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"Tubby's our basketball coach"

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by ondeadline, Mar 12, 2007.

  1. Bob Slydell

    Bob Slydell Active Member

    Because he can make 2 million a year and be worshipped by a basketball-crazy fan base, provided he wins.

    Kentucky provides more opportunity than any other school in the country not named Duke, UNC, UCLA or Kansas. It's pressure like no other place, but the rewards and are too much for the ego-obsessed big time coaches to not seriously look at.

    Rick Bozich, who has already said Tubby should leave, has a good column today.

    http://www.courier-journal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070313/COLUMNISTS01/703130480/1002/SPORTS
     
  2. Armchair_QB

    Armchair_QB Well-Known Member

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  3. Hammer Pants

    Hammer Pants Active Member

    I don't buy the money argument at all. Not one bit. Every other SEC East school except Vanderbilt could pay every dime UK could for a basketball coach.

    You know that sport they play on Saturdays in the fall? Yeah, they get a little money from that. Florida, Tennessee and Georgia can go dollar-for-dollar with anyone, and South Carolina isn't hurting financially.
     
  4. chester

    chester Member

    And Kentucky could go dollar-for-dollar with Florida, Tennessee and Georgia for a football coach, but there's a reason why most would go to one of the latter three schools over Kentucky. I don't think money is necessarily going to lure a coach to Kentucky. I think it's the name recognition and the tradition and the status and all of that which will draw some, not everyone, to the job. It's the same reason why Bill Self left a very good situation at Illinois to go to Kansas. Illinois can go dollar-for-dollar with Kansas any day of the week. But Illinois' program isn't Kansas in terms of where it stands in the college basketball universe.
     
  5. CollegeJournalist

    CollegeJournalist Active Member

    Except that none have them have proven they will, and other than maybe Florida and Tennessee, I don't think either of them would. IIRC, UK increased Smith's pay when they took him from UGa. Did UGa match them?

    It's not just money. There is NO opportunity in the SEC like there is at Kentucky. There are a very limited number of schools in the country that offer the opportunity UK does--I'd say Duke, UNC and IU (and maybe UCLA) are the only ones that are close, since their fanbases are almost 100% basketball-first and they command most of the state behind them.

    Anyone who doesn't think UK could land one of the top 2 or 3 coaches they'd target is mistaken, IMO. They landed their 2nd choice when they were coming off probation, and HE was an NBA coach with a Final Four under his belt. So excuse me if I find it hard to believe that the outlook at UK is so bad that there's not a top-tier coach that would take the job.
     
  6. OnTheRiver

    OnTheRiver Active Member

    Yeah, because no one's bolted Kansas in the past decade, right Oz? ;)
     
  7. novelist_wannabe

    novelist_wannabe Well-Known Member

    Don't get me wrong -- I know this is a plum job. I just don't see it as a significant improvement for Donavan, and they are absolute idiots for wanting to get rid of Tubby Smith. This ain't the 1950s. College basketball is much more competitive now than it was then.
     
  8. CollegeJournalist

    CollegeJournalist Active Member

    That's true, but it's a different situation. Unless Self holds some secret infatuation for Kentucky that parallels Roy's love for UNC, I can't see him leaving Lawrence for Lexington.

    Though I'm quite sure UK fans would welcome a former Jayhawk with open arms. It only resulted in 4 national titles the last time they did.

    And novelist, I can see both sides of it. Personally, as someone who grew up a UK fan, I'm not sold that Tubby Smith has the attitude necessary to coach at a program as demanding as UK. He doesn't like dealing with the media, he hates recruiting and he's terribly disorganized. And I think his abilities as a bench coach are slightly overrated.

    But, at the same time, I'm inclined to believe some of the players are responsible for this. Rondo was a cancer last year, and Morris, Bradley and Crawford don't exactly act like they want to be at UK all the time. They're soft and they don't know how to win.

    I don't think it matters, since Tubby's going to be back. It's a few of the assistants that won't be--which should help, IMO.
     
  9. Oz

    Oz Well-Known Member

    Bill Self called Kansas his dream job, before he even got the job. He was an assistant on KU's 1986 Final Four team under Larry Brown and eventually came back to where his coaching career began. He's got no ties to Kentucky that I know of, so there's that.

    That's why I'm skeptical of anyone who says Self would leave for Lexington "in a heartbeat."
     
  10. Bob Slydell

    Bob Slydell Active Member

    Self wouldn't leave Kansas. This is a job he wanted. Plus, he's not a better coach than Tubby. Recruiter maybe, but not coach.

    We'll see how quick Kansas gets knocked out again with such a great team. Maybe Self will cry like Roy used to.

    And coaches love a challenge, and no matter where they are, the ego and dollars will be enough to lure away some excellent coaches. Think someone like Gillespie at Texas A&M wouldn't jump at the chance to come to Lexington? Or Fox at Nevada?
     
  11. CollegeJournalist

    CollegeJournalist Active Member

    How many people really buy the argument that Tubby is "one of the top 5 bench coaches in America"? Sure, Vitale has pimped that like Smith is a Dookie, but as far as reality, I'm not so sure.

    Smith can't coach a lick off offense unless he's got players that already know what they're doing, a la the 1998-99 teams. In 2003, when UK was a decent offensive team, it was all driven by their pressure defense, a defensive style they haven't come close to emulating in the last few years.

    UK has no semblance of an offensive style, and if Morris isn't in the game or effective inside, then UK has to resort to Meeks or Crawford going to the hoop--something they've done a little in the last few games but hardly at all in the first half of the season.

    And as for Tubby's ball-line defense, it's outstanding if you judge defense on shooting percentage, but it's very susceptible to the dribble-drive and kick out for three, which is how shooting teams like Vandy and some mid-majors have made a living against UK. It's a good defensive style, but unless you have players that optimize it, it's not as effective. And UK doesn't have very many guys committed to playing hard-nosed defense right now.

    And if you watch UK on inbounds plays and out of timeouts, they're terrible. They struggle to score out of timeouts on drawn-up plays, because if the first option isn't there, they have no clue what to do. And since the first option is Morris 99.9% of the time, it's not tough to defend. I know tons of UK fans that called them not getting a shot off on the last possession against Miss. St., and it wasn't a bold prediction. It just comes from watching the same thing over and over again. And don't get any of them started on how bad UK is at the simple inbounds pass.

    I'm not saying Tubby is a bad bench coach. He's better than most. But, at least with these players, he's not one of the "top 5 bench coaches in the game," no matter how much Dicky V pimps him as such.
     
  12. Rufino

    Rufino Active Member

    Billy Donovan is not leaving UF for UK or any other college job. He's got the best of both worlds - a cash rich athletic department willing to spend whatever he needs on basketball and none of the over the top pressure that goes with a program like UK. He will be the hoops god at UF even if he has a bad year or two.

    At some point when his kids are older (oldest is a ninth grader) he will likely try the NBA, but UK will not pay him more than UF. Jeremy Foley's athletic department prints money - no way they get outbid by UK, nor do I believe UK is dumb enough to try and end up looking like they got a third or fourth choice like Bama. Calipari is Kentucky's guy when the time comes.
     
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