New Babe Ruth footage

[finishthehat]

Very brief, but new:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/09/sports/baseball/09video.html?_r=1&hp

 

[playthrough]

Someone cleaned out Buckweaver's closet?

 

[JackReacher]

pretty cool stuff.

 

[RickStain]

That's awesome.

 

[Baron Scicluna]

Good stuff. I like how the Stadium used to have a track around the outfield and pathways to the stands.

One of my favorite clips of Ruth is when he hits a homer (I think it's in the first All-Star Game), and when he trots around first, he slaps the hand of the first-base coach, who spins around in the coaches box.

 

[buckweaver]

My computer's too slow at work to be able to see the clip yet, so I'll wait 'til I get home.

But after reading the story, I will say this: I sure hope the people at MLB aren't stubborn enough to ignore the massive expertise of SABR's Pictorial History Research Committee in conclusively identifying the clip. They do this stuff all the time, on photos and videos with subjects a lot more obscure than George Herman Ruth. I have no doubt someone in that committee could help them ID the exact date of that clip.

Can't wait to see it.

(And speak of the devil, I was just talking to a SABR guy tonight about what it's like to find a "holy grail" like this -- a forgotten piece of history in someone's attic somewhere. Very freaking cool.)

 

[KYSportsWriter]

Very awesome video.

 

[JR]

The clip is a fabulous piece of baseball history.

According to the video clip Frank Caputo, the chief archivist, used to be Wall Street credit analyst.

 

[Football_Bat]

They can probably measure the shadows and angle of the sun and narrow the date down to within a few days, if not nail it. Very, very cool.

 

[buckweaver]

They can probably measure the shadows and angle of the sun and narrow the date down to within a few days, if not nail it.

Well, not exactly. The clip's a little too old to use weather patterns, which aren't very precise anyway.

But there should be plenty of context clues for them to nail it. Usually, these guys use things like:

- stadium architecture, including ads on the outfield fences or temporary stands that may have been added for a World Series;
- specific uniform items (patches, sock patterns, hats, etc.);
- face or body recognition to identify who was in uniform -- if you're trying to determine whether it's a 1926 or 1928 Yankees photo, and spot the distinctive figure of Bill Dickey, you know it has to be 1928;
- identifying specific elements of the play by play -- if you have a clip of a Cardinals batter grounding out to shortstop then the next batter flies out to left field, you can look for that specific pattern in news reports or box scores;

Here's an example of how SABR's Pictorial History Committee does their work: http://www.sabr.org/cmsFiles/Files/Mysteryphoto9-09.pdf

 

[Starman]

Kind of amazing there isn't a little more footage of World Series games, etc etc.

Plus, considering New York was the undeniable media capital of the world in the 1920s, you would have thought at some point somebody would have trained a camera on Ruth through a whole game or something.

 

[Football_Bat]

Kind of amazing there isn't a little more footage of World Series games, etc etc.

Plus, considering New York was the undeniable media capital of the world in the 1920s, you would have thought at some point somebody would have trained a camera on Ruth through a whole game or something.

You mean the B.R.-cam instead of the T.O.-cam?

 

[Football_Bat]

They can probably measure the shadows and angle of the sun and narrow the date down to within a few days, if not nail it.

Well, not exactly. The clip's a little too old to use weather patterns, which aren't very precise anyway.

But there should be plenty of context clues for them to nail it. Usually, these guys use things like:

- stadium architecture, including ads on the outfield fences or temporary stands that may have been added for a World Series;
- specific uniform items (patches, sock patterns, hats, etc.);
- face or body recognition to identify who was in uniform -- if you're trying to determine whether it's a 1926 or 1928 Yankees photo, and spot the distinctive figure of Bill Dickey, you know it has to be 1928;
- identifying specific elements of the play by play -- if you have a clip of a Cardinals batter grounding out to shortstop then the next batter flies out to left field, you can look for that specific pattern in news reports or box scores;

Here's an example of how SABR's Pictorial History Committee does their work: http://www.sabr.org/cmsFiles/Files/Mysteryphoto9-09.pdf

I wasn't talking about the weather; I mean the height of the sun at certain times of the year. The sun is at its max height at the summer solstice and lower in the sky before and after. Knowing the orientation of the stadium, you can tell what time it is by the shadows and then determine the height of the sun by measuring the length of the shadows.

 

[Baron Scicluna]

Kind of amazing there isn't a little more footage of World Series games, etc etc.

Plus, considering New York was the undeniable media capital of the world in the 1920s, you would have thought at some point somebody would have trained a camera on Ruth through a whole game or something.

Don't forget, back in the 20s, you didn't have much filming of anything, other than movies. And until 1927, they were silent films, so you didn't have the Movietone News.

A lot of the clips you see are from the news clips that were shown at the movies.

 

[YankeeFan]

What year did the Yankees put numbers on their jerseys?

 

[micropolitan guy]

They can probably measure the shadows and angle of the sun and narrow the date down to within a few days, if not nail it.

Yankee Stadium's tougher than most to figure out because I heard it gets late early there.

 

[Baron Scicluna]

What year did the Yankees put numbers on their jerseys?

1929

 

[buckweaver]

September 9, 1928.

At least that's the conclusion of two separate SABR members (one of whom you might know: Keith Olbermann), working independently of each other:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/11/sports/baseball/11babe.html?_r=1

Here's how Olbermann says he drew his conclusion:

http://keitholbermann.mlblogs.com/archives/2009/10/babe_ruth_film_september_9_192.html

 

[Football_Bat]

Of course there was no bunting at Yankee Stadium! With sluggers like Ruth, Gehrig, Lazzeri and Meusel in the lineup, why waste an out with a sacrifice?

 

[Baron Scicluna]

Of course there was no bunting at Yankee Stadium! With sluggers like Ruth, Gehrig, Lazzeri and Meusel in the lineup, why waste an out with a sacrifice?

There's an old story on (I think) Lefty Gomez. During one inning of an exhibition game, Ruth and Gehrig homer, a bunch of other guys hits doubles and triples, and then Gomez hits a weak grounder that makes it through for a single, and ends up being forced out at second.

When Gomez gets back to the dugout, Joe McCarthy informs him he's fined. When Gomez asks why, McCarthy replies, "Because your lousy single broke up a great rally!"

And another McCarthy story: After the Yanks lost a game, McCarthy goes nuts in the locker room. Outfielder Billy Johnson mumbles, "What does he expect us to do, win every game?" Johnson ended up released.