UPDATE: Cabrera over Trout for A.L. MVP

Dick Whitman · Nov 23, 2012

outofplace said:

Dick Whitman said:

outofplace said:

Dick Whitman said:

outofplace said:

Dick Whitman said:

outofplace said:

Dick Whitman said:

outofplace said:

Dick Whitman said:

WPA tells us, in the accumulated history of baseball, what percentage of the time a team won and what percentage of the time a team lost given largely identical game circumstances.

It is a perfect measurement of this, no less so than 2 plus 2 equals 4 is a perfect expression of that particular action.
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Again, that's not even what you said when you brought it up. Please don't hurt yourself carrying those goalposts all over the field.
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Cite your work, please.
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Read your own posts.
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WPA measures what it says it measures.

Please cite to posts where I have indicated otherwise.

Thank you.
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Already did. Apparently, you can't read, either.
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I'm not sure I understand your objection at this point.

It seems to be, "WPA isn't perfect. Therefore, WPA isn't useful."

Would you say the same about batting average?
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Where did I say it wasn't useful? Nowhere.

My issue is you keep going back and forth between saying that it isn't perfect and then saying that it is. You wouldn't get into these things if you would just admit that the usefulness of the advanced metrics that you love so much is subjective instead of just insulting anybody who refuses to buy in.
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It's not perfect because it doesn't take into account these teams and players.

But it is, simultaneously, a perfect measurement of what it actually measures.

Same with batting average.

Not perfect because it doesn't account for this pitcher or this count. Or extra based.

But perfect at measuring what it actually does measure .
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So, your argument is that it is theoretically perfect, but not practically, because once you apply it, that's when the flaws are there. Still useful, in your mind at least, but flawed.

Again, this is exactly the kind of bullshit I was talking about.
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No.

That's not my argument.

Dick Whitman · Nov 23, 2012

WPA is a useful rough approximation of the value a player actually provided to his team.

I like it a lot because it gets us out of the award determination where we are penalizing guys for what SHOULD HAVE happened and instead evaluating WHAT DID happen.

outofplace · Nov 23, 2012

Dick Whitman said:

WPA is a useful rough approximation of the value a player actually provided to his team.

I like it a lot because it gets us out of the award determination where we are penalizing guys for what SHOULD HAVE happened and instead evaluating WHAT DID happen.
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Yeah, because the AL MVP being decided by the guy having the best batting average, home run total, RBI total and OPS had nothing to do with what did happen.

Dick Whitman · Nov 23, 2012

outofplace said:

Dick Whitman said:

WPA is a useful rough approximation of the value a player actually provided to his team.

I like it a lot because it gets us out of the award determination where we are penalizing guys for what SHOULD HAVE happened and instead evaluating WHAT DID happen.
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Yeah, because the AL MVP being decided by the guy having the best batting average, home run total, RBI total and OPS had nothing to do with what did happen.
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It definitely did.

But I want to know more.

Versatile · Nov 23, 2012

It must be nice to have never lost an argument in your lives.

waterytart · Nov 23, 2012

Strange that people can be that smart, and not know how to edit down the quote function.

Dick Whitman · Nov 23, 2012

waterytart said:

Strange that people can be that smart, and not know how to edit down the quote function.
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More a function of iPhone small screen logistics.

waterytart · Nov 23, 2012

Fair point.

Azrael · Nov 24, 2012

Quick! Down the rabbithole!

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UPDATE: Cabrera over Trout for A.L. MVP

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UPDATE: Cabrera over Trout for A.L. MVP

Dick Whitman Well-Known Member

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