1. Welcome to SportsJournalists.com, a friendly forum for discussing all things sports and journalism.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register for a free account to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Access to private conversations with other members.
    • Fewer ads.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

This is the kind of stuff that needs to be done more often

Discussion in 'Journalism topics only' started by Elliotte Friedman, Dec 22, 2010.

  1. Double Down

    Double Down Well-Known Member

    I've always been a big fan of Bradley. I think that, for those of us who take writing seriously, there are a lot of writers regularly read and discussed, but it can be tough to discuss writing here. I know it makes me weary sometimes.

    I remember reading this Bradley story a long time ago about Ricky Williams and thinking it was a really daring approach with the story. It's essentially a back-and-forth between Williams and Bradley, although Bradley is writing in the second person, and I think it captures what Ricky was like at that point in his life pretty accurately. Angry, unhappy, manic, sad.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1018591/1/index.htm
     
  2. Dick Whitman

    Dick Whitman Well-Known Member

    There is some great insight in "It Never Rains in Tiger Stadium" about becoming a writer. At one point, Bradley is assigned to cover a football game for the New York Times. But he can't bring himself to do it.

    He says something along the lines of, "I'm just not that kind of writer."

    As a former beat writer who was positively not cut out for it, that moment was poignant to me, although a lot of civilian readers probably couldn't relate. But in a world in which I constantly was asked about what it was like to have such a "dream job," it was awesome to read that someone like Bradley related. Bradley had two "dream" positions - player on LSU and sports writer with what seemed to be his pick of gigs. But neither satisfied him. And that didn't mean he was ungrateful, which I always told myself I was for wanting to write columns and long-form and non-sports stories.

    Anyway, sorry for the threadjack. Guess I just really loved that book.
     
  3. playthrough

    playthrough Moderator Staff Member

    When I read that, all I could think of was "how many local beat writers would get one-on-one time like that with a big-time coach nowadays?" Not an office interview, but a road trip. Not too darned many.
     
  4. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    I echo the sentiments on John Ed Bradley. "It Never Rains In Tiger Stadium" is a great book. His stories about his coach Charlie Mclendon and Bear Bryant are fabulous.

    I always seem to be drawn in by the ex football player turned writer angst genre. You could also add Rick Telander to this list and perhaps make Pat Conroy an honorary member.

    All clearly show what a lasting impression that a coach can have on a young persons life.
     
  5. Alma

    Alma Well-Known Member

    First of all, the original Friedgen story was pretty terrific, aside from the final words "let his eyes fill with tears." That's called crying, and "cried" was the right word to choose.

    I thought the blog recollection was good, although the parallel between big news holes and a Maryland football coach were a little forced for my taste. It's a perfect fit for a blog, and it's that little extra peek or insight that, one day, people will pay for or some advertiser will sponsor. A personal blog on a newspaper site is precisely where a reporter should "unpack the notebook" and let the reader see something that maybe didn't fit perfectly into a story.

    Here's someone who I think does it well and consistently. If you read several entries, you'll notice it's a lot of stuff that doesn't easily fit into a story, but is a compilation of thoughts and observations that goes into a reporter's daily beat life. Now, I don't give two blue poops about this particular team, but I'll tell you: A fan of Missouri football would know them - and the reporter - damn well after a season of reading this:

    http://www.columbiatribune.com/weblogs/behind-the-stripes/

    And here's an entry to give you a sense of how it works:

    http://www.columbiatribune.com/weblogs/behind-the-stripes/2010/dec/17/mu-coaches-reeled-in-richardson-with-a-hammer/
     
  6. buckweaver

    buckweaver Active Member

    Part of the reason Kevin's piece worked for me and Wright's on Cleveland didn't work was because Kevin revealed something about himself here, which made his insertion into the narrative essential.

    The reason I often have distaste for Wright Thompson's first-person stories is because there's rarely any depth to his character in the story, at least in my opinion. He just doesn't reveal that much about himself. Why should I care what he's doing? Why should I care why he's there? I don't know anything about him, at least from reading it. (His Masters story was a notable exception.)

    When I read Posnanski -- especially the two entries DD linked to above -- I learn so much about him (or at least he makes me feel like I do.) And his stories are interesting. There's some insight to his personality.

    Two of my favorite baseball beat writers today are Dave O'Brien (Atlanta) and C. Trent Rosecrans (Cincinnati-based). During the course of a season, both of them are personable, humorous and engaging in their first-person pieces on their blogs. That's what makes it work so well.

    A lot of writers can't pull that off.
     
  7. old_tony

    old_tony Well-Known Member

    In reality, this piece is only possible from the experience of having taken that ride and spent that day. And newspapers are getting rid of people with that kind of experience because they cost too much. Stories like this will eventually dry up and completely go away from newspapers and be available only on sites such as ESPN.com -- which seems able to hire so many of the top writers. But the top writers that are being hired by ESPN make up just a small percentage of the really good and capable writers that are out there.

    There's great value in "having been there" that editors today completely blow off. Today they value attitude over aptitude and experience. They all are looking for the next "new thing" writer -- some kid who shoots video with his iPhone and posts crappy interviews on their website because their "next new thing" is in reality at best a so-so reporter. They think they're saving or re-inventing the industry. In reality they're destroying it. As said above, people want good stories about people. But storytellers aren't valued. Just bells and whistles.
     
  8. Dog8Cats

    Dog8Cats Well-Known Member

    Well, those are about the most intelligent and mature questions I've seen raised on this forum about a topic such as this ...

    And (I think sadly), as you raise them in such an intelligent and mature way, a way that doesn't translate to online traffic, I wonder how much impact your commitment to analyzing this piece will ever have. (Sigh.)


     
  9. AD

    AD Active Member

    i'm one of the people who've railed against gratuitous first-person, and as i said above, i loved this piece. why? because it's a once-in-a-career moment. i suspect kevin -- like most of us -- may have three or four more stories like this where his presence in the copy is not only necessary, it deepens the driving experience with friedgen. it's his interaction with the coach that helps open the coach up; it advances our understanding of friedgen. yes, we learn more about kevin, but it never feels like kevin thinks kevin is the story.

    my point is: first person can work beautifully if it's used rarely. just because a writer is there doesn't make his presence powerful or interesting or -- most of all -- a useful vehicle to expose the subject. too much reliance on it can make a writer self-important and sloppy real fast.
     
  10. Harry Doyle

    Harry Doyle Member

    There are so many reasons this piece worked, and Kevin did a tremendous job — just like always. I think the question about when and why first person works is perhaps the most critical to this piece. As a writer in this situation, Kevin found an incredible balance. Sometimes, first person is an absolutely necessary. No one else was able to tell this story about the Fridge — obviously, no one else was in the car — and it wouldn't have all worked if Kevin told a third-person story about the coach's drive to Pennsylvania. So he has to put himself there. I firmly believe this piece wouldn't have worked, at all, if Kev had just made himself another character. As the narrator, you have to almost defend your presence in the story. Kevin does that with the snippets about his own football past and about his father, etc.. With those, he actually tells us more about his subject, even though on the surface he is telling us about himself.

    Really, though, I think what separates this story from any other blog posts I suspect we all have done is the pace. We all have written the coach-leaves-so-i-recount-my-most-memorable-run-in-with-said-coach story. Kevin slows it way down, and puts a great deal of thought into the meaning of what he's saying. Even something as simple as, "Kevin, we're going to have to change that," says so much about who Friedgen is and what was important to him. I see striking similarities between this piece and the work Chris Jones is doing on his My Second Empire blog. I suspect that isn't an accident.
     
  11. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    Can't put my finger on it but story has kind of a "Last Picture Show" quality to it.
     
  12. mcgovern72

    mcgovern72 Member

    I am forever amused reading the "rules" of reporting/writing/interviewing that appear on this board when in fact there aren't any, other than getting it right.
     
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page