1. Welcome to SportsJournalists.com, a friendly forum for discussing all things sports and journalism.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register for a free account to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Access to private conversations with other members.
    • Fewer ads.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

What happened? Joba out of Yanks rotation?

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by thebiglead, Dec 21, 2007.

  1. cortez

    cortez Member

    They need to figure this out before I have to submit my keeper list for roto baseball
  2. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    Paging spnited....I'd fill in, but I'm too much of a fantasy geek to respond appropriately....
  3. Ruth-Gehrig

    Ruth-Gehrig Member

    New York's starters were decent enough to go five strong innings between 2001-07, although Wang's failures are mystifying.

    Yanks management has made several awful moves the past half-decade -- Johnson, Brown et al, and I knew the team was doomed when it acquired Raul Mondesi. He was the antithesis of the players on the 1996-2000 clubs.

    But the topic is Joba starter/reliever, and the bullpen was the No. 1 strength of New York's championship teams. Angels management has always made sure Anaheim has an impressive stable of relievers, which is the reason that team has been such a huge factor in recent years. The 2002 World Champions didn't have an imposing starting staff.

    Incognito: Here's a handful of examples of Yanks' middle relief failures during the past half-decade.

    In game Game 3 during 2002 ALDS Yanks middle relief entered in the sixth inning with 6-4 lead, and the Angels won 9-6 to take a 2-1 lead in the five-game series. Rivera pitched one inning in the four-game series won by Anaheim. Never got the ball.

    In Game 6 of the 2003 ALCS Yanks had opportunity to close out Red Sox, middle relief squandered 6-4 seventh-inning lead and lost 9-6.
    Yankees used seven pitchers and needed 12 innings to eliminate Boston in seven games, while the Marlins younger pitching staff was well rested and its rotation was in order fo New York series.

    In Game 5 of the 2004 ALCS Yanks had opportunity to close out Red Sox, middle relief (Tom Gordon) wasted 4-2 eighth-inning lead.
    Player G ERA W-L SV CG IP H ER BB SO
    Tom Gordon 6 8.10 0-0 0 0 6.7 10 6 2 3 (Gordon's ALCS line)

    Gordon usually pitched poorly against heavy-hitting lineups during his Yankee tenure.

    In Game 3 of 2005 ALDS Yanks middle relief can't hold 6-5 lead with five-game series tied at 1-1, Angels win 11-7, take series in five.

    Yanks starters awful in 2006 ALDS 3-1 loss to Tigers.

    In Game 2 of 2007 ALDS with Indians leading series 1-0, Yanks middle relief relinquishes 1-0 eighth-inning lead as Cleveland wins in four.
  4. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    Um, wasn't it Joba the Great that lost that game anyway?

    If you want to break it down to any one factor, it was starting pitching that cost the Yankees the 2007 playoff series.

    Mussina is toast and Hughes and Kennedy still have a lot to prove. The Yankees have as many question marks in the rotation as they do in the bullpen, and Chamberlain is a still one of those question marks in either role.

    I'm not even sure he really is more valuable as a closer someday than starting. No way is a middle reliever worth more to a team than an equally effective starting pitcher, just due to the number of innings a starter throws.

    Sorry, but this whole argument screams fanboy. You want the Yankees' problems to be one small thing that can easily be fixed by Joba the Great. It just isn't that simple.
  5. Big Chee

    Big Chee Active Member

    It's actually the reverse of Rivera's intial start as a Yankee. He was a starter who was later thrust into the bullpen.
  6. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    Chamberlain had always been a starter until this past season. Once the Yankees decided they wanted to bring him up, they started working him as a reliever in the minors to get him prepared for pitching in a similar role with the big-league club.

    Though I see the point. Rivera did actually make 10 starts among his 19 appearances for the Yankees in 1995. But was Rivera ever considered a top-notch prospect as a starting pitcher?
  7. Big Chee

    Big Chee Active Member

    I don't know. I mostly recall his complete game, two hit (both by Frank Thomas) shut out against the White Sox his rookie season. He looked very promising.
  8. Guy_Incognito

    Guy_Incognito Well-Known Member

    Look at the scores of your examples for games that the middle relievers blew - they needed them because the starters stunk. 2002, 2005, 2006 & 2007 IMO are all primarily failures of the SP - though I grant that other areas of the team weren't great. 2003 was the year that Torre did the most damage, 2001 was so close you can point to any of a million things. 2004 I blame SPs most, but of course it was a complete team collapse.
  9. TheSportsPredictor

    TheSportsPredictor Well-Known Member

    Joba goes two innings Wednesday night; Girardi says the process of moving Joba to the rotation has begun.

  10. BYH

    BYH Active Member

    d_b, DoucheBag!! :D :D :D You suck!

  11. TheSportsPredictor

    TheSportsPredictor Well-Known Member

    Screw you!! I want Joba news on its own thread. So does everyone else. There is no question about it. You don't put Joba news on the 27th page of a baseball thread. You just don't do that. You have to be an idiot to do that.

    I think most people agree with me. I had no say in that posting, and I wouldn't have allowed it.
  12. BYH

    BYH Active Member

    ohhhh you wouldn't have allowed it. what are you going to do? Start your own message board? :D

    Plus, who wants the news on this thread? Did you see who started it?
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page