The Official Tim Raines Hall of Fame Support Thread

[Dick Whitman]

All right. We can all agree that John Olerud isn't a Hall of Famer. It was a fun exercise, but it was purely academic.

Here's a real one: Tim Raines.

Here, dug up from an Internet forum somewhere is the stat line of two players:

Tim Raines:
.294/.385/.425 (league average in his day .263/.331/.398), 170 HR, 808 SB, 84.7% success rate, 2 WS rings
Lou Brock:
.293/.343/.410 (league average in era .264/.330/.390), 149 HR, 938 SB, 75.3% success rate, 2 WS rings.

Raines got only 37.5 percent of the HOF vote last year.

I am told the BBWAA is full of guys who know the game inside and out, and make the right decisions. That is largely true, I believe, and have shouted down people on here who think that the writers should get the vote taken away because of things like the infamous Stanton ballot. But if this is the case, I have no doubt that they will see the error of their ways on Raines. His omission is glaring.

Raines needs to be the next cause, now that Blyleven is in.

 

[Steak Snabler]

I'm in ... not that I have a vote or a national platform or anything.

Raines is hurt by playing at the same time as Henderson and by playing in Montreal. But the guy was a dynamic leadoff hitter for more than a decade, and one of the great percentage base-stealers of all-time.

 

[Azrael]

Playing in Montreal is only .6 - .7 as good as playing in New York.

 

[spnited]

Although I'm not big on comparing a player who is not in the Hall to one who is, I absolutely agree that Raines belongs in the Hall.

 

[shockey]

i've always considered raines hof-worthy. through no fault of his own, tho, i believe his lack of support -- in comparison to brock being in the hall -- is that brock was no doubt buoyed by being a chief cog on a dominant team that won 2 championships. when raines was in his prime he played on mostly mediocre teams in a poor market without great exposure. not saying it's right, just looking for an explanation...

he may be a guy who gets more support when the vet's committee gets a hold of him.

 

[SoCalDude]

I've been voting for Raines since he got on the ballot.

 

[Steak Snabler]

Just throwing it out there ... but does anyone think Raines admitted history of drug abuse factor in at all? I'm not saying it should, just wondering if it does ...

 

[Mizzougrad96]

I think playing the bulk of his career in Montreal hurts him a lot more than his coke habit.

He should have been in a long time ago.

 

[Bubbler]

Absolutely a Hall of Famer.

 

[Joe Williams]

One thing I'd say in Brock's defense, not that he needs one (he's in) is that he was stealing bases in big numbers at a time when many teams were playing station-to-station baseball, wasn't he? Please set me straight if Raines did his running in an era equally stifling to base stealers. Just my recollections or readings.

Raines got my vote though. NL's alternative to Rickey in a way. A little less so.

 

[Herbert Anchovy]

The Expos averaged more than 28,000 a game in the first three full years of Raines' career, before the team slowly got ripped apart.

 

[dooley_womack1]

Raines should be in. He was so good, his walks were worth .82 singles

 

[Mizzougrad96]

Let's be fair, Brock and Henderson each had 3,000 hits. I don't think Raines is quite at that level, but he's not far behind and definitely should be in.

 

[LongTimeListener]

Tim Raines is a .333 hitter with 3,400 career hits if only we factor in the absolute mathematical reality that a walk is worth .6 of a hit. And if the absolute mathematical reality is that a walk is .7 of a hit? Oh my goodness.

 

[Mizzougrad96]

I love Posnanski, but it's people who think that way and would actually take the time to write an idiotic column like that that was one of the reasons I stopped liking baseball.

 

[Dick Whitman]

Tim Raines is a .333 hitter with 3,400 career hits if only we factor in the absolute mathematical reality that a walk is worth .6 of a hit. And if the absolute mathematical reality is that a walk is .7 of a hit? Oh my goodness.

Why are you allowed to make posts like this, but when others do, you have a baby fit about it?

 

[LongTimeListener]

Tim Raines is a .333 hitter with 3,400 career hits if only we factor in the absolute mathematical reality that a walk is worth .6 of a hit. And if the absolute mathematical reality is that a walk is .7 of a hit? Oh my goodness.

Why are you allowed to make posts like this, but when others do, you have a baby fit about it?

This is a direct comparison to the previous thead in which you told us what Olerud's true numbers should be. I assumed that if it was such a valuable tool that you defended it for six pages on the Olerud thread, you'd apply the same statistical tool here.

Also, there is precisely one person on this board with whom I have this personal conflict. It's you. What's your number?

 

[cyclingwriter]

One thing to remember on Brock because he does appear to be a poor choice because he hardly walked and was not a great fielder. He set the all-time stolen base record, which had been held for about 90 years by Billy Hamilton. That is the kind of thing that voters take note of.

That being said Raines should be in the Hall, but it is not a travesty that he is not in already.

 

[dooley_womack1]

In the era of the stolen base, Rickey Henderson and Tim Raines were the defining base stealers that didn't suck at most everything else (I'm looking at you, Omar Moreno and Vince Coleman).

 

[Guy_Incognito]

Raines should be in easy. He was better than Brock.