Damn you, 2017!

[Buck]

Charlie Manson could be our first celebrity victim of this cruel year:
Charles Manson hospitalized for a serious illness, sources say

 

[Riptide]

Celebrity? No.
Notorious psycho? Sure.

 

[Ace]

Some Manson tidbits:

* He studied Dale Carnegie methods to get people to do what he watned.

* He and his "girls" shacked up at Beach Boy Dennis Wilson's beach house for a while.

* He was trying to get Terry Melcher, a producer and son of Doris Day, to make him a rock star. Melcher lived with Candice Bergen. When Melcher didn't come through, Manson sent his disciples to the house, only they had moved out and rented it to Roman Polanski and wife Sharon Tate.

If 2017 is a bad year for crazy killers, I can live with that.

 

[Buck]

Celebrity? No.
Notorious psycho? Sure.

I'd say in modern times celebrity and notoriety are the same.

 

[Riptide]

I'd say in modern times celebrity and notoriety are the same.

Our notorious psycho celebrity president-elect agrees!

 

[BTExpress]

* He was trying to get Terry Melcher, a producer and son of Doris Day, to make him a rock star. Melcher lived with Candice Bergen. When Melcher didn't come through, Manson sent his disciples to the house, only they had moved out and rented it to Roman Polanski and wife Sharon Tate.

House was actually owned by talent manager Rudy Altobelli, who bought it for $86,000 (!!!!) in the early 60s and often rented it out. Melcher was just one of his earlier tenants before Polanski. It was Cary Grant and Dyan Cannon's honeymoon nest in 1965.

 

[YankeeFan]

If 2017 is a bad year for crazy killers, I can live with that.

Maybe this left wing hero, and cop killer, can join him:

 

[YankeeFan]

I do have sad news to share though:

 

[Riptide]

I do have sad news to share though:

Clintons strike again! You're on it, right?

 

[BTExpress]

Come on, she just walked away and got lost. At 105, obvious case of dementia.

 

[Gator]

We were talking about Manson in the office last night. I didn't know much about it until reading the AP story, but he is viewed as the most vile human in history next to Hitler, and yet he is only tied to a handful of murders. What the Newtown shooter (or any of the other dozen mass shooters in recent history) did, in my opinion, is far more severe. Sign of the times, I suppose.

 

[Buck]

It was the sensational way in which the crimes and case were covered.
More people know about the OJ murders than Joel Rifken.

 

[bigpern23]

We were talking about Manson in the office last night. I didn't know much about it until reading the AP story, but he is viewed as the most vile human in history next to Hitler, and yet he is only tied to a handful of murders. What the Newtown shooter (or any of the other dozen mass shooters in recent history) did, in my opinion, is far more severe. Sign of the times, I suppose.

He also talked - a lot - about what he did and what he wanted to do. I can remember 60 Minutes interviews with him from prison and stuff like that, with his swastika tattoo on his forehead and the utter lunacy that was spewing from his mouth.

All I know about James Holmes is that he had crazy eyes, bad hair and thought he was the Joker.

 

[Steak Snabler]

House was actually owned by talent manager Rudy Altobelli, who bought it for $86,000 (!!!!) in the early 60s and often rented it out. Melcher was just one of his earlier tenants before Polanski. It was Cary Grant and Dyan Cannon's honeymoon nest in 1965.

One of the Manson girls, Patricia Krenwinkel, was arrested about 10 miles from where I currently live. She had fled down this way to stay with her aunt after the murders.

 

[Gator]

He also talked - a lot - about what he did and what he wanted to do. I can remember 60 Minutes interviews with him from prison and stuff like that, with his swastika tattoo on his forehead and the utter lunacy that was spewing from his mouth.

All I know about James Holmes is that he had crazy eyes, bad hair and thought he was the Joker.

I think the common thread is mental illness, no matter how it manifests itself. But the name James Holmes (hell, I had forgotten it until you just wrote it) will be lost in the scope of history, while Charles Manson in unforgettable. Perhaps we've desensitized ourselves in this day and age.

 

[Ace]

We were talking about Manson in the office last night. I didn't know much about it until reading the AP story, but he is viewed as the most vile human in history next to Hitler, and yet he is only tied to a handful of murders. What the Newtown shooter (or any of the other dozen mass shooters in recent history) did, in my opinion, is far more severe. Sign of the times, I suppose.

I think what was scary about Manson is that he was able to work send his cult-like followers after people. So he represented a bigger threat.

Plus he (or his followers) killed rich, famous, good-looking people.

 

[bigpern23]

I think the common thread is mental illness, no matter how it manifests itself. But the name James Holmes (hell, I had forgotten it until you just wrote it) will be lost in the scope of history, while Charles Manson in unforgettable. Perhaps we've desensitized ourselves in this day and age.

I think it is less about desensitization, although that is probably a part of it, and more to do with the platforms Manson had to get his message out to the public. I'm struggling to think of any other mass murderer who has been given so many opportunities to speak publicly about what he did or wanted to do.

The guy released an album, had his songs recorded by Guns N Roses and Marilyn Manson (when he mattered), had films made about him, a book written about him ... he was a bona fide cultural phenomenon.

 

[Dyno]

My friend's older sister had a paperback copy of Helter Skelter. Whenever I'd go to their house and saw the book lying around, I'd page through it and by the time I was 10 or so, I finished reading it. Somehow it didn't give me nightmares, but I developed a fascination with true crime books that's lasted for 30+ years. I recommend the bio of Manson that came out a few years ago. He's a disgusting little (5'2" or 5'3") man.

 

[Captain_Kirk]

I think what was scary about Manson is that he was able to work send his cult-like followers after people. So he represented a bigger threat.

Plus he (or his followers) killed rich, famous, good-looking people.

Definitely the Hollywood celebrity angle gave it a kick start.

Plus, the crimes went unsolved for several months, which probably added to the intrigue, and certainly made people in the So Cal area a little nervous at home at night. Newtown, Aurora, Orlando--we know the killer's bio and history almost as soon as we're reading the story today. Would create more suspense and string out the storyline if one of these mass murderer types were able to go on the run for a period of time before being caught.

Then, when they were caught, you had the whole hippie, commune, free love scenario that the 'establishment' didn't understand, couldn't comprehend as a way of life and were just really being to learn about in popular society in the late 60s.

Top that off with the crazy behavior at the trial of Charles and the girls (forehead swatiskas, singing/chanting, verbal outbursts) and you definitely had a number of contributors to why these folks may have left a more lasting impression on America than a one and done today with an assault rifle.

 

[Donny in his element]

I do have sad news to share though:

Probably was hoping to be another of Pan Pan's conquests. With him gone, what's the point?

*Reading from a Nicholas Sparks manuscript*

Oh, and /crossyear /crossthread