Application and Interview Suggestions,

[spud]

I didn't know exactly where to post this, but I had a few questions about how to get hired. I'm sure others on this board have some of the same questions. Here's something I wanted to throw out there. (I think it would be a good idea to sticky this thread because it could help a lot of people.)

What percent of actually being hired comes down to certain things? Do you think editors place most importance on experience (i.e., if you're hiring someone for a college beat, you want someone who's worked on a college beat before), quality of clips or interview skills? What's most important? How important is each element? Is there something I'm missing here?

Are you looking for a first full-time job or to move up? I could say more about the first than the second.

I'm looking for my first full-time job.

I just finished a first job hunt and these are a few observations.

-Region Matters: most of the interest I got was from places near whichever part of the country I was in at that point. So if you are in Florida, expect less from a preps opening in Iowa than one in Georgia. I'm guessing you could use your cover letter to make it look like you are especially interested in the part of the country the job is in.

-I'm not sure how one weighs interview skills, but I'm guessing it ranks behind the other things. You have to stand out from a lot of people just of get an interview and employers probably won't bring in that many (those skills are the closer, but you'd rather get on a lot of interviews then send out app after app hoping to showcase interview skills). This also doesn't apply if you just try to meet and talk with to editors in hopes of working your way in. If you do that, interview skills are excessively important.

-I don't know if this will help but it could also be beneficial to do some stringing with local papers (perhaps a bigger name paper if you can swing that). It keeps you involved in sports writing and at the very least means that one editor knows who you are.

-It's interesting you mention a college beat, because I'd bet it's not not easy for a rookie to get that without someone recommending you or a mind-blowingly good resume.

Now this doesn't answer the direct question of the thread but I hope you find it somewhat helpful. Also remember that I'm only looking at this from the side of someone going through a job hunt. If someone who knows the process better feels like demolishing everything I said here with their knowledge and perspective, please do so.

It's funny and telling that I can repudiate every one of these based on my own experience. The trick is there is no trick.

Region Matters

My first job was 2,100 miles from my home base.

-I'm not sure how one weighs interview skills, but I'm guessing it ranks behind the other things.

From what I understand, I was more or less hired on the strength of my interview.

-I don't know if this will help but it could also be beneficial to do some stringing with local papers (perhaps a bigger name paper if you can swing that).

Never did a day of stringing for a newspaper.

Just did that to point out that I have yet to come across a single bit of advice that works for everybody, other than to just play it as smart as you know how.

 

[RickStain]

Let me second that in my limited experience, interview skills are hugely important. I've repeatedly talked my way into jobs I had no business getting.

 

[spud]

Does region always matter? What if you're willing to work anywhere?

You aren't willing to work anywhere as stated in the Dickinson thread. Don't waste our time if you're not willing to be honest. Editors can see right through the BS and that's probably why you don't have full-time work.

Anyone who dreams of becoming a sports writer and says they are willing to work anywhere should actually be willing to work anywhere, from poverty-stricken areas of the South, remote towns in the Rockies, Rust Belt ghost towns in the Midwest or in the middle of the desert. If you aren't willing to go to those places, I question your sincerity.

Why are you such a troll? You're digging up months old posts on separate threads. What's wrong with you? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to play your little game. Go enjoy grad school.

Because I entirely feel like stepping in it.

This whole, "you should be willing to work anywhere to start" thing always struck me as somewhat hollow. It seems like many hiring editors seem to prefer hiring local or semi-local, so why wouldn't you factor that in. If I prefer living in one part of the country and would ultimately like to end up there, doesn't going to another, excessively remote part of the country sort of get in the way of that?

Plus there is an irritation factor in being really far away from friends and family. I went to school far from home and now work further from home, and it should be noted that it's not easy. And its EXPENSIVE if you want to go back and visit friends/family.

I look at an associate of mine as a prime example of this. He graduated, did the MLB internship in his home town and then endured a long stretch of unemployment because I'm pretty sure he wanted to stay in the area. Eventually he landed at a small 6-days-a-week paper on the outskirts of his metro area. He did good work and around a year later got a call from someone he worked with at the MLB internship. That call turned into a new position where he gets to cover an array of professional sports for a reputable outlet. Had he just said, "My dream is to be a sports writer and I'll go anywhere to do it," I somehow doubt things would have worked out so well.

Now that individual is not a template, but in my eyes it shows that there can be a payoff for selectivity.

To me, that seems like such a select sample size that it's pointless to trumpet as some kind of model to follow.

There can indeed be a payoff for selectivity. But you are in the severe minority for finding it.

 

[Versatile]

When looking at resumes/cover letters, do editors ever say, "Candidate X has 10 years experience and Candidate Y has two years -- bye-bye, Candidate Y?"

I can say with certain assuredness that the answer is no, even at some of the biggest papers in the country.

Talent can rise to the top even at a young age. If anything, it's harder to get a good job if you're unemployed and in your 50s-60s than mid-20s.

 

[dirtybird]

Does region always matter? What if you're willing to work anywhere?

You aren't willing to work anywhere as stated in the Dickinson thread. Don't waste our time if you're not willing to be honest. Editors can see right through the BS and that's probably why you don't have full-time work.

Anyone who dreams of becoming a sports writer and says they are willing to work anywhere should actually be willing to work anywhere, from poverty-stricken areas of the South, remote towns in the Rockies, Rust Belt ghost towns in the Midwest or in the middle of the desert. If you aren't willing to go to those places, I question your sincerity.

Why are you such a troll? You're digging up months old posts on separate threads. What's wrong with you? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to play your little game. Go enjoy grad school.

Because I entirely feel like stepping in it.

This whole, "you should be willing to work anywhere to start" thing always struck me as somewhat hollow. It seems like many hiring editors seem to prefer hiring local or semi-local, so why wouldn't you factor that in. If I prefer living in one part of the country and would ultimately like to end up there, doesn't going to another, excessively remote part of the country sort of get in the way of that?

Plus there is an irritation factor in being really far away from friends and family. I went to school far from home and now work further from home, and it should be noted that it's not easy. And its EXPENSIVE if you want to go back and visit friends/family.

I look at an associate of mine as a prime example of this. He graduated, did the MLB internship in his home town and then endured a long stretch of unemployment because I'm pretty sure he wanted to stay in the area. Eventually he landed at a small 6-days-a-week paper on the outskirts of his metro area. He did good work and around a year later got a call from someone he worked with at the MLB internship. That call turned into a new position where he gets to cover an array of professional sports for a reputable outlet. Had he just said, "My dream is to be a sports writer and I'll go anywhere to do it," I somehow doubt things would have worked out so well.

Now that individual is not a template, but in my eyes it shows that there can be a payoff for selectivity.

To me, that seems like such a select sample size that it's pointless to trumpet as some kind of model to follow.

There can indeed be a payoff for selectivity. But you are in the severe minority for finding it.

Were you selective when you were going for that first job? You seem to have landed in a very nice spot, a good number of months after you graduated. Were you applying to every small, middle of nowhere shop you could during that stretch, or did you weed a lot of them out.

 

[dkphxf]

Suggestions on whether you should go for an in-person interview if they're making you pay your way. I feel as if you have to pay your own way for a job interview, they're not likely going to be willing to pay for other things -- travel to cover games, open-record requests, etc.

 

[Mark2010]

Honestly, it depends what your individua situation is. If you think this is your dream job, a once in a lifetime opportunity, maybe you make a few extra sacrifices.

If the job isn't all that good, or if just costs too much to travel or you're just plain broke, then you do a phoner.

I've been hired twice on phoners alone, because the paper didn't want to spend the money to fly me thousands of miles. I've also driven more than 1,000 miles to investigate a job/city before making the leap. And I've had a company fly me halfway across the country at a pretty ridiculous price and then freeze the position less than a month later.

So, bottom line.... look at it as an investment and decide if the potential payoff is worth it to you.

 

[Stitch]

I wouldn't pay my own way to drive more than a few hours and flying is out of the question. I can't justify spending more than a week's pay for a job that likely would pay less than $30K.

If you have to pay your own way to interview, you probably won't get moving expenses paid for.

 

[azom]

Every job I ever had in the newspaper industry, I knew the people that hired me well before I interviewed with them. Networking is the MOST important thing you can do.

(I'm searching for a teaching job right now and I can tell I haven't done enough networking. I can tell by my lack of interviews.)

 

[Mark2010]

I wouldn't pay my own way to drive more than a few hours and flying is out of the question. I can't justify spending more than a week's pay for a job that likely would pay less than $30K.

If you have to pay your own way to interview, you probably won't get moving expenses paid for.

Stich, it depends. I spent a few hundred bucks to make a trip and check things out because I was mildly concerned over taking a job sight unseen, arriving in town and finding it to be real hellhole. Made that mistake before and it was even more expensive. So I considered an investment and haven't regretted it. They didn't pay all of my moving expenses, but at least reimbursed miles when I actually made the move. Not much, I know, but I was no position to argue at the time.

 

[slappy4428]

On the company's side, how do they know you're not just doing it for a free trip on their dime? So why should they pay your interview expenses. Not saying they shouldn't offer, but if they don't it's not worth the whining.
I've paid my own way before; when I took the job, they reimbursed my interview expenses, which was only airfare.

 

[Stitch]

The days are lone gone when an employer will try to impress applicants. Back in 1979 when my dad interviewed for an entry-level electronics technician opening after getting an associate's degree, he was flown out to Phoenix from back east. After he accepted the job, the company flew my mom and dad to Phoenix for house hunting, and then paid for a full-service move. All this for a job that paid around $16,000.

 

[flexmaster33]

Does region always matter? What if you're willing to work anywhere?

Unfortunately region is important...newspapers are no longer willing to fly people out for interviews, so basically your competing through email and phone calls against others who can be there in person...face-to-face is going to win that battle almost every time. I know this from my own national job search about a year ago.

 

[WriteThinking]

Does region always matter? What if you're willing to work anywhere?

Unfortunately region is important...newspapers are no longer willing to fly people out for interviews, so basically your competing through email and phone calls against others who can be there in person...face-to-face is going to win that battle almost every time. I know this from my own national job search about a year ago.

Me, too, from mine, as well. Willingness to move is good, but it won't matter if the employer is not seeking and willing to consider strongly someone who would have to move.

It used to be that the way to advance was to be willing to move all over the place. Now, not so much. Hiring has become pretty much a regional endeavor.

 

[dkphxf]

If, during a phone interview, the other person doesn't bring up reimbursement for driving to a place for an in-person interview, should you ask? I waited until after everything was finished to ask at one place, and they said I was out of luck, that I needed to set something up beforehand. But I feel it's quite "uppity" if you ask for money for traveling beforehand, and an editor may hold it against you for asking. Thoughts?

 

[Stitch]

If, during a phone interview, the other person doesn't bring up reimbursement for driving to a place for an in-person interview, should you ask? I waited until after everything was finished to ask at one place, and they said I was out of luck, that I needed to set something up beforehand. But I feel it's quite "uppity" if you ask for money for traveling beforehand, and an editor may hold it against you for asking. Thoughts?

Yes, it is "uppity" to want to be thrown a bone interviewing at crappy newspapers in even crappier towns. If they hold asking for mileage and a hotel against you, you probably don't want to work there. Interviews are also a chance for the paper to impress you.

It your drive is 1-2 hours, asking for mileage is pushing it, but anything more than 200 miles away deserves something.

 

[dirtybird]

Yes, it is "uppity" to want to be thrown a bone interviewing at crappy newspapers in even crappier towns. If they hold asking for mileage and a hotel against you, you probably don't want to work there. Interviews are also a chance for the paper to impress you.

It your drive is 1-2 hours, asking for mileage is pushing it, but anything more than 200 miles away deserves something.

For some reason that bolded part just makes me smile.

Yes you should at least ask something about it. Even if you frame it by asking if they have a policy about covering such things. I recall an interview where we discussed nothing on that front, but on the way out they told me to send gas/motel receipts. For others I was on the hook for a cross-country flight/rental car/etc. and that was after I asked.

 

[LanceyHoward]

I think for most entry level jobs the interview is the clincher. Clips, experience, etc. get you to the interview but the other finalists probably essentially have the same resume so interview breaks the tie.

So, how can you differentiate yourself in the interview?

First, get a practice interview taped. My college would do it for me. I was seriously unemployed and went and got a tape. I found out that I would cross my leg and wiggle my foot and it drove my practice interviewer crazy. But I did not realize I was (nerves). And the tape helped me on my eye contact which was bad (again,nerves). After the tape I went in with a body postion plan (seriously) and stuck to it and started getting job offers.

And prepare. Know the nickname of the local junior college team and if it is a more important beat than the local high schools. I once lived in a town where the Legion team drew more coverage than the rookie league team. Know that. Get on the internet and learn the paper. Then you can develop questions for the interview that appear to be custom fitted to the community and paper.

 

[flexmaster33]

yes, asking about mileage is fine...often times I neglect to bring it up because it seems like it should be commonplace, but alas, i found out that's not the case every where. If they don't offer some kind of travel stipend that would be a red flag.

And yes, I would come into any interview with at least a couple quality questions to ask about the publication. Don't come across as a condescending know it all, but do some research on the paper and yes, ask questions.

I end every interview with that and find it a red flag if someone responds with a "No, not really," and stands up ready to leave. I figure if you can't ask me questions right now, what are you going to do after a Friday night football game?

 

[Turtle Wexler]

Bumping this because I can't find a more recent "all-purpose job seeking advice" thread.

As someone who is dealing with an avalanche of cover letters/resumes/clips/etc. right now, I offer a bit of advice:

Put your name on every page of everything you submit. "Turtle Wexler" somewhere on Page 1 and "Wexler" on each of the subsequent pages. Of each document.

Also, pay attention to the name of the file you upload/attach. It's not helpful for me to download 30 documents called "resume.doc." Use your name in the file name: "Turtle Wexler resume.pdf" and "Wexler clips 1.pdf" and so forth.

If I can't easily find your stuff, or if I can't easily determine it belongs to you, your chances of getting a look have dropped dramatically.