Yet another football stat question

[bigpern23]

Does spiking the ball to kill the clock count against the QB as an incompletion?

 

[sportshack06]

Factors into the TEAM Stats

Same thing for a QB Kneel

 

[spnited]

Why was the spike rule even put in? Why is intentional grounding OK at some times but not at others?
Might be the dumbest rule in all of sports, dumber even than the "breaking the plane" bull****.

 

[wickedwritah]

Really, sportshack?

I always counted them as individual rushes and individual incompletions.

 

[93Devil]

Ditto.

I would even give it a -1 in yardage.

 

[wickedwritah]

Ditto.

I would even give it a -1 in yardage.

I always go on where the ball is spotted -- or, if it's the last play of the period/game, where the referee stands at the end of the play (which would be the spot).

 

[93Devil]

When I used to keep the HS stats, the knee was usually happening at a time when I was trying to compile other stats. I just gave the -1 because the old deadline clock was starting to tick.

 

[bigpern23]

Ditto.

I would even give it a -1 in yardage.

Why? They don't lose a yard on a spike. It's just an incompletion.

My feeling is that hack would be correct that it should be factored into team stats, not individual because you'd be penalizing the individual for a play that works exactly as designed and helps the team.

As for Spnited's comment, he's right on. It makes no sense that it is OK in that situation.


EDIT: I now see that 93Devil meant on a kneel, not a spike.

 

[Hank_Scorpio]

A kneeldown is definitely a team rush with the negative yardage credited to the team. That's why you see this in the rushing category: Team 1-(minus-5).


I always did a spike as an incompletion to the QB, tho. (Maybe I'm wrong on that tho).

 

[wickedwritah]

Fumble recoveries also count as team rushes, correct?

 

[pressboxer]

The answer to all (or at least most) of your questions can be found here:

http://www.ncaa.org/library/statistical/football_stats_manual/2007/2007_football_stats_manual.pdf

 

[sportshack06]

TEAM STATISTICS—In the fair application of statistical rules, there are
certain situations during which individual losses should be absorbed by
team statistics. In a clarification of previous policies, a team rush should
be charged when a quarterback kneels down in order to run out the
clock. Also, a team pass attempt should be charged when a quarterback
throws a pass into the ground in order to stop the clock. In neither instance
should the individual player be charged with the play.

 

[HandsomeHarley]

Ditto.

I would even give it a -1 in yardage.

I usually give it a -2 yardage on a kneel, because it oftentimes ends up being second-and-12, etc., at least in the NFL.

 

[Seahawk]

From the 2007 NCAA Stats manual

Article 9. The passer is not charged with a pass attempt when a forward pass
is ruled intentionally grounded. Credit the passer with a rush attempt and yards
gained or lost to the spot of the foul. Also, do not charge the passer with a pass attempt when he deliberately throws the ball to the ground to stop the clock, but charge the team with a pass attempt. Officials are instructed to apply the principle of “reasonable opportunity” to catch the pass to intentional grounding situations. It is intentional grounding when a passer, to prevent a loss of yardage, intentionally throws a ball where no eligible offensive player has a reasonable opportunity to catch it.

 

[deskslave]

Fumble recoveries also count as team rushes, correct?

My understanding was that the only situation where this is true is on a bad snap. If a runner has the ball in control, then loses it, that runner is charged with the yardage gained or lost at the end of the play. But if the center airmails it over the quarterback's (or punter's, for that matter) head for a loss of 10, then that's a team rush.

 

[HandsomeHarley]

Makes sense to me. No sense charging a QB with minus rushing yards because his center can't snap.

 

[expendable]

Makes sense to me. No sense charging a QB with minus rushing yards because his center can't snap.

Yep, happened in last night's Marshall/Memphis game.

http://scores.espn.go.com/ncf/boxscore?gameId=272750235

Late in the game Marshall center snaps the ball too low, resulting in a 19-yard loss for the Blundering Turds.

 

[HandsomeHarley]

Blundering Turds? First time I've heard that.

lol