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"The Force Awakens" (with SPOILERS)

Discussion in 'Anything goes' started by Dick Whitman, Dec 18, 2015.

  1. Alma

    Alma Well-Known Member

    I didn't as much, and not because some of the twistsaroos don't work - they do. But I'm ready to see Johnson do something different. And I felt like Jedi was more Brick/Brothers Bloom - especially with some of the snappy, noirish dialogue ("I wish I could put a fist through this whole beautiful lousy town") - than Looper. And while I don't mind a director turning his original impulses up, at some point, you feel like the audience is being offered a lecture on how much smarter the director is than the audience.

    Which, when it comes to Star Wars, Johnson had to know it was going to come back at him. Some of Johnson's Twitter thoughts as it relates to criticism - https://news.avclub.com/rian-johnson-and-christopher-mcquarrie-have-pretty-diff-1827363452 - are just...a little too postmodern for my taste.

    FWIW, I don't think Johnson would say the Canto segment is pointless for the sake of it. He's creating a moral statement in that segment of the film. Rose and Finn are far less naive than they were for their time on the planet, and Johnson, like many young progressives, seems to think naivete is a very, very bad thing to possess. (See Kylo disabusing Rey of any notion that she comes from special parents, or the whole Luke arc.)

    My general reaction watching the movie was kind of a shrug. Liked parts of it. Saw Johnson's passive/aggressive fingerprints all over other parts. Never reaches the moment of The Force Awakens when Rey and Kylo duel in the forest or, for that matter, when Rey sees Luke at the very end. I know people who saw TFA three times just for that shot. To have Johnson piss in their face was not helpful. There were ways to create the same Luke pathos without him being an asshole about the saber in that scene. That "asshole" moment was Johnson's commentary on the TFA, and frankly all of the prequels, and the shit he got for it wasn't entirely undeserved.
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2018
  2. Deskgrunt50

    Deskgrunt50 Well-Known Member

    A friend of mine said this after he saw the flick. When I watched it, it was pretty clear how he knew. Forgive me, cut and paste:

    "Before Poe starts his mutiny, he radios Finn to inform him that Vice Admiral Holdo is planning to flee the cruiser and head to the surface and they need to get the tracker down ASAP to make the jump to hyperspace. During this scene, (del Toro's character) is in a chair behind Finn listening to the whole conversation. The film even makes a point of cutting to his face showing him looking interested."

    The movie had some issues and needed a trim. But I don't think this is the plot hole some have made it out to be.
     
  3. Junkie

    Junkie Well-Known Member

    Why is Empire always looked at as the gold standard? I see it as the lesser of the original three, especially upon its release, when it needed "Tune in next week, same Star Wars time, same Star Wars channel ..." at the end.
     
  4. Double Down

    Double Down Well-Known Member

    Gotcha. Missed that. Thanks.
     
    Deskgrunt50 likes this.
  5. Double Down

    Double Down Well-Known Member

    garrow and Deskgrunt50 like this.
  6. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    I think part of the appeal is the darkness of the story. The Rebels lose. They have to run from their base as the Imperials destroy it. Han is betrayed by his friend, encased in carbonite and the last-minute rescue attempt fails. He ends the movie in the hands of Boba Fett on the way to Jabba the Hutt. Luke Skywalker loses his fight with Darth Vader, getting his hand chopped off in the battle, and narrowly escapes.

    Leaving the audience wanting more can be a good thing. Fans left that movie wondering how the story would be resolved. They didn't have that with the original, when nobody knew there would be more movies, or after Return of the Jedi, which was seemingly the end of the story. Lucas understood the appeal of "to be continued..." He said many times that old movie serials were an inspiration for Star Wars.

    I think the movie also gave Harrison Ford the opportunity to shine. We didn't really see that much of his character development in the first movie. He was the same scoundrel until the heroic turn at the end. In Empire, we see him trying to figure out how to be something else, especially in his relationship with Leia.

    These are just guesses. The original is still my favorite, then Empire ahead of Jedi.
     
  7. KJIM

    KJIM Well-Known Member

  8. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    I am curious how they are going to make the unseen footage of Carrie Fisher work. I kind of liked when they used footage from the original in Rogue One, but it could certainly be awkward.
     
  9. Deskgrunt50

    Deskgrunt50 Well-Known Member

  10. Deskgrunt50

    Deskgrunt50 Well-Known Member

    That was CGI in Rogue One with Fisher. Different actor, same as they did with Peter Cushing. Both were very well done.
     
  11. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    I know that was CGI with different actors. I'm talking about the shots of Rebel pilots during the battle at the end. Some were new shots and some were footage left over from the original.
     
  12. Deskgrunt50

    Deskgrunt50 Well-Known Member

    Ah, my mistake. Gotcha. Yeah, that was a nice touch for sure.
     
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