Where is Justin Bieber's publicist?

I am curious as to how you give the American left so much blame/credit for the pro-choice line of thinking that permeates the world and Justin Bieber's head, seeing as how America has a conservative stance on abortion compared with the rest of the developed world and Canada is one of the most very liberal nations on Earth regarding it?

 

Oh, I know.

 

If you described an abortion to anyone who was completely unaware of the procedure, the visceral reaction would be very similar to Bieber's.

It's the convenience of abortion that makes it acceptable. The basic facts of it are repulsive to almost anyone.

Advocates of abortion are terrified at the prospect of the details of abortion being disseminated to the public at large.

 

As she continues her descent to Tanya Tucker status...

 

And that is attributable in what way to the American left? From a cursory glance of the Internets, it appears Canada has higher rates.

 

Awful lot of assumptions wrapped into one post there.

And before you get your boxers in a wad and lump me in with the liberal horde ... I'm personally against abortion, and a long time ago, a former girlfriend and I soundly rejected abortion when we had that choice to make. We ended up losing the baby to a miscarriage some time in the first trimester.

Against abortion? That's great. Don't have one. But you don't have the right to impose your views on others. How does that square with conservatism, again, which I thought was all about personal liberty and getting the government out of our lives?

 

That's a terrible argument.

Against murder? Don't commit one. Against theft? Don't steal anything. Against speeding? Don't speed. Against vandalism? Don't vandalize. But you don't have the right to impose your views on others.

Being conservative or pro-liberty doesn't mean that nothing can be considered illegal, ever, which is basically the logical extension of what you tried to say there.

 

Actually, not at all. But thanks for playing. I didn't think it would be long before someone ambled along with just the kinds of false equivalencies you just offered.

All those things you cited are illegal. Abortion, as of the moment, isn't. Nice try, though.

 

But the debate is *whether or not they should be legal*. You are committing the logical fallacy of begging the question. "Abortions shouldn't be illegal because they are legal and nobody has the right to tell you what to do if they are legal." You are on the right side of this argument, but the way you present it fails in a very basic, logical way.

 

Once again, you're misrepresenting what I'm saying, Rick. You aren't even close, and two bites at the apple is enough, so I think we'll leave it at that. But thanks for the civilized, respectful discussion.

 

What exactly *are* you saying then?

Members of society clearly have the right to impose their views on the whole society. That's pretty much the entirety of Western Civilization, the social-contract theory.

So why is abortion different? Why can other things be regulated but not this?

If your answer is "because there's nothing wrong with abortion" or "because it is legal," then you may very well be right, but you've also committed the fallacy of begging the question. It's simply a bad argument.

 

Nobody's saying it can't be regulated. Again, you're putting words in my mouth. We regulate abortion all the time. It's one of the most regulated things we have in society today.

As far as the social contract - you have a point, to an extent. It's one of the beauties and frustrations of representative democracy that we often end up with laws and rules we may not agree with. And yeah, I will concede the point that under the social contract, some of those in society have the "right" to impose their views on others.

It's just not something I choose to do. I consider myself pretty much a libertarian. Hope that helps. Not everything can be boiled down to something out of our college logic textbooks.