Embarrassing question, please read, please help

[asdjournalist]

Hey, how's it going? I'm a journalism major in college and a few days ago I was hired by the local paper to be a stringer for the nearby high school football team.

I've written sports stories before for my high school and college paper, but I have a few questions I'm sure are common sense for the more seasoned and experience vets out there like all of you guys.

My sports editor wants me to provide an AP box at the end of the game over the phone. What is an AP box?

Associated Press, I know, but what stats are in an AP box for a high school football game? Do I need to know not just what the QB passed for, how many TDs and Ints, but also how many recs and yards each and every receiver had and how many carries and yards each and every rusher had and every tackle recorded? Or is there more? What other stats are included in an AP box?

Thanks for any help you guys can offer. I appreciate it.

 

[Ace]

You can't assume on this, asd. You need to go back to the guy and ask him to send you an example of the box they use.

AP doesn't have a standard format for high school boxes, to my knowledge.

Once you find out exactly what he wants, your next problem is how to gather that information since you won't get a stat sheet at a high school game.

 

[lone star scribe]

Good advice from Ace.

To expand, every newspaper does stats a little differently, especially with HS. However, many teams have a manager or parent keeping stats. Check with the coach, and if they do, have the stat person give you a call on your cell phone ASAP after the game. Otherwise, you're keeping them yourself. And you probably want to get in the habit of doing it yourself anyway, so you have drive information, scoring plays, etc., just in case you don't get a call.

 

[Scoop returns]

Quick advice, go back and look at how your newspaper did it last fall. I am sure there is an archives. That saves you from looking unprepared and uninformed in the eyes of your new boss. When i covered high schools way back in the day, hated doing those boxes but what I did was set up shell cap that would copy into a new file and then plug in the numbers. Much quicker. Good luck.

 

[albert77]

The basic high school summary format I use is this:

PODUCK 00, HICKSVILLE 00
Poduck 00-00-00-00 – 00
Hicksville 00-00-00-00 – 00
First Quarter
P – Joe Blow 20 run (Jack Blow kick), 0:00 (0 plays/00 yards/0:00 possession).
Second Quarter
H – John Doe 40 pass from Jack Doe (kick failed), 0:00 (0/00/0:00).
Third Quarter
P – Al Blow 60 fumble return (Joe Blow run), 0:00
P H
First downs 0 0
Rushes-yards 00-000 00-00
Passing yards 000 000
Comp-Att-Int 00-00-0 00-00-0
Fumbles-lost 0-0 0-0
Pen-yards 0-00 0-00
Punts-avg 0-00.0 0-00.0

I don't include individual stats on my sums, but it would be relatively easy to do. It's just that usually include key individual stats in the game story, and not doing each individual in the sum saves me a little time on deadline. Hope this helps.

 

[Ace]

Good advice from Ace.

To expand, every newspaper does stats a little differently, especially with HS. However, many teams have a manager or parent keeping stats. Check with the coach, and if they do, have the stat person give you a call on your cell phone ASAP after the game. Otherwise, you're keeping them yourself. And you probably want to get in the habit of doing it yourself anyway, so you have drive information, scoring plays, etc., just in case you don't get a call.

Risky to rely on the team. I've been burned plenty.

Most teams aren't too concerned about getting them on Friday night and will do their real stats off game films.

A few are real good about it and may have computerized box scores right after the game.

But you need to know what you're dealing with. They might say they are keeping stats and will share them after the game but will get overwhelmed in the second quarter and slink away.

 

[SixToe]

Don't be embarrassed.

The person who hired you should have outlined some of his expectations and requirements, and asked what you know or don't know.

Return, ask questions, get answers. Ask the questions you think may be dumb. But if you don't ask and then screw up something, the bottom line is "All you had to do was ask."

Check with the team stats guy to double check. Use halftime to check your first-half stats (while stealing a glance at the cheerleaders).

Don't worry, either. You're not managing a peace accord in the Middle East. Have fun and enjoy it.

 

[Ace]

I never get mad if people ask me specifically what we want (length, deadline, what kind of information, stats, etc.)

I get mad if they ask me hand-holding stuff like how to get to the school, whether they have wifi, what the phone number is, etc.

 

[amraeder]

Yeah. I'd definitely ask for what they want. I usually ask for them to e-mail me a copy of their box (filled out. The shell can sometimes be confusing). Then I can see what exactly they're looking for. If you don't know what the numbers mean in the box, just ask. If I were your editor I'd rather spend 10 minutes now going over questions than 2 minutes on deadline. Ask now. Don't worry about it. Anyone worth a damn wouldn't judge you for not knowing. If you want, preface your questions with "I just want to make sure I get everything right, so...." Who can fault a man (or woman) who wants to be accurate?

The other question is -- do you have a system set up for taking stats. I know there have been a few threads on here in the past about how various people on the board do it. But a good system will save you a million headaches at the end of the night.

 

[jlee]

It makes you more confident, bring a box score from last year or another paper and ask if that's the format they want. Heck, albert77's box above would work for that purpose.

Have fun and make deadline.

 

[Hank_Scorpio]

albert's box is good, but every paper I've been at has wanted individual stats in there too.


Best thing to do is find out exactly what they want in a box score.


And you should definitely be keeping your own stats. There's a recent thread (probably still on page one on Journalism Topics Only). That thread also has a link to a more detailed thread on stat keeping.


Also, find a good scoresheet. Ask your sports editor if they have you one you can copy.

 

[apeman33]

And it's not an embarrassing question. Box scores are done differently. I try to keep mine looking as much like the college and pro boxes that come over as I can because I think it helps a reader to expect to see the same stats in the same places — consistency, basically.

Basketball is where it gets interesting. I do a college-style box for high schools. But someone else may have a style all their own. When I first got here, there were five other sports editors in this region and there were five different ways of producing a basketball box score. Football boxes tend to be more consistent from place to place.

 

[Hank_Scorpio]

Here's the recent thread on keeping stats:

http://www.sportsjournalists.com/forum/threads/79058/


And it has a link to another more in-depth thread.


There's also a link to some scoresheets.

 

[NoOneLikesUs]

If it's your first time tallying a box at the end of the game, it could take some time. Just be aware of this.

 

[Batman]

But you need to know what you're dealing with. They might say they are keeping stats and will share them after the game but will get overwhelmed in the second quarter and slink away.

Or the sophomore manager leaves the stadium to go hang out with his buddies before the final whistle even drops off the referee's lips. Or they're illegible -- or worse, just plain wrong. Or the coach buries them on the bus and says the words we dread, "Can I call you with those?"
Always, always, ALWAYS keep your own stats. Even if the ones you get from a team are correct, on deadline it's usually quicker to add your own than track down someone else's. You're already dealing with a lot of chaos after a game. Relying on someone (usually a total stranger) to find you in a crowd, or vice versa, is a recipe for disaster.
Good rule of thumb at high schools, especially small ones -- never assume you're getting anything.

 

[Baron Scicluna]

One thing I used to do for keeping football stats was use a large yellow pad. Draw a line halfway the width of the page. Now, I'm not saying that this method may be best for everyone. But it worked for me.

Start of each series, write down the yard line where the ball is spotted in the middle of the page.

On the left side, write down the uniform number of the guy running the ball. On the right side, write down how many yards the play went for. (Games I covered, teams didn't throw very often)

For passing plays, write the QB's number, put an arrow to the receiver's number on the left side. Number of yards on the right.

Kicking plays, kicker's number and yards of FG attempt, or punter's number, arrow to punt returner's number on left side.

Touchdown scoring plays, I'd circle, and maybe add a note or two.

 

[MidwestSportsGuy]

Keeping detailed stats for the first time, especially for high school football, can be mighty challenging. My first time doing it for football was a struggle, even though I had kept stats for basketball, baseball, etc. I knew what to look for and how I wanted to go about it, but football is a different beast. You really have to be locked in for every single play to keep accurate yardage totals, along with receptions, rushes, passes, turnovers, penalties and on and on.

I'd strongly recommend a rehearsal before your first Friday night assignment. Watch an NFL game with the sound off and just chart the basics. Or go watch a half of a junior varsity game and do the same. In doing so, you'll start to develop a system and find out what works, what doesn't. Everybody has their own bizarre way of keeping stats, but that's because different things work for different people.

If at all possible, do a dry run. It will make that first varsity game that much easier and give you an idea of what to expect. Also, don't get frustrated at first. By your third or fourth game, you'll have your own style and it'll be second nature.

 

[MileHigh]

Lots/all high schools also do scrimmages. Definitely doesn't hurt to go out there and get your feet wet that way either. And on deadline, yah, it can get challenging. Good rule of thumb: Update your stats at halftime. Watch for trends and follow certain players in the second half so you know who to key on in the gamer.

 

[joe_schmoe]

Amreader mentioned what I would suggest, in calling the SE to get a score sheet.

The thing is if you are calling in a box in the guy you are calling into has a blank paper form he is using to take em. (Some places will input into the computer as they take the info, but most use paper forms because they like to have a hard copy to go by in case there is some computer issue).
If you can stop by the shop, one of the sports guys can get you that sheet. A lot is self explanatory but feel free to ask the guys at the shop to be sure, explaining you want to be right when you call.

Sometimes the SE really doesn't even know what's on their own form compared to how other shops and the AP does it. And just remember, everyone in this biz was covering their first event at some point as well, so most will help ya out and not make you feel dumb.

 

[forever_town]

I've done a few high school football games (and high school hockey and baseball, for that matter).

For me, the hardest things to do were to get rosters and accurate names of players. When I covered the hockey games, I also had to get the penalties.

Keep in mind that I worked for a weekly rag, so my system won't work as well if you're working for a daily. What I did for football was write down each play as it happened. I'd also glance at the clock and try to keep up the time of each significant play and write that down. After the game, I'd then tally up the stats.

That was how I had to do it because most of the schools in Godless County barely even provided rosters, and none of the public schools provided stats.

When I did a playoff game featuring a county school and a school from another county in our state, the other county's school had a detailed play-by-play and stats. I checked them against mine and that made life a lot easier. Also, the state put out numerical rosters with names of players and such, which made my life even easier.

I would agree with the suggestions to ask your editor what he wants as far as the AP box is concerned. I would also agree that you should ask about length (whether it's column inches or word count). That will give you an idea of which details to include.