The Steve Kerr thing

[poindexter]

The Suns have lost by 40+ four times this year. The rest of the NBA teams have lost by 40+ four times this year.

 

[PCLoadLetter]

He used to work for the Suns. Did it end badly?

Kerr had been negotiating a new contract with Robert Sarver, then abruptly announced he was resigning to spend more time with his family. Sarver did not attend that news conference.

Kerr insisted everything was fine. From the outside it looked very much like Sarver lowballed him and Kerr walked.

 

[Buck]

This is a league in which it has become acceptable to tank for years while acquiring assets,
While fans pay full freight.
Phoenix is a tanking team.

But Kerr is disreaspectful?

 

[typefitter]

"Running up the score" is one of those sports tropes that drives me mental.

I get it when the players are six years old, and you don't want them to hate the sport.

But adults? And here, professional adults?

If I am scoring so much that it bothers you, then you should try to stop me. Otherwise I am going to keep scoring. Because that's the point of the sport we are playing: We gathered here in the first place to determine which of us can score the most.

Also, why is the team that keeps scoring the one not showing class? Like there's honour in getting ****ing demolished and then complaining that the other guys are too good?

Goddammit I've become Andy Rooney.

 

[Cosmo]

I read the initial NBC Sports post yesterday, and yes, Jared Dudley called it disrespectful. He also said he wasn't mad and that it was on the Suns to actually compete.

 

[PCLoadLetter]

I read the initial NBC Sports post yesterday, and yes, Jared Dudley called it disrespectful. He also said he wasn't mad and that it was on the Suns to actually compete.

One guy who was really pissed was Troy Daniels. I thought that was kind of funny because Troy Daniels should be on his knees thanking God that the Suns are so godawful. If they weren't, he'd be in the G League.

 

[Cosmo]

One guy who was really pissed was Troy Daniels. I thought that was kind of funny because Troy Daniels should be on his knees thanking God that the Suns are so godawful. If they weren't, he'd be in the G League.

Ha, one of a few former VCU players hanging on with 10-day contracts.

 

[PCLoadLetter]

This is a league in which it has become acceptable to tank for years while acquiring assets,
While fans pay full freight.
Phoenix is a tanking team.

But Kerr is disreaspectful?

One thing about tanking: it's really pretty inefficient.

The Suns have been tanking for years. They're still getting worse. In fact, the same teams dominate the lottery year after year and never get better.

The one argument in favor would be the Sixers, but that's actually pretty misleading. There's a lot of dumb luck in their success. They got the number one pick twice. Ben Simmons is a terrific player, but Markelle Fultz may be done after just four games. They got Embiid with a 3rd pick, but there was a huge amount of luck there -- they had the second worse record, and if they got the number two pick they likely would have taken Jabari Parker instead of Embiid. Saric was a 12th pick. Covington was undrafted.

Right now "The Process" looks like a success. If they got the #2 pick instead of the #3 pick in 2014, "The Process" is a huge failure.

Compare that to the Warriors, who never really tanked and built the core of a championship team with a 7th pick, an 11th pick, and a second rounder.

 

[TigerVols]

Maybe the Suns should, you know, play better.

If the Warriors players were drawing up plays and the Suns still couldn’t compete... then the Suns should probably be most concerned about embarrassing themselves on the basketball court.

Word is the Suns are now considering hiring Javale McGee as a player/coach.

 

[poindexter]

This is a league in which it has become acceptable to tank for years while acquiring assets,
While fans pay full freight.
Phoenix is a tanking team.

But Kerr is disreaspectful?

Seriously, that is an excellent post.

 

[Buck]

One thing about tanking: it's really pretty inefficient.

The Suns have been tanking for years. They're still getting worse. In fact, the same teams dominate the lottery year after year and never get better.

The one argument in favor would be the Sixers, but that's actually pretty misleading. There's a lot of dumb luck in their success. They got the number one pick twice. Ben Simmons is a terrific player, but Markelle Fultz may be done after just four games. They got Embiid with a 3rd pick, but there was a huge amount of luck there -- they had the second worse record, and if they got the number two pick they likely would have taken Jabari Parker instead of Embiid. Saric was a 12th pick. Covington was undrafted.

Right now "The Process" looks like a success. If they got the #2 pick instead of the #3 pick in 2014, "The Process" is a huge failure.

Compare that to the Warriors, who never really tanked and built the core of a championship team with a 7th pick, an 11th pick, and a second rounder.

I agree that it is not a proven method for success in the NBA.
I'd also argue the jury is still out on Philly. They tanked for a lot of years to assemble the 'assets' they have now, and they still have yet to accomplish anything yet, including even making the playoffs.
They look like a low-seed playoff team this year, and the future certainly looks bright, but let's wait and see.

 

[MisterCreosote]

Minor point of order: The Sixers were going to either take Embiid or try to trade up for Wiggins in that draft. They weren’t going to take Parker.

 

[Buck]

Minnesota hasn't been to the NBA playoffs in 13 seasons.
Sacramento hasn't made it in 11 years.
Phoenix hasn't made it in seven years.
Philly hasn't been in five.

There is, right now, little evidence that losing in the NBA, even strategic losing, leads to long-term success.

 

[qtlaw]

Must admit that I was attending a group meeting at the game (okay it was in a suite; great food, wine) and while I watched the game intently, did not even notice what was going on with the coaching until got home.

W's were typically awful in 1Q then started playing better (or did Suns just play awful?) and next thing you know the Ws are up 30 in 3Q.

This is not disrespectful to the game or the Suns; isn't the point to get better as a team? Phil Jackson did the "not going to call a timeout" but one of the most amazing things I liked is Wooden basically saying if he had to coach during a game, he'd failed as a coach. Is that any different? Kerr forcing the players to "coach" the game was a test of their commitment to the teachings and coaching they had been given and whether they could execute.

If the team basically just played playground ball, goofing off, and hot dogging it during the game and ignored play calling and adjustments during the game, okay I get that. But beyond looking at Kerr's behavior, look at what the Ws did with the opportunity. Guess what? That's coaching because the players drew upon the coaching they had been given and played better than they had previously.

 

[HanSenSE]

Playing to get that top pick in the NBA is a bit of a crapshoot anyway, thanks to the lottery (unless you're the Knicks or the Cavs, where it's rigged to get you Ewing or James). And we all see how well the "Suck for Luck" strategy has worked for the Colts.

What's happened in Phoenix over the last decade since Colangelo sold the team is crazy. Not that it was sustainable, but the D'Antoni-Nash-Stoudamire Suns were appointment TV when I lived there. Now, it's beyond a hot mess. But, yeah, whoever said it's on the players to play better is spot on.

 

[Cosmo]

Minnesota hasn't been to the NBA playoffs in 13 seasons.
Sacramento hasn't made it in 11 years.
Phoenix hasn't made it in seven years.
Philly hasn't been in five.

There is, right now, little evidence that losing in the NBA, even strategic losing, leads to long-term success.

Phoenix won't make it for another seven years, either. That roster is a dumpster fire. Keep Payton, Booker, Warren and Jackson and build around them. I've seen enough already of Chriss and Bender. They ****ing suck.

 

[Guy_Incognito]

Is this different than Torre picking a different player to manage the last game of the year? That game was always meaningless for both teams. So was this one.

 

[sgreenwell]

Sarver is low-key one of the worst owners in the league. Obviously, Dolan and Gilbert get more press because they're in bigger markets or have bigger stars to manage, but the Suns have pretty much been in decay since Nash has left. And even during that era, didn't they famously sell off a first round pick that would have been Rajon Rondo in order to save some luxury tax money? (I'd also add that that's pretty much the most obvious "owner / GM has no clue sign," since the Bulls did that this year with the Warriors.)

 

[Stoney]

There is, right now, little evidence that losing in the NBA, even strategic losing, leads to long-term success.

Depends how far back you want to extend the analysis. I think the most egregiously blatant case of tanking was probably the 84 Rockets (SO blatant the League changed the rules and created the lottery the next year because of it). That got them Hakeem. Hakeem got them two championships. I'm pretty sure they'd do it again.

As would the 97 Spurs. They got five championships with that Duncan fella.

 

[DanOregon]

I think the Warriors dominance has only added to the number of teams tanking. Top three seeds rarely lose in the first round - and there is little reward in in being "kinda good."