'The most underappreciated player of our generation'

Even if they wouldn't play a free-form, jazz exploration number in front of a festival audience.

 

I think people realize how good Hoffman was. Is he considered on the same level as Mariano Rivera? No, but should he be? I think Hoffman gets into Cooperstown pretty easily. I'd be surprised if he has to wait more than 2-3 years and I wouldn't be stunned if he made it in on the first ballot.

 

Taylor's biggest problem is the lack of TDs. He has the yards, but he did not get the number of TDs that most of the players on that level had. I think he only had two seasons with more than 10 TDs. I think he and Terrell Davis are pretty close in rushing touchdowns and Davis only had four full seasons.

 

I'd say Hoffman = lock for HOF, but there was a thread and pretty sure some said not a definite. He really was just a notch below Rivera and no one else was close for the lenghth of time those guys did it. without looking it up i'd say 10 years of being at a high level is what separates those guys. for 3-4 year spans others were as dominant or more dominant, like Gagne. the thing that puts Rivera in a class by himself is the postseason. of course Hoffman can't help that he didn't get the chances. but when people think Hoffman in the postseason they can't forget Brosius homer. Rivera's biggest postseason failure was a throwing error and a broken bat hit over a drawn-in infield. he also blew a game in the 04 ALCS but that is remembered for the biggest comeback by a team or biggest choke by a team. Rivera has had more chances than anyone but his postseason numbers are insane.

 

I agree with this. If Hoffman doesn't get in quickly, I think it's probably because what Mariano did overshadows him so much that people don't realize how good he was, even adjusting for Petco and the lack of playoff opportunities. Hoffman is to Mariano what Tim Raines is to Rickey Henderson - clearly not as good, but still a Hall of Fame guy to me.

 

that is a solid comparison. i've always liked Raines and i think he also is hurt by playing in the end of the turf/speed era and the beginning of the power/moneyball era. Henderson also was on several different great offensive teams and was a huge part of them. Raines was on pretty good teams but didn't get to the World Series until he was a part-time player. People will say that doesn't matter because you can only do so much but i have to think it matters to voters. not saying that Mattingly should be in but how is Puckett a first ballott HOF and Mattingly never real close to getting in. the only glaring difference was 2 World Series for Puckett.

 

Tim Raines is definitely a good name to be mentioned on this thread.

He was overshadowed by the greatest leadoff hitter/base stealer of all-time and he played in Montreal.

He still should make it to Cooperstown.

Mattingly is Terrell Davis without the rings.

 

Because Kirby was the face of a franchise that won two World Series'. Mattingly was one of many great players on the Yankees. Don't under-estimate the value of being the face of franchise that won titles can have.

This and Kirby won his gold gloves as a CFer while Mattingly was a 1B. Being a great defender at CF means a lot more.

 

Andruw Jones. Although I'm not a Braves fan, he was certainly a solid player. Averages 30 home runs and 100 RBI per year. Career .260 hitter with the Braves. Ten gold gloves.

 

Mattingly had 5-6 good to great seasons. If there is a modern era baseball player who got in with something similar, I'd like to know who that person is.

 

Puckett had 11 or 12 seasons where he was a pretty damn good player. That's a lot more worthy than Mattingly and that's not even taking the rings into consideration...

 

Jones is going to be an interesting Hall of Fame case. Incredible first half of the career, then dropped off the face of the Earth. He's still bouncing around now.