Soft/Baseball Scoring Question

No, not forced out. Kid shouldn't have taken off for third. Guess I was wrong.

 

I'm in the same camp. You can't save your own win, but I'm quite sure the relievers is the pitcher of record.

 

It's a single and a 7-5 putout.

 

That's how I would score it too.

 

If there's no force, any movement you make on the bases is at your own risk. If the batted ball goes to the outfield, it's a hit -- unless the batter is thrown out before he/she hits first.

 

OK, here's one:

Runner on second, no outs. Hitter hits a fly ball to pretty deep center field. Runner tags, and the center fielder, who caught the ball moving away from the infield, takes his time getting the ball in. Runner scores from second.

Do you give the hitter a sacrifice fly?

 

Yes

 

Three scoring questions here -- in reverse order:
*On the sacrifice fly question -- yes, the batter gets an SF. A fly ball put in a position that, when caught, would score a man from second ball (and does) results in a sacrifice fly. If such a ball is catchable and dropped and, in the opinion of the scorer, the man would have scored all the way from the second anyway, the batter reaches on the error and is credited with an SF.
*On the question of the man at second being thrown out at third on what normally looks like a hit to the outfield -- the batter reaches on a fielder's choice, not a hit. When the ball hits, it cannot be assumed that even an outfielder has no play at first. How many times have you seen a man thrown out at first, or a runner forced at second, on a ball hit cleanly to right field? No, a ball that lands in the outfield is not automatically anything. In this case, the outfielder saw that he had a play at third and he chose that play. It's no different than the batter hitting the ball in the hole at shortstop -- and there is no apparent play at first -- but the shortstop backhands and nails the runner trying to advance from second to third. Fielders choice for the batter.
*On the question of the pitcher who re-enters the game and finishes the game -- I'm going to interpret from the professional rules only here. We have the SP, R1 and R2, who is the SP who has re-entered the game. R1 gets the victory, no question. And there is nothing in the rulebook which prevents R2 from getting the save, even though he started the game. The only restriction of that manner is the part of the rule that says the same player may not get both the victory and the save.
Hope that helps.

 

On the second one, though, the ball was hit to left field, not right. Unless the batter is shot in the leg halfway to first (or is Mo Vaughn), he ain't getting thrown out.

I think this is how it makes sense to me: Say there's a runner at first. The batter singles and the runner is thrown out trying to go to third. No question it's a single and a fielder's choice.

If that runner were thrown out at second, it would be a fielder's choice, because that runner is obligated, by the force, to take one base and the batter's efforts were insufficient to get him there.

In the example presented, however, there was a runner on second, so there's no force in place. He's not obligated to take third base. He could have stood on second waiting to see if the ball dropped. In the event, he didn't do that. But if he'd stayed at second and not advanced, you would have credited the hitter with a single. So why would the hitter lose that single because the runner was thrown out at third?

(Incidentally, I recall reading an interview -- some years ago, obviously -- in which Barry Bonds said it was his goal to throw someone out at first from left field.)

 

I'm with spnited: Relief pitcher gets the win, no save for the starter/reliever.

 

To clarify and correct my above response...
Regarding the flare to left field that resulted in the runner being thrown out trying to advance to third base:
It actually depends on who fields the ball. Check rule 10.06 (c).
If the left fielder (or any outfielder) handles the flare and nails the runner at third, the batter is credited with a hit. But if the shortstop (or another infielder) goes out, grabs the ball, fires to third and nails the runner, it's a fielders choice.
The rule clearly distinquishes infielders (including the pitcher and catcher) from outfielders. Just one of those deals.
As far as the starting pitcher getting the save... the reason the rule book specifically prevents a player from being credited with both the pitching victory and a save is to account for the possibility of a pitcher qualifying for both. In other words, it's perfectly legal for a pitcher to start a game, change positions and then finish a game on the mound. If he is not the winning pitcher in that case, and he qualifies for a save, he gets a save. Had the rulemakers wanted to prevent a starting pitcher from getting a save, they would have precluded that with a rule -- just as they made it impossible to get both the victory and a save.

 

I would score it a hit because the runner did not have to advance. It was not a force out and the outfielder had no play at first base. If the outfielder would have had a play at first base it would have be different but because the runner made a mistake and the hitter could not have been thrown out and the runner did not have to advance because of a force situation it would be a hit.

It would be a simliar situation to runner on second, shortstop makes a diving stop of a ball to his right. He has no play at first but runner on second before making sure the ball goes through to the outfield and is thrown out at third. Scorer, if in his judgment runner would have been safe at first, can rule it a single and a 6-5 putout.

As for the win-save. The first relief pitcher would get the win. The second relief pitcher, who happened to have started the game, gets a save. There's no issue over a pitcher saving his own win because the starter did not qualify for a win.