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President Trump: The NEW one and only politics thread

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Moderator1, Nov 12, 2016.

  1. Smallpotatoes

    Smallpotatoes Well-Known Member

    Is there something about getting older and having kids and grandkids that kind of makes you think that maybe it isn't so hokey?
    OscarMadison likes this.
  2. cjericho

    cjericho Well-Known Member

    Don't have grandkids. Never thought of it as being hokey. Always thought of it as a job. Some jobs are better, some
    are worse. But it's probably better than not having a job.
  3. Smallpotatoes

    Smallpotatoes Well-Known Member

    I just don't get why people become more conservative as they get older.
  4. Tweener

    Tweener Well-Known Member

    For one, there’s a chance it’s not bogus and, bogus or not, it could really hurt Biden in the General Election. This isn’t FDR or JFK. He’s not a sure thing even without the allegations.

    I’m not asking that he step aside. Most voters want him and should get him. But that doesn’t mean I don’t believe the allegations could hurt him in an election where his main selling point is that he’s not at all like Trump.
  5. cjericho

    cjericho Well-Known Member

    OK. Not sure what that has to do with the military being hokey, but guess it's something to ponder.
  6. Sam Mills 51

    Sam Mills 51 Well-Known Member

    Take out the roads agenda and the GOP corporate cadaver and you have Roy Cooper's plight in North Carolina.

    Cooper beat Pat McCrory, who not only signed in HB2 - the infamous Bathroom Bill - but also whined, demanded numerous recounts of ballots and lost by a bigger margin after each attempt. Took him weeks after the election to get out, didn't congratulate Cooper and left a video in which he basked in playing the victim.

    North Carolina is gerrymandered like few other places are and both houses were GOP supermajority (Mark Meadows not only ended up Chief of Staff because he has been one of Trump's biggest butt-kissers, but also because when the districts are redrawn, he was dead man walking). Cooper had little choice but to outright veto numerous garbage bills, only to watch the GOP override basically to make clear to Cooper that they're in charge.

    The GOP only recently lost the supermajority, evening the playing field if only a little. But, being male and not giving a crap about Trump's utter stupidity - at least for now - he's not a Presidential target.
  7. Starman

    Starman Well-Known Member

    I started out as a flaming liberal hippie in my teens, drifted somewhat to the center in my 20s/30s. I think (I don't remember for 100% sure) I might have voted for Daddy Bush over Dukakis.

    In my mid 30s, after hammering my head for 10 years in shtthole non-union journalism jobs, I got a job in a union shop (along with about a 133% increase in pay).

    Very shortly after getting my cushy new union job, the paper was sold to an arch conservative right wing corporation which began dictating nonstop right wing screech machine editorial policy (to a paper which had been heavy labor Democratic). Sports columns were spiked if you wrote anything critical about management/ owners or positive about unions. They also really really liked the column genre of "pompous white guy wrings hands over thug black athlete." They ate that shit up.

    They also began furiously trying to evade their contract commitments, chopping back health coverage, laying off staff, breaching contract provisions, etc etc. As they chopped back on staff, their adherence to wage and hour laws went out the window.

    During that time I went full Che Guevara. I'm twice as radical now as I ever was as a hippie teen. I wanted Nixon impeached; I want Fatfuck lynched from a fucking telephone pole.
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
  8. SoloFlyer

    SoloFlyer Well-Known Member

    I don't think it's safe versus bold, necessarily, as it is someone new and refreshing.

    Since Kennedy/LBJ, when Democrats have run a well-known, firmly established candidate, they've lost.

    Humphrey was a Senator for decades and then VP. Lost to Nixon after a chaotic primary. That chaos was still evident in 72 when they went with McGovern, who had established himself in the Senate and in reforming the DNC but was otherwise unremarkable in a fractured party.

    It took Nixon's crimes to rally the Dems, and that was just by the slimmest of margins for Carter (who, by the way, hadn't run for President in the chaos the years prior and thus was a fresh face).

    Reagan defeats Carter which leads to nominations for Mondale (longtime Senator and VP), Dukakis (high profile governor), Gore (longtime Senator and VP), Kerry (two decades as Senator before his run), and Clinton (high profile first lady and then Senator).

    Few pegged Bill Clinton as a serious candidate, even though there had been talk of him running in 1988. Few expected Obama to run as soon as he did, even after his stirring convention speech in 2004.

    Why do people think Beto, Buttigieg, Warren, Harris, and others generated buzz at various times? Because they were new. America doesn't vote for long tenured politicians as President and it likes winners. It's why no candidate who had lost a Presidential election has come back to win a second one in decades.

    People are only giving Biden a chance because he makes them feel comfortable. I guarantee you most people don't know about the accusations. And given what Trump has said and done, they'll hold their nose and vote for Biden if it means ousting Trump.

    But this isn't a normal election. If it was, Biden would've been out before the primaries. His familiarity runs counter to all the trends of past primaries, but it's the one thing that propped up his candidacy and allowed him to swoop in for the nomination.
    Tweener likes this.
  9. DanOregon

    DanOregon Well-Known Member

    I tend to agree with the answer that they would support Trump regardless of whether they were military families. I have cousins who are died in the wool Republicans and Navy lifers who don't have much use for Trump at this point.
  10. Tweener

    Tweener Well-Known Member

    I agree with you on the latter, but I strongly believe you’re underestimating how HRC turned a lot of progressive voters off, in part, because she was far too moderate.

    This sums up my belief pretty well:

    When Will Moderates Learn Their Lesson?

    “The critic’s refusal to self-critique is the tragic enigma of the moderate Democrat: It could cost the Democratic Party the most consequential presidential election in recent memory. Moderate Democrats have lost presidential elections again and again, even as the doctrine of the electable moderate wins Democratic primaries again and again.

    “How are these moderate Democrats running on their electability in 2020 when a moderate Democrat lost to Trump in 2016? How is the electable moderate reborn when it has died so many times in recent presidential elections? Simple: When moderate Democrats lose, they blame everything except the party’s decision to nominate a moderate for president of the United States.”
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
  11. Tweener

    Tweener Well-Known Member

    Also, I don’t think you can tie a politician’s accomplishments solely to how many bills they’ve written and passed. There are other ways to measure. Sanders has written a number of bipartisan amendments that have passed and has a voting record that wouldn’t be a liability in a general election election.

    His influence may be the biggest reason almost every Democratic candidate has pushed for some kind of universal healthcare, why they all want to increase the national minimum wage, make college debt-free and pass paid time off legislation, among other things.
  12. Matt1735

    Matt1735 Well-Known Member

    Sanders may have the right message, but he is a terrible messenger, IMHO. He is not electable because he will not convert any leaners. He will carry the left, Trump the right. Without the middle, he has no chance.
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
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