stories

[blog415]

I do kind of enjoy the fact the example of good writers provided is me....and my husband. Does former BR guy know that? And....do I know him?

I got a Facebook message from someone demanding to know why I don't like BR. It's not that I don't like it: I'm all for fans having a voice. If they want to write for free, fine, like ex-BR guy says, no one is making them.

I do have concerns when it's on the site that my newspaper is also on and presented as if it is comparable material. It is not. And when there are instances of plagiarism and inaccuracy, I'm doubly concerned.

I wouldn't be so bugged if it was on our site and clearly labeled to indicate that it is free content provided by fans, and if it was distinctly separate from Chronicle content. Right now, there is too little to indicate that it's a wildly different product. There's no reason it shouldn't have a niche.....but mingled right in with professional journalists? No.

No it is not a coincidence that I mentioned you and Dan Brown as well. Your husband came to mind as I started typing out my reply on this forum. I liked his article on the 49ers today. The Merc is a good paper.

I don't think most know that BR is a wholly different product than SFGate.com. Some other friends of mine didn't know until I had to mention it to them and explain the whole BR angle and how I even had my articles on there.

Professional journalists are not perfect either and I have seen many inaccurate articles, plagarism, and the like as well from these "professional" journalists but let's not get off the topic at hand here.

I don't think BR should be lumped in with the paid sportswriters on sfgate.com or any other paper for that matter. The real winners of this is BR and the losers are the writers who write for free and the paid journalists who have to be lumped in with the amateurs.

Are your fellow writers at the Chron as dismayed as you are? I would assume so if they knew about BR. Any chance you guys can talk to the sports editor about this situation? Good luck. I know it is very frustrating for a lot of folks.

 

[GB-Hack]

I do kind of enjoy the fact the example of good writers provided is me....and my husband. Does former BR guy know that? And....do I know him?

I got a Facebook message from someone demanding to know why I don't like BR. It's not that I don't like it: I'm all for fans having a voice. If they want to write for free, fine, like ex-BR guy says, no one is making them.

I do have concerns when it's on the site that my newspaper is also on and presented as if it is comparable material. It is not. And when there are instances of plagiarism and inaccuracy, I'm doubly concerned.

I wouldn't be so bugged if it was on our site and clearly labeled to indicate that it is free content provided by fans, and if it was distinctly separate from Chronicle content. Right now, there is too little to indicate that it's a wildly different product. There's no reason it shouldn't have a niche.....but mingled right in with professional journalists? No.

No it is not a coincidence that I mentioned you and Dan Brown as well. Your husband came to mind as I started typing out my reply on this forum. I liked his article on the 49ers today. The Merc is a good paper.

I don't think most know that BR is a wholly different product than SFGate.com. Some other friends of mine didn't know until I had to mention it to them and explain the whole BR angle and how I even had my articles on there.

Professional journalists are not perfect either and I have seen many inaccurate articles, plagarism, and the like as well from these "professional" journalists but let's not get off the topic at hand here.

And how do BR writers get punished when they do this? Because I know how I'd be dealt with if I did it for my paper.

 

[Susan Slusser]

These decisions aren't made at the sports editor level, I think they're straight from the corporation. You can safely assume any sports editor wouldn't be in favor of this intermingling of their staff's product and free content from fans.

GB-Hack is right: Plagiarism gets you fired, pronto, and repeated inaccuracies will do the trick, too. I worked at a newspaper where I saw the first happen twice and the second happen at least once with a full-time staffer - and numerous times with part-timers. You don't get, or keep, fulltime newspaper jobs if you can't get the facts right.

 

[blog415]

I do kind of enjoy the fact the example of good writers provided is me....and my husband. Does former BR guy know that? And....do I know him?

I got a Facebook message from someone demanding to know why I don't like BR. It's not that I don't like it: I'm all for fans having a voice. If they want to write for free, fine, like ex-BR guy says, no one is making them.

I do have concerns when it's on the site that my newspaper is also on and presented as if it is comparable material. It is not. And when there are instances of plagiarism and inaccuracy, I'm doubly concerned.

I wouldn't be so bugged if it was on our site and clearly labeled to indicate that it is free content provided by fans, and if it was distinctly separate from Chronicle content. Right now, there is too little to indicate that it's a wildly different product. There's no reason it shouldn't have a niche.....but mingled right in with professional journalists? No.

No it is not a coincidence that I mentioned you and Dan Brown as well. Your husband came to mind as I started typing out my reply on this forum. I liked his article on the 49ers today. The Merc is a good paper.

I don't think most know that BR is a wholly different product than SFGate.com. Some other friends of mine didn't know until I had to mention it to them and explain the whole BR angle and how I even had my articles on there.

Professional journalists are not perfect either and I have seen many inaccurate articles, plagarism, and the like as well from these "professional" journalists but let's not get off the topic at hand here.

And how do BR writers get punished when they do this? Because I know how I'd be dealt with if I did it for my paper.

BR writers will have their article deleted or edited by an editor intern. If they do it consistently I guess they could get banned but since they are not employees of BR, they can't be fired or anything since they aren't getting paid anyways. It just hurts the rep of BR I guess.

 

[SoCalString]

The aforementioned editing "interns" I feel is a crock. I'm always seeing these internships listed on JournalismJobs.com but is there college credit available for them? Is there any professional guidance, as would be customary for a genuine internship? I feel the intern title is the lipstick on the proverbial pig that is BR.com giving copy editors work but no pay.

 

[SixToe]

what do u mean I can't? I sure can. Can u?

Yeah, most definitely I can. I have, and still do.

When you have 20 or more years in the business and see your profession's standards lowered and demeaned, and assisted by your own managers who want "hits" for some beancounter, you may be able to as well.

 

[Moondoggy]

Kill me now.

 

[blog415]

what do u mean I can't? I sure can. Can u?

Yeah, most definitely I can. I have, and still do.

When you have 20 or more years in the business and see your profession's standards lowered and demeaned, and assisted by your own managers who want "hits" for some beancounter, you may be able to as well.

Sorry to hear. I understand the frustrations of both sides and i agree and disagree with both parties.

A lot of the problems have to do with the downturn of the economy and as well as the newspaper publishing companies making mistakes as well as the lazy journalism by a lot of "journalists." There are good and bad guys in every story. The fact of the matter is that in 2010, the game has changed.

 

[Johnny Dangerously]

And not for the better.

 

[nate41]

The aforementioned editing "interns" I feel is a crock. I'm always seeing these internships listed on JournalismJobs.com but is there college credit available for them? Is there any professional guidance, as would be customary for a genuine internship? I feel the intern title is the lipstick on the proverbial pig that is BR.com giving copy editors work but no pay.

They are. I did a few years ago it for a bit to try to get exposure, but quickly realized it was a waste of time.

 

[HanSenSE]

what do u mean I can't? I sure can. Can u?

Yeah, most definitely I can. I have, and still do.

When you have 20 or more years in the business and see your profession's standards lowered and demeaned, and assisted by your own managers who want "hits" for some beancounter, you may be able to as well.

Sorry to hear. I understand the frustrations of both sides and i agree and disagree with both parties.

A lot of the problems have to do with the downturn of the economy and as well as the newspaper publishing companies making mistakes as well as the lazy journalism by a lot of "journalists." There are good and bad guys in every story. The fact of the matter is that in 2010, the game has changed.

No, game has not changed. Plagarism is still plagarism. Not acceptable. Should be punishable by hanging over superheated oil, just in case the knot breaks. Or is there a part of plagarism is bad that you don't understand?

 

[SixToe]

I understand the frustrations of both sides

Tell us how you understand the frustrations and angst of dedicated, veteran journalists with decades of experience who see their work stolen and reprinted elsewhere, promoted by their own managers on their own sites and then told "Deal with it. This allows fans to 'participate in the conversation' while pumping our numbers!"

Tell us how a veteran journalist should react when they see their work plagiarized but are told by the new generation of 'writers' that it's a new era? That it's just "sharing" and to accept it?

Tell us why we shouldn't rattle sabers and wield the mace against the wannabe fanboi generation who is allowed in pressboxes or on sidelines like ESPN "The Mag" did last football season. Regina the Reporter wasn't as nervous when she lost her virginity as she was 'interviewing' a player! Johnny the Journo got to meet one of his football idols on the sideline and then got brushed off! Remarkable! How or why the pro leagues and colleges allowed this was yet another stab in the ribs of the legitimate media.

And yet people say "We understand." Bull****.

 

[MileHigh]

I do have concerns when it's on the site that my newspaper is also on and presented as if it is comparable material. It is not. And when there are instances of plagiarism and inaccuracy, I'm doubly concerned.

This. And it's mind-boggling for higher-ups at a company at Hearst to accept this stuff. Because as also mentioned, no respected SE would allow it.

 

[blog415]

I understand the frustrations of both sides

Tell us how you understand the frustrations and angst of dedicated, veteran journalists with decades of experience who see their work stolen and reprinted elsewhere, promoted by their own managers on their own sites and then told "Deal with it. This allows fans to 'participate in the conversation' while pumping our numbers!"

Tell us how a veteran journalist should react when they see their work plagiarized but are told by the new generation of 'writers' that it's a new era? That it's just "sharing" and to accept it?

Tell us why we shouldn't rattle sabers and wield the mace against the wannabe fanboi generation who is allowed in pressboxes or on sidelines like ESPN "The Mag" did last football season. Regina the Reporter wasn't as nervous when she lost her virginity as she was 'interviewing' a player! Johnny the Journo got to meet one of his football idols on the sideline and then got brushed off! Remarkable! How or why the pro leagues and colleges allowed this was yet another stab in the ribs of the legitimate media.

And yet people say "We understand." Bull****.

Calm down sir. Veteran jouranlist or reporter just means that you are old. Senior reporter etc etc. It doesn't mean anything to the fans.

I found nothing wrong with ESPN the Mag doing that. It gave the fans a new perspective and promoted the college and pro teams so why wouldn't the media relations people allow it for a game? It's not like they got credentials for the whole season!

The veteran journalists are frustrated but let's realize that everyone is out to pay the mortgage and competition is at all time high.

You are lucky you still have a job in this industry considering how a lot of papers and websites have closed down such as the Rocky in Denver and the Seattle Post Inteligencer.

 

[Ace]

I understand the frustrations of both sides

Tell us how you understand the frustrations and angst of dedicated, veteran journalists with decades of experience who see their work stolen and reprinted elsewhere, promoted by their own managers on their own sites and then told "Deal with it. This allows fans to 'participate in the conversation' while pumping our numbers!"

Tell us how a veteran journalist should react when they see their work plagiarized but are told by the new generation of 'writers' that it's a new era? That it's just "sharing" and to accept it?

Tell us why we shouldn't rattle sabers and wield the mace against the wannabe fanboi generation who is allowed in pressboxes or on sidelines like ESPN "The Mag" did last football season. Regina the Reporter wasn't as nervous when she lost her virginity as she was 'interviewing' a player! Johnny the Journo got to meet one of his football idols on the sideline and then got brushed off! Remarkable! How or why the pro leagues and colleges allowed this was yet another stab in the ribs of the legitimate media.

And yet people say "We understand." Bull****.

Calm down sir. Veteran jouranlist or reporter just means that you are old. Senior reporter etc etc. It doesn't mean anything to the fans.

I found nothing wrong with ESPN the Mag doing that. It gave the fans a new perspective and promoted the college and pro teams so why wouldn't the media relations people allow it for a game? It's not like they got credentials for the whole season!

The veteran journalists are frustrated but let's realize that everyone is out to pay the mortgage and competition is at all time high.

You are lucky you still have a job in this industry considering how a lot of papers and websites have closed down such as the Rocky in Denver and the Seattle Post Inteligencer.

I am out to pay the mortgage by writing for free for Bleacher Report!

 

[GB-Hack]

I understand the frustrations of both sides

Tell us how you understand the frustrations and angst of dedicated, veteran journalists with decades of experience who see their work stolen and reprinted elsewhere, promoted by their own managers on their own sites and then told "Deal with it. This allows fans to 'participate in the conversation' while pumping our numbers!"

Tell us how a veteran journalist should react when they see their work plagiarized but are told by the new generation of 'writers' that it's a new era? That it's just "sharing" and to accept it?

Tell us why we shouldn't rattle sabers and wield the mace against the wannabe fanboi generation who is allowed in pressboxes or on sidelines like ESPN "The Mag" did last football season. Regina the Reporter wasn't as nervous when she lost her virginity as she was 'interviewing' a player! Johnny the Journo got to meet one of his football idols on the sideline and then got brushed off! Remarkable! How or why the pro leagues and colleges allowed this was yet another stab in the ribs of the legitimate media.

And yet people say "We understand." Bull****.

Calm down sir. Veteran jouranlist or reporter just means that you are old. Senior reporter etc etc. It doesn't mean anything to the fans.

I found nothing wrong with ESPN the Mag doing that. It gave the fans a new perspective and promoted the college and pro teams so why wouldn't the media relations people allow it for a game? It's not like they got credentials for the whole season!

The veteran journalists are frustrated but let's realize that everyone is out to pay the mortgage and competition is at all time high.

You are lucky you still have a job in this industry considering how a lot of papers and websites have closed down such as the Rocky in Denver and the Seattle Post Inteligencer.

1. Learn to use the quote function.

2. Stop being an ass telling us we should feel lucky to have jobs. We have jobs because we are good at what we do. If we weren't, people wouldn't be plagiarizing us and calling our work their own.

 

[SoCalString]

Calm down sir. Veteran jouranlist or reporter just means that you are old. Senior reporter etc etc. It doesn't mean anything to the fans.

Terrible. "Veteran" means old is asinine, veteran means seasoned. It means you've got experience and know what you're doing. It helps the more of that experience you have, sure, but I've seen late 20-somethings who were damned fine vets. I doubt it means nothing "to the fans" because I'd be willing to bet my bottom dollar the fans are more interested in reading what the "old" veteran who has been through the grind has to write than what a blogger is writing from his house. And without the old veteran doing the legwork those fans have NOTHING to care about, because the blogger has nothing to regurgitate (or steal, in some instances).

I found nothing wrong with ESPN the Mag doing that. It gave the fans a new perspective and promoted the college and pro teams so why wouldn't the media relations people allow it for a game? It's not like they got credentials for the whole season!

Of course you found nothing wrong with it, you've been an advocate of this. Just another example of the Worldwide Leader's Wal Mart-ization of sports journalism, as an unsettling chunk of that fan perspective was chastising sports writers for not being starry eyed and googly. If you're "more nervous interviewing an athlete than when I lost my virginity!" you don't belong in the clubhouse post-game. Sorry.

The veteran journalists are frustrated but let's realize that everyone is out to pay the mortgage and competition is at all time high.

And for penny pinching corporate guys, that "competition" as you put it, meaning untrained, non-professionals willing to work for free means those who are skilled, are trained, do have access CAN'T pay the mortgage because it's better for the bottom line to take free work.

You are lucky you still have a job in this industry considering how a lot of papers and websites have closed down such as the Rocky in Denver and the Seattle Post Inteligencer.

Condescending garbage to tell someone they're lucky to still have a job. A lot of people around here have seen an industry they believed in ravaged and they're just supposed to be happy because they still have a job? It's OK that Fanboy No. 414 stole the content it took time and effort to craft because I still have my paycheck - a paycheck that's been the same since 2005 because of raise freezes.

 

[Babs]

We have jobs because we are good at what we do. If we weren't, people wouldn't be plagiarizing us and calling our work their own.

When I get plagiarized, which happens (sadly) about four or five times a year, my significant other says to me, "at least you wrote something good enough that people want to steal."

This makes me more angry. I want to stop writing altogether because there is no value placed on it anymore.

There is really really good writing being done, and some horrible stuff too, but the reader can't seem to tell the difference and no one is helping them sort it out. It's all just words, many of them stolen.

 

[cjericho]

And now I present an actual snippet from an actual BR story:

"Judging by the silence in Vancouver . . . (you can here a rat **** on cotton) . . . everything is peachy-keen n' swell in the minds of the winter Olympic athletes."

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/351501-1968-olympics-2010-olympicsnothing-to-be-angry-about

If you're not offended by the reference to excretory activities, you should at least be bugged by the writer's inability to distinguish "hear" from "here."

One of the problems with the site is its sheer volume of copy; this volume is apparently so immense that it precludes even cursory editing.

i can't believe the "editorial interns" have not learned the difference between hear and here. complete shocker.

 

[WriteThinking]

Calm down sir. Veteran jouranlist or reporter just means that you are old. Senior reporter etc etc. It doesn't mean anything to the fans.

I found nothing wrong with ESPN the Mag doing that. It gave the fans a new perspective and promoted the college and pro teams so why wouldn't the media relations people allow it for a game? It's not like they got credentials for the whole season!

The veteran journalists are frustrated but let's realize that everyone is out to pay the mortgage and competition is at all time high.

You are lucky you still have a job in this industry considering how a lot of papers and websites have closed down such as the Rocky in Denver and the Seattle Post-Intelligencer.

blog415,

See this at the end of something you quote? [/quote]

You must leave it there in order for that post to be quoted, and for your ensuing response to not be quoted.

Now, the real reason for my post:

Part of the reason many who used to be in the business no longer are is not really because of the closures of papers like the Rocky Mountain News and the Seattle Post-Intelligencer.

It is because of guys like you.

And, considering your presence in the industry, people who still have paying jobs are lucky to still be working.

Now do you understand our anger and angst?