Topic: Obama Negatives

[Zeke12]

[Zeke12]

LMAO.

There have been times, after his infuriatingly-frequent capitulations to the wingnuts, when I have scorched Obama as bad or worse than any of the righties on the board.

Go back to the original list of 11 items, I give Obama an unconditional passing grade on one or two, I think.

I'll give you that.

I think some of the unconditional Obama love comes from those who kissed the ground he walked on four years ago and don't want to admit that he really has been nothing more than a mediocre president.

I think the facts and history will disagree with you by a longshot.

[zagoshe]

LMAO.

There have been times, after his infuriatingly-frequent capitulations to the wingnuts, when I have scorched Obama as bad or worse than any of the righties on the board.

Go back to the original list of 11 items, I give Obama an unconditional passing grade on one or two, I think.

I'll give you that.

I think some of the unconditional Obama love comes from those who kissed the ground he walked on four years ago and don't want to admit that he really has been nothing more than a mediocre president.

I think the facts and history will disagree with you by a longshot.

Actually, Zeke is correct Mizzou - Calling Obama a mediocre President is being far too generous as he has been an extreme disappointment and mostly a disaster.

And given how high expectations were for him, he'll go down as one of the biggest failures in the history of the office.

[RickStain]

2008 was liberaldom's big chance to make some serious gains. I had high hopes for Obama, both as a champion of liberal causes and as a serious thinker who would do something about the long-term structural economic problems instead of just band-aiding on solutions that would cause more problems in the long run.

Instead, we got the health plan that Newt Gingrich was championing in the 1990s and a whole lot of tax cuts fueling massive, unsustainable debt levels.

Mediocrity is probably fair, in the sense that at least he has merely failed to accomplish anything on the social front instead of making things worse in the long run, as he did with the economy.

He's passed a lot of bad ideas. Ideas he *knows* are bad, but he just wants to be able to say he got something passed. It's not his fault that he has to deal with a ridiculous conservative obstructionist movement, but sometimes it is okay to just not do anything.

[Azrael]

Actually, Zeke is correct Mizzou - Calling Obama a mediocre President is being far too generous as he has been an extreme disappointment and mostly a disaster.

And given how high expectations were for him, he'll go down as one of the biggest failures in the history of the office.

I'm sure you'll receive a nice muffin basket from the Harding estate for saying so.

[Armchair_QB]

2008 was liberaldom's big chance to make some serious gains. I had high hopes for Obama, both as a champion of liberal causes and as a serious thinker who would do something about the long-term structural economic problems instead of just band-aiding on solutions that would cause more problems in the long run.

Instead, we got the health plan that Newt Gingrich was championing in the 1990s and a whole lot of tax cuts fueling massive, unsustainable debt levels.

Mediocrity is probably fair, in the sense that at least he has merely failed to accomplish anything on the social front instead of making things worse in the long run, as he did with the economy.

He's passed a lot of bad ideas. Ideas he *knows* are bad, but he just wants to be able to say he got something passed. It's not his fault that he has to deal with a ridiculous conservative obstructionist movement, but sometimes it is okay to just not do anything.

Well Iran isn't holding a bunch of Americans hostage in our embassy. That makes him better than Jimmy Carter. So he's got that going for him.

[qtlaw]

Its always easier to criticize than come up with solutions.  (One of the best words of advice I ever got, cross-threading.)

[RickStain]

Its always easier to criticize than come up with solutions.  (One of the best words of advice I ever got, cross-threading.)

More fun, too.

/simpsons referencing to your crossthread

[dooley_womack1]

2008 was liberaldom's big chance to make some serious gains. I had high hopes for Obama, both as a champion of liberal causes and as a serious thinker who would do something about the long-term structural economic problems instead of just band-aiding on solutions that would cause more problems in the long run.

Instead, we got the health plan that Newt Gingrich was championing in the 1990s and a whole lot of tax cuts fueling massive, unsustainable debt levels.

Mediocrity is probably fair, in the sense that at least he has merely failed to accomplish anything on the social front instead of making things worse in the long run, as he did with the economy.

He's passed a lot of bad ideas. Ideas he *knows* are bad, but he just wants to be able to say he got something passed. It's not his fault that he has to deal with a ridiculous conservative obstructionist movement, but sometimes it is okay to just not do anything.

Well, you let a senatorial candidate in Massachusetts suck out loud right under your nose, and you get what's coming to you if you are the Democrats. Kinda strange that Ted Kennedy would have gotten so much that he had fought decades for, but not living to do so threw it all away. If there isn't a better example of politics at all levels mattering, I can't think of it.

[Football_Bat]

I'm glad nobody mentioned this as Obama's biggest negative:



We've certainly moved on beyond that, haven't we?

[franklin lincoln]

Once in office, he has failed to strongly articulate the messages which got him elected and that are still attractive to most voters, thus ceding the court of public opinion to lunatic fringe GOPers who bastardize pretty much everything he stands for.

Ding-ding-ding-a-ding ding.

There is One Word, which if Obama would use Just Once in a press conference, which would probably boost his approval ratings 25 percent.

That word is "bullshit."


Faux Fascist Noise Flunky:

“Your critics will say on Capitol Hill that you want gas prices to go higher because you have said before that will wean the American people off fossil fuels onto renewable fuels,” Henry said. “How do you respond to that?”

Obama: "Bullshit."

Nation roars in approval.

Michael Douglas's "American President" speech boiled into one word.

"Just from a political perspective, do you think the President of the United States going into re-election wants gas prices to be higher?" 

The President's answer sounded like he was making policy based on politics, and it wasn't an actual denial.  It was bad.  "Bullshit" might have been better, but not good.

He does, legitimately, have to deal with this analysis by his energy secretary:

"Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe," Mr. Chu, who directs the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory in California, said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal in September (of 2008).

http://sec.online.wsj.com/article/SB122904040307499791.html

Answer the question directly, and undercut it.  His answer on Tuesday wasn't great at all.

[Yodel]

I've noticed it going around how "Gas only cost $1.69 per gallon when Obama was inaugurated! Look what he's done to gas prices!"

That, of course, conveniently overlooks two facts: It was at $1.69 per gallon at the depths of the recession. Nobody was spending, nobody was driving, there was no demand, so prices plummeted. And I do mean PLUMMETED. The national average was $4.12 per gallon during July of 2008. So let's not act like gas prices were fantastic under Bush.

I suppose certain policies and military actions can affect gas prices, but I think the President's influence over the price at the pump is wildly overrated.

I've seen that a lot too. That year, I was driving back and forth from Alabama to Florida, trying to marry the antichrist. I know gas prices hit $4 or so while I was making that trek.

[steveu]

Unless there is some great surprise at the Republican convention I will be voting for Obama. That said I do
think it's fair to look at his negatives:

1.  Civil Liberties.  instead of ending Bush policies he has ramped them up
2. Failed to close Gitmo as promised
3.  Has not come out in favor of gay marriage
4. Unemployment still at very high levels
5. Started class warfare unnecessarily
6. High gas prices
7. Higher taxes ( see 5)
8.  Escalated war in Afghanistan
9. Obamacare
10 Alienated strongest ally in The Middle East - Israel
11. Failure to develop strong illegal immigrant plan

OK, I'll bite. Let me take these one by one:
1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.
2. By holding detainees at Gitmo, we may be getting valuable information to use against arresting future terror suspects.
3. Not an issue to me. It's inevitable. It's going to happen. And my advice to the GOP, even as I am an avowed conservative, is to not make this an issue. You WILL lose every election where it is an issue if you do. The current generation, and future generations, are or will be more progressive-thinking in this area.
4. Still suspicious here. How many people are on the sidelines not looking for work? How many people are underemployed? (I know I am at the moment.) While the economy is adding jobs, tell the whole story.
5. Obama didn't start class warfare in the first place. If you ever heard a speech by Richard Gephardt, you'd swear you were listening to today's party. Gephardt was a master at the "tax cuts for the wealthy" speech.
6. Not an issue because gas been high under Democrats and Republicans and low under both parties. Gas jumped from 86 cents to $1.25 under Carter in one year. Gas dropped from $1.20 to $1.03 in one year under Clinton.
7. Higher taxes can kill an economic recovery, especially when the economy is in a precarious state like now. This goes for income taxes, payroll taxes, gas taxes...
8. Pulled out the troops instead of leaving some behind in Iraq to oversee the reconstruction process. Yes, I know people will say "they wanted us out"... but until the region is more stable we should have maintained a presence. Iran has a chance to light the whole region up once again.
9. If the Supreme Court rules the mandate isn't constitutional, Obamacare as we know it collapses. Obamacare didn't address free-market purchase of insurance across state lines, malpractice/tort reform, etc. And Nancy didn't help matters any when she uttered that idiotic phrase "Well, we have to pass the bill so you can see what is in it." Ranks right up there with "I didn't inhale", "I did not have sex with that woman" and "I am not a crook" as some of the dumbest phrases uttered by a politician in history.
10. See No. 8. The entire Middle East goes together.
11. I'm going to twist this around and say something should be done so Mexico's war doesn't come across the border. Soon, the border towns might have wars in the streets, people being shot and killed for no reason, etc. Otherwise, I don't think this is as big an issue to some away from border states.

Like with others, I will grant his policy on Osama and Libya worked well.

I would say, however, that along with Michelle Obama's push to curb childhood obesity there seems to be a renewed push to limit or place restrictions on what we can eat as adults/children. Government has no business dictating what food goes in your mouth (and on that, I sound more like a Libertarian.)

Didn't vote for Obama in 2008 and won't again in 2012. I may, however, hold my nose at the choice at the top. (shrugs)

[ifilus]

Unless there is some great surprise at the Republican convention I will be voting for Obama. That said I do
think it's fair to look at his negatives:

1.  Civil Liberties.  instead of ending Bush policies he has ramped them up
2. Failed to close Gitmo as promised
3.  Has not come out in favor of gay marriage
4. Unemployment still at very high levels
5. Started class warfare unnecessarily
6. High gas prices
7. Higher taxes ( see 5)
8.  Escalated war in Afghanistan
9. Obamacare
10 Alienated strongest ally in The Middle East - Israel
11. Failure to develop strong illegal immigrant plan

OK, I'll bite. Let me take these one by one:
1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.
2. By holding detainees at Gitmo, we may be getting valuable information to use against arresting future terror suspects.
3. Not an issue to me. It's inevitable. It's going to happen. And my advice to the GOP, even as I am an avowed conservative, is to not make this an issue. You WILL lose every election where it is an issue if you do. The current generation, and future generations, are or will be more progressive-thinking in this area.
4. Still suspicious here. How many people are on the sidelines not looking for work? How many people are underemployed? (I know I am at the moment.) While the economy is adding jobs, tell the whole story.
5. Obama didn't start class warfare in the first place. If you ever heard a speech by Richard Gephardt, you'd swear you were listening to today's party. Gephardt was a master at the "tax cuts for the wealthy" speech.
6. Not an issue because gas been high under Democrats and Republicans and low under both parties. Gas jumped from 86 cents to $1.25 under Carter in one year. Gas dropped from $1.20 to $1.03 in one year under Clinton.
7. Higher taxes can kill an economic recovery, especially when the economy is in a precarious state like now. This goes for income taxes, payroll taxes, gas taxes...
8. Pulled out the troops instead of leaving some behind in Iraq to oversee the reconstruction process. Yes, I know people will say "they wanted us out"... but until the region is more stable we should have maintained a presence. Iran has a chance to light the whole region up once again.
9. If the Supreme Court rules the mandate isn't constitutional, Obamacare as we know it collapses. Obamacare didn't address free-market purchase of insurance across state lines, malpractice/tort reform, etc. And Nancy didn't help matters any when she uttered that idiotic phrase "Well, we have to pass the bill so you can see what is in it." Ranks right up there with "I didn't inhale", "I did not have sex with that woman" and "I am not a crook" as some of the dumbest phrases uttered by a politician in history.
10. See No. 8. The entire Middle East goes together.
11. I'm going to twist this around and say something should be done so Mexico's war doesn't come across the border. Soon, the border towns might have wars in the streets, people being shot and killed for no reason, etc. Otherwise, I don't think this is as big an issue to some away from border states.

Like with others, I will grant his policy on Osama and Libya worked well.

I would say, however, that along with Michelle Obama's push to curb childhood obesity there seems to be a renewed push to limit or place restrictions on what we can eat as adults/children. Government has no business dictating what food goes in your mouth (and on that, I sound more like a Libertarian.)

Didn't vote for Obama in 2008 and won't again in 2012. I may, however, hold my nose at the choice at the top. (shrugs)

So which, pray tell, of the Repub clowns do you honestly believe is capable of doing a better job?
And why/how?

[Boom_70]

Unless there is some great surprise at the Republican convention I will be voting for Obama. That said I do
think it's fair to look at his negatives:

1.  Civil Liberties.  instead of ending Bush policies he has ramped them up
2. Failed to close Gitmo as promised
3.  Has not come out in favor of gay marriage
4. Unemployment still at very high levels
5. Started class warfare unnecessarily
6. High gas prices
7. Higher taxes ( see 5)
8.  Escalated war in Afghanistan
9. Obamacare
10 Alienated strongest ally in The Middle East - Israel
11. Failure to develop strong illegal immigrant plan

OK, I'll bite. Let me take these one by one:
1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.
2. By holding detainees at Gitmo, we may be getting valuable information to use against arresting future terror suspects.
3. Not an issue to me. It's inevitable. It's going to happen. And my advice to the GOP, even as I am an avowed conservative, is to not make this an issue. You WILL lose every election where it is an issue if you do. The current generation, and future generations, are or will be more progressive-thinking in this area.
4. Still suspicious here. How many people are on the sidelines not looking for work? How many people are underemployed? (I know I am at the moment.) While the economy is adding jobs, tell the whole story.
5. Obama didn't start class warfare in the first place. If you ever heard a speech by Richard Gephardt, you'd swear you were listening to today's party. Gephardt was a master at the "tax cuts for the wealthy" speech.
6. Not an issue because gas been high under Democrats and Republicans and low under both parties. Gas jumped from 86 cents to $1.25 under Carter in one year. Gas dropped from $1.20 to $1.03 in one year under Clinton.
7. Higher taxes can kill an economic recovery, especially when the economy is in a precarious state like now. This goes for income taxes, payroll taxes, gas taxes...
8. Pulled out the troops instead of leaving some behind in Iraq to oversee the reconstruction process. Yes, I know people will say "they wanted us out"... but until the region is more stable we should have maintained a presence. Iran has a chance to light the whole region up once again.
9. If the Supreme Court rules the mandate isn't constitutional, Obamacare as we know it collapses. Obamacare didn't address free-market purchase of insurance across state lines, malpractice/tort reform, etc. And Nancy didn't help matters any when she uttered that idiotic phrase "Well, we have to pass the bill so you can see what is in it." Ranks right up there with "I didn't inhale", "I did not have sex with that woman" and "I am not a crook" as some of the dumbest phrases uttered by a politician in history.
10. See No. 8. The entire Middle East goes together.
11. I'm going to twist this around and say something should be done so Mexico's war doesn't come across the border. Soon, the border towns might have wars in the streets, people being shot and killed for no reason, etc. Otherwise, I don't think this is as big an issue to some away from border states.

Like with others, I will grant his policy on Osama and Libya worked well.

I would say, however, that along with Michelle Obama's push to curb childhood obesity there seems to be a renewed push to limit or place restrictions on what we can eat as adults/children. Government has no business dictating what food goes in your mouth (and on that, I sound more like a Libertarian.)

Didn't vote for Obama in 2008 and won't again in 2012. I may, however, hold my nose at the choice at the top. (shrugs)

So which, pray tell, of the Repub clowns do you honestly believe is capable of doing a better job?
And why/how?

There already a fine thread for that discourse. Please leave this one to Obama discussion.

[RickStain]

1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.

I've got an elephant-repelling rock to sell you. A bit pricey, but I'm sure you'll be a satisfied customer.

[Azrael]

1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.

I've got an elephant-repelling rock to sell you. A bit pricey, but I'm sure you'll be a satisfied customer.

Because assigning "keeps us safe" as a value to a president is impossible? Or because "keeps us safe" can't be assigned to this president?

[RickStain]

1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.

I've got an elephant-repelling rock to sell you. A bit pricey, but I'm sure you'll be a satisfied customer.

Because assigning "keeps us safe" as a value to a president is impossible? Or because "keeps us safe" can't be assigned to this president?

Because bad logic is bad, regardless of whether a President keeps us safe or not.

[Azrael]

1. We haven't had a broad-scale terrorist attack since 9/11. This includes nearly four years of a Democratic administration. You may feel like your rights are being infringed upon, but I think we are a safer country.

I've got an elephant-repelling rock to sell you. A bit pricey, but I'm sure you'll be a satisfied customer.

Because assigning "keeps us safe" as a value to a president is impossible? Or because "keeps us safe" can't be assigned to this president?

Because bad logic is bad, regardless of whether a President keeps us safe or not.

How 'bad' is the logic here?

[RickStain]

Pretty bad.

"Infringing civil liberties is protecting our safety because since it began happening, we've had no terrorist attacks."

"This rock protects me from elephant attacks. Since I bought it, I haven't been attacked by a single elephant."

The governments actions may or may not be effective at preventing large-scale terrorist attacks on American soil. But considering they weren't exactly prevelant in the years leading up to 9/11 either, it's still bad logic simply to reference the lack of attacks as proof.

[Azrael]

Thanks.

[YankeeFan]

Pretty bad.

"Infringing civil liberties is protecting our safety because since it began happening, we've had no terrorist attacks."

"This rock protects me from elephant attacks. Since I bought it, I haven't been attacked by a single elephant."

The governments actions may or may not be effective at preventing large-scale terrorist attacks on American soil. But considering they weren't exactly prevelant in the years leading up to 9/11 either, it's still bad logic simply to reference the lack of attacks as proof.

But, we've actually prevented terrorist attacks.

[Boom_70]

Obama gets low ratings on handling of economy and fuel prices:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/gas-prices-sink-obamas-ratings-on-economy-bring-parity-to-race-for-white-house/2012/03/11/gIQAuhYO6R_story.html?sub=AR

[deskslave]

Pretty bad.

"Infringing civil liberties is protecting our safety because since it began happening, we've had no terrorist attacks."

"This rock protects me from elephant attacks. Since I bought it, I haven't been attacked by a single elephant."

The governments actions may or may not be effective at preventing large-scale terrorist attacks on American soil. But considering they weren't exactly prevelant in the years leading up to 9/11 either, it's still bad logic simply to reference the lack of attacks as proof.

But, we've actually prevented terrorist attacks.

That STILL doesn't prove that infringing on civil liberties was the reason for it.

[Mizzougrad96]

Obama gets low ratings on handling of economy and fuel prices:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/gas-prices-sink-obamas-ratings-on-economy-bring-parity-to-race-for-white-house/2012/03/11/gIQAuhYO6R_story.html?sub=AR

That poll was pretty eye-opening. It also had that Santorum and Romney were both within 2 or 3 points in the poll.

I wonder if that's all based on gas prices.

I still think Obama's numbers will go up considerably once he hits the campaign trail.