Mariano Rivera torn ACL

93Devil · May 5, 2012

buckweaver said:

Steak Snabler said:

If this is the end for Rivera, there have been very few Baseball Hall of Famers whose careers ended so suddenly:

1. Lou Gehrig (diagnosed with ALS)
2. Roberto Clemente (died in an offseason plane crash)
3. Roy Campanella (paralyzed in an offseason car accident)
4. Kirby Puckett (suddenly went blind in one eye during spring training)
5. Ed Delahanty (died in a drunken accident/suicide when he fell/jumped from a bridge at Niagara Falls)

That's about it. Nolan Ryan retired suddenly after tearing a ligament while pitching in September 1993, but he was going to retire at the end of that season anyway.

There were a few others, like Babe Ruth, Mike Schmidt and Sandy Koufax, who retired abruptly in midseason or in the offseason, but they probably could have continued had they chosen to.

Anybody I'm missing?
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Addie Joss. Died at 31 of tuberculous meningitis before the 1911 season. Pitched two no-hitters and four 20-win seasons in 9 years. Career ERA of 1.89. Would have been a sure Hall of Famer if he lived, and he was eventually elected by the Vets Committee.

Goose Goslin supposedly hurt his back in mid-swing and had to be lifted for a pinch-hitter in the middle of his final plate appearance. (That's probably apocryphal, though.)

I'd argue that Sandy Koufax probably could not have continued much past '66, unless Dr. Frank Jobe would have invented TJ surgery for him a few years earlier (and Koufax's career being cut short by the elbow injury is what haunted Jobe and inspired him to try the experimental new procedure with John. He's always wished he would have thought of the idea for Koufax instead.)
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J.R. Richard

cjericho · May 5, 2012

93Devil said:

buckweaver said:

Steak Snabler said:

If this is the end for Rivera, there have been very few Baseball Hall of Famers whose careers ended so suddenly:

1. Lou Gehrig (diagnosed with ALS)
2. Roberto Clemente (died in an offseason plane crash)
3. Roy Campanella (paralyzed in an offseason car accident)
4. Kirby Puckett (suddenly went blind in one eye during spring training)
5. Ed Delahanty (died in a drunken accident/suicide when he fell/jumped from a bridge at Niagara Falls)

That's about it. Nolan Ryan retired suddenly after tearing a ligament while pitching in September 1993, but he was going to retire at the end of that season anyway.

There were a few others, like Babe Ruth, Mike Schmidt and Sandy Koufax, who retired abruptly in midseason or in the offseason, but they probably could have continued had they chosen to.

Anybody I'm missing?
Click to expand...

Addie Joss. Died at 31 of tuberculous meningitis before the 1911 season. Pitched two no-hitters and four 20-win seasons in 9 years. Career ERA of 1.89. Would have been a sure Hall of Famer if he lived, and he was eventually elected by the Vets Committee.

Goose Goslin supposedly hurt his back in mid-swing and had to be lifted for a pinch-hitter in the middle of his final plate appearance. (That's probably apocryphal, though.)

I'd argue that Sandy Koufax probably could not have continued much past '66, unless Dr. Frank Jobe would have invented TJ surgery for him a few years earlier (and Koufax's career being cut short by the elbow injury is what haunted Jobe and inspired him to try the experimental new procedure with John. He's always wished he would have thought of the idea for Koufax instead.)
Click to expand...

J.R. Richard

Click to expand...

not a Hall of Famer. maybe the Astros Hall of Fame.

Baron Scicluna · May 5, 2012

buckweaver said:

Steak Snabler said:

If this is the end for Rivera, there have been very few Baseball Hall of Famers whose careers ended so suddenly:

1. Lou Gehrig (diagnosed with ALS)
2. Roberto Clemente (died in an offseason plane crash)
3. Roy Campanella (paralyzed in an offseason car accident)
4. Kirby Puckett (suddenly went blind in one eye during spring training)
5. Ed Delahanty (died in a drunken accident/suicide when he fell/jumped from a bridge at Niagara Falls)

That's about it. Nolan Ryan retired suddenly after tearing a ligament while pitching in September 1993, but he was going to retire at the end of that season anyway.

There were a few others, like Babe Ruth, Mike Schmidt and Sandy Koufax, who retired abruptly in midseason or in the offseason, but they probably could have continued had they chosen to.

Anybody I'm missing?
Click to expand...

Addie Joss. Died at 31 of tuberculous meningitis before the 1911 season. Pitched two no-hitters and four 20-win seasons in 9 years. Career ERA of 1.89. Would have been a sure Hall of Famer if he lived, and he was eventually elected by the Vets Committee.

Goose Goslin supposedly hurt his back in mid-swing and had to be lifted for a pinch-hitter in the middle of his final plate appearance. (That's probably apocryphal, though.)

I'd argue that Sandy Koufax probably could not have continued much past '66, unless Dr. Frank Jobe would have invented TJ surgery for him a few years earlier (and Koufax's career being cut short by the elbow injury is what haunted Jobe and inspired him to try the experimental new procedure with John. He's always wished he would have thought of the idea for Koufax instead.)
Click to expand...

Ross Youngs. Was stricken with Bright's Disease in 1926, cutting short his season. Died the following year.

Not a Hall of Famer, but Urban Shocker. Won Four-time 20-game winner who won 18 games for the Yankees in 1927 and 187 for his career. Had heart disease, and pitched just one game for NY in May 1928 before being released. Went out to Colorado, pitched in a tournament despite not feeling well and caught pneumonia. Died in early September.

93Devil · May 5, 2012

cjericho said:

93Devil said:

buckweaver said:

Steak Snabler said:

If this is the end for Rivera, there have been very few Baseball Hall of Famers whose careers ended so suddenly:

1. Lou Gehrig (diagnosed with ALS)
2. Roberto Clemente (died in an offseason plane crash)
3. Roy Campanella (paralyzed in an offseason car accident)
4. Kirby Puckett (suddenly went blind in one eye during spring training)
5. Ed Delahanty (died in a drunken accident/suicide when he fell/jumped from a bridge at Niagara Falls)

That's about it. Nolan Ryan retired suddenly after tearing a ligament while pitching in September 1993, but he was going to retire at the end of that season anyway.

There were a few others, like Babe Ruth, Mike Schmidt and Sandy Koufax, who retired abruptly in midseason or in the offseason, but they probably could have continued had they chosen to.

Anybody I'm missing?
Click to expand...

Addie Joss. Died at 31 of tuberculous meningitis before the 1911 season. Pitched two no-hitters and four 20-win seasons in 9 years. Career ERA of 1.89. Would have been a sure Hall of Famer if he lived, and he was eventually elected by the Vets Committee.

Goose Goslin supposedly hurt his back in mid-swing and had to be lifted for a pinch-hitter in the middle of his final plate appearance. (That's probably apocryphal, though.)

I'd argue that Sandy Koufax probably could not have continued much past '66, unless Dr. Frank Jobe would have invented TJ surgery for him a few years earlier (and Koufax's career being cut short by the elbow injury is what haunted Jobe and inspired him to try the experimental new procedure with John. He's always wished he would have thought of the idea for Koufax instead.)
Click to expand...

J.R. Richard

Click to expand...

not a Hall of Famer. maybe the Astros Hall of Fame.
Click to expand...

Ahhh, I missed the HOF line, but he was one of the top five pitchers in the game when he went down.

HanSenSE · May 5, 2012

Can't find my copy of "Glory of Their Times," but I do remember Goslin talks about that last at-bat in the book.

Guy_Incognito · May 5, 2012

cjericho said:

they definitely did go that route but i think steinbrenner changed a little when they built the world series teams in the 90s, of course they still did sign 1 or 2 of the top free agents each season
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I don't think that's true. Compare their FA habits to Boston or the Mets.

cjericho · May 8, 2012

Guy_Incognito said:

cjericho said:

they definitely did go that route but i think steinbrenner changed a little when they built the world series teams in the 90s, of course they still did sign 1 or 2 of the top free agents each season
Click to expand...

I don't think that's true. Compare their FA habits to Boston or the Mets.
Click to expand...

compared to Boston? Manny, Ortiz, Pedro, Schilling, Damon, Foulke. None of them were drafted by the Red Sox. The Yankees always go out and sign free agents but they drafted Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte and Williams. They stuck with those guys. If it was the 80s they probably would've let some go, like they did with Drabek and Buhner (didn't draft them but acquired them as minor leaguers). not saying the Yankees had a limited budget and had to play moneyball, but i don't really think Boston did either.

Guy_Incognito · May 8, 2012

cjericho said:

Guy_Incognito said:

cjericho said:

they definitely did go that route but i think steinbrenner changed a little when they built the world series teams in the 90s, of course they still did sign 1 or 2 of the top free agents each season
Click to expand...

I don't think that's true. Compare their FA habits to Boston or the Mets.
Click to expand...

compared to Boston? Manny, Ortiz, Pedro, Schilling, Damon, Foulke. None of them were drafted by the Red Sox. The Yankees always go out and sign free agents but they drafted Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte and Williams. They stuck with those guys. If it was the 80s they probably would've let some go, like they did with Drabek and Buhner (didn't draft them but acquired them as minor leaguers). not saying the Yankees had a limited budget and had to play moneyball, but i don't really think Boston did either.
Click to expand...

I mean it's not true that they signed the top 1-2 FAs each season.

Baron Scicluna · May 8, 2012

cjericho said:

Guy_Incognito said:

cjericho said:

they definitely did go that route but i think steinbrenner changed a little when they built the world series teams in the 90s, of course they still did sign 1 or 2 of the top free agents each season
Click to expand...

I don't think that's true. Compare their FA habits to Boston or the Mets.
Click to expand...

compared to Boston? Manny, Ortiz, Pedro, Schilling, Damon, Foulke. None of them were drafted by the Red Sox. The Yankees always go out and sign free agents but they drafted Jeter, Rivera, Pettitte and Williams. They stuck with those guys. If it was the 80s they probably would've let some go, like they did with Drabek and Buhner (didn't draft them but acquired them as minor leaguers). not saying the Yankees had a limited budget and had to play moneyball, but i don't really think Boston did either.
Click to expand...

In '95/winter '96, George was all set to trade Mariano to the Mariners for Felix Fermin (!) because they didn't know if the new kid at shortstop, some guy named Jeter, would be able to handle the job. His subordinates convinced him not to.

Then, after the '96 season, Wetteland left as a free agent, and the Yankees were going to try to sign Roberto Hernandez or Randy Myers to close. If they did, they were going to try to trade Mariano and a couple of other guys for Randy Johnson. Seattle wanted Pettitte added, and the Yankees said no.

They also nearly traded Posada to the Mariners in '95 for Tino Martinez. The Mariners wanted Russ Davis, who was seen as the better prospect, instead. The Yankees didn't want to do that, but then signed Boggs, so they agreed.

Gehrig · May 8, 2012

Would you say Rivera is he the greatest player per unit of play ever?

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Mariano Rivera torn ACL

93Devil Well-Known Member

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