Could the Hartford Whalers be reborn?

Freelance Hack · Jan 20, 2009

lisa_simpson said:

2muchcoffeeman said:

hockeybeat said:

Diabeetus said:

As someone not versed in hockey but interested in it when I can see it, any chance of the Isles coming to KC?
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The Isles are playing a preseason game in KC.

My best guess is that Charles Wang will sell the team to someone in KC (Lamar Hunt?).
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Died December 2006.

I'd be shocked if the Islanders moved.
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AEG manages and is the majority partner of the Sprint Center; they will have not-inconsiderable influence over who, if anyone, purchases an NHL team for KC. The Hunt family will not go for it, and there are few individuals in KC with the kind of personal capital needed to take on a professional sports franchise, even one struggling financially.
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Also, wouldn't the Hunt family need the NFL's blessing if it were to pursue another sports team? I thought the league had clear rules mandating that its owners could not own other major sports teams without its permission.

bostonbred · Jan 20, 2009

i would love to see this.

those connecticut folks loved their whalers.

Smasher_Sloan · Jan 20, 2009

bostonbred said:

i would love to see this.

those connecticut folks loved their whalers.
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Not enough, apparently.

hockeybeat · Jan 20, 2009

From Wiki:

Departure from Hartford

The primary factors in the Whalers' departure from Hartford were market size and the lack of a modern playing facility. Hartford was the second-smallest U.S.-based market in the NHL (ahead of only Buffalo)--a difficulty only exacerbated by its location on the dividing line between the traditional home territories for New York City and Boston. For most of their NHL history, the Whalers attracted their biggest crowds when either the Rangers or Bruins came to town and brought thousands of their fans with them. In addition, the Hartford Civic Center had a capacity of 15,635--the smallest in the league. It also had no luxury suites, and was attached to a mall. As salaries throughout the league escalated and teams began moving into larger, corporate-sponsored stadiums with luxury suites and other amenities, it became apparent that a small-market team playing in an aging municipal arena with limited revenue streams could not compete in the NHL.

In 1994, Compuware founder Peter Karmanos purchased the Whalers and pledged to keep them in Hartford for four years. However, two years later, frustrated with lackluster attendance and little corporate support, he announced that if the Whalers were unable to sell at least 11,000 season tickets for the 1996–97 season, he would likely move the team. Furthermore, ownership only made season tickets available in full-season (41-game) packages, eliminating the popular five- and ten-game "mini plans," in a strategy largely designed to spur purchases from wealthier corporations and individuals. Sales were underwhelming at the beginning of the campaign, and at the end of the 1995–96 season it was still unknown whether the Whalers would stay in Connecticut or move. However, thanks to an aggressive marketing campaign, and the creative efforts of many fans (who pooled together resources to purchase some of the full-season packages collectively) the Whalers announced that they would stay in Connecticut through at least 1997.

In early 1996, negotiations between the Whalers and Connecticut Governor John G. Rowland to build a new $147.5 million arena seemed to be going well. However, talks fell apart when Rowland and the state refused Karmanos' demand to reimburse the Whalers for up to $45 million in losses during the three years the new arena was to be built. As a result, on March 26, 1997, the team announced that it would be leaving Hartford, one of the few times that a team announced it would leave its current city without having already selected a new city. Many suspect that Rowland never had any intention of building a new arena for the Whalers, as he harbored hopes of instead luring the New England Patriots to Connecticut. Those talks also fell apart after the state and the Patriots ownership failed to reach an agreement on a new stadium. [1][2][3]

On April 13, 1997, the Whalers played their last game in Hartford, defeating the Tampa Bay Lightning 2–1. Team captain Kevin Dineen scored the final goal in Whaler history.

As of June 6, 2008, several ex-Whalers are still active in the NHL, including Chris Pronger, Marek Malik, Bobby Holik, Michael Nylander, Jean-Sebastien Giguere and Brendan Shanahan. Glen Wesley was the last Whaler still active with the Carolina/Hartford franchise until he retired on June 5, 2008; although his stint was not continuous, playing seven games for the Toronto Maple Leafs in 2003 after a deadline deal before re-signing in Carolina in the 2003 offseason.[4]

After the Whalers left Hartford, various local businessmen began trying to bring an NHL franchise back to the city. In 2006, developer Lawrence Gottesdiener began lobbying to buy the Pittsburgh Penguins and move them to a new Hartford arena, but the Lemieux Group was reluctant to sell. The Penguins bid fell through in March 2007, when the team announced that they were beginning construction on a new arena and that they signed a 30-year deal with the city of Pittsburgh to keep the team there well into the future. Penguins owner Mario Lemieux even admitted at the arena's ground-breaking ceremony that relocating the franchise was never a possibility, but instead it was a negotiation tactic to help the team get funding for the arena from both state and local officials. After the Pittsburgh bid fell through, Gottesdiener made another bid for the Nashville Predators franchise with the hope of bringing them to Hartford. That bid was lost in August 2007, as the Predators ownership ultimately decided to sell to a local holding company that would keep the team in Nashville. Talks of a new arena in Hartford have been dying since late 2007, and an NHL franchise looks unlikely for the foreseeable future. On January 14, 2009. NHL commissioner, Gary Bettman and Hartford mayor Eddie Perez met to discuss plans for a new arena in Hartford, and the possiblity of bringing back an NHL team. Perez was quoted as saying that Hartford still wants an NHL team but that it would take a considerable amount of work considering the difficult financial times.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hartford_Whalers#Departure_from_Hartford
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Double J · Jan 20, 2009

Smasher_Sloan said:

bostonbred said:

i would love to see this.

those connecticut folks loved their whalers.
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Not enough, apparently.
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That's like saying Brooklyn didn't love the Dodgers enough.

doubledown68 · Jan 20, 2009

Mark2010 said:

What's the arena situation in Hartford these days?

I'm not sure about another NHL team there. Too many teams too close to one another in Boston, Montreal, Ottawa, New York, New Jersey, etc.

I would like to see Kansas City, Milwaukee, Portland or Seattle get a shot.
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I'd rather see the NHL in KC than the NBA. Either way, the Sprint Center is just sitting there, waiting on somebody to move in.

Ashy Larry · Jan 20, 2009

the only way I want another team in Hartford is if the NHL drops 6 teams and moves one of the remaining 24 to Hartford....

PCLoadLetter · Jan 20, 2009

You know, every time people start talking about bringing back the Whale or moving a team back to Winnipeg, they ignore one small detail: they left because no one gave a shit about the team. The Wikipedia entry points out that Hartford had the smallest arena in the league, but seems to ignore the fact that they still routinely had 4,000 empty seats.

Average attendance for the last 6 seasons for the Whalers:

'91 - '92: 10,896 (3rd worst)
'92 - '93: 10,144 (2nd worst, barely better than Tampa Bay in their 1st year)
'93 - '94: 10,492 (2nd worst)
'94 - '95: 11,822 (2nd worst)
'95 - '96: 11,967 (3rd worst)
'96 - '97: 13,680 (3rd worst, despite the "Save the Whale!" campaign)

Sorry, Hartford, but no. Loved the jersey, though. One of the best logos in sports.

And Portland comes up each time, and as a non-NHL city with an NHL-ready arena I can understand why. But as someone who has attended plenty of hockey games in Portland I think it would be a complete failure. The Portland Winterhawks have very loyal and supportive fans who don't know shit about hockey. It's the only place I've seen where the fans (a) yell at the refs for icing calls, and (b) scream "call it both ways!" at the refs for failing to call icing on the other team... when the other team is on a penalty kill. And I have heard both more than once, when I was surrounded by season ticket holders. These are not people who are going to pay NHL prices to see hockey.

Double J · Jan 20, 2009

Portland was one of the earliest successful U.S. markets for hockey back in the mid 1910s (the first American city to mount a challenge for the Stanley Cup) and the game has always, always done well there.

Why are there apparently so many know-nothing fans there?

PCLoadLetter · Jan 20, 2009

Double J said:

Portland was one of the earliest successful U.S. markets for hockey back in the mid 1910s (the first American city to mount a challenge for the Stanley Cup) and the game has always, always done well there.

Why are there apparently so many know-nothing fans there?
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I don't know. It was absolutely bizarre. And I grew up going to LA Kings games in the 70s and 80s, so it's not like I was used to crowds that were all that knowledgeable in the first place.

One other thing about Portland: is has a good rep for supporting teams because the Blazers used to sell out every game, but once they moved out of a shoebox size arena that ended. I just can't see another team succeeding there.

Ashy Larry · Jan 20, 2009

Double J said:

Portland was one of the earliest successful U.S. markets for hockey back in the mid 1910s (the first American city to mount a challenge for the Stanley Cup) and the game has always, always done well there.

Why are there apparently so many know-nothing fans there?
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they're all dead now.

PCLoadletter.....I don't know why but I found that icing story hilarious!

Oz · Jan 20, 2009

PCLoadLetter said:

One other thing about Portland: is has a good rep for supporting teams because the Blazers used to sell out every game, but once they moved out of a shoebox size arena that ended. I just can't see another team succeeding there.
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Was it that, or was it Blazers fans becoming disenfranchised with the Jail Blazers? I'm going with the latter there.

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