Cy Young Awards thread

Funny thing is, Verlander has been relatively mortal the last month or so as the Tigers have "charged" (well actually kinda more like stumbled) into the division lead.

He certainly would not be a bad pick, but he's way off from last year, when he was an absolute no-brainer.

 

I completely disagree with the belief that relievers can't be the best pitchers in a league and hence Cy Young winners (voters have agreed with me on occasion), but I'd still pick Dickey.

 

Argument meaning, "There, I made a case (however shitty) for the best pitcher on my favorite team because I was bored and felt like posting."

 

Why so?

I just think most modern closers don't impact a significant number of games, nor the most significant high-leverage portion of the games in which they do appear.

Now, I do think a Rivera in '96-type reliever could be the best pitcher in the league. But until we get back to the days of "firemen", and we will someday, the one-inning guys just don't pitch enough to be all that valuable. At least, not as valuable as the guys who pitch 220 innings a season.

Especially not as the rate of teams winning games when leading after the 6th, 7th or 8th innings hasn't changed significantly since the Deadball Era, despite all the evolution in bullpen usage. Most teams win about 90 percent of those games, and they do no matter how good or bad their relievers are.

 

I don't think we disagree much BuckW. Relievers qualify for historically exceptional seasons. Our definitions of that term may vary, but that's degree, not kind.

 

My argument against closers is based on the number of mediocre to good starters we've seen take over as excellent closers. It's harder to pitch 200 innings over 33 games than 80 innings over 60 games, numbers some elite closers fail to reach. And it shows all the time. Look at how the recent attempts to make young relievers into starters have gone.

 

There are four good candidates in the National League, and Gonzalez is one of them. His walk rate bothers me, though.

 

Doesn't bother me a bit, especially seeing how he walked 92 and 91 in the last two years. In the 70s this year. I'll take that and be happy. That seemed to be all anyone wanted to talk about when the Nats traded for him. OH MY GOD HE WALKS THE PARK!!!!

Not so much this year.

 

I agree. He took a step forward this year, and he may very well take another next year. But consider the walks per nine innings of the pitchers we're discussing in this thread:

Kyle Lohse: 1.6
Jered Weaver: 2.0
Hiroki Kuroda: 2.0
Jake Peavy: 2.0
R.A. Dickey: 2.1
Johnny Cueto: 2.1
Felix Hernandez: 2.1
Matt Cain: 2.1
Chris Sale: 2.3
Justin Verlander: 2.3
Clayton Kershaw: 2.5
David Price: 2.5
Matt Harrison: 2.5
Gio Gonzalez: 3.4

No starter with even an outside shot at a Cy Young Award comes close to Gonzalez's 3.4 walks per nine. If he corrects that, he will be really special.

 

Price and Dickey. Just wish Sal Maglie was here to see a knuckleballer win the Cy Young, for Jim Bouton's sake.

 

97 snappers.