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Saudi royal boasts of changing Fox News coverage

Discussion in 'Journalism topics only' started by Inky_Wretch, Jul 2, 2010.

  1. sportsguydave

    sportsguydave Active Member

    YF: I like you too, which is why it's disappointing to me to see you lapse into the kind of intellectually lazy arguments that make no distinction between Islamism and mainstream Islam.

    And with all due respect, YF, you didn't really prove anything. You posted a map of unknown origin, which you seem to think proves your point just because according to the map, 90+ percent of the residents of North Africa are Muslim. That might pass muster in the circles you run in, but no sale here.
    You're going to have to do better than that. In our business, you don't get away with making assumptions without hard evidence to back them up.

    Azrael's got a good point: Do the riots have more to do with Islam, or with the other conditions that are making things hard for the youths over there? You've dodged that question with a flippant response. I'll ask you again.

    Does Islam play a role in violence? Sure. Extremist Islam absolutely does. But again, we really need to be careful that we don't lump the good in with the bad. I've got a Muslim friend from high school who's serving proudly and bravely in the U.S. military, and he'd like nothing better than to put a bullet in Osama bin Laden's brain. When he sees the kind of arguments some "Americans" make, it makes him question what he's fighting for. And that's really sad. He's been here since birth, grew up here, worked hard, played by the rules, swore an oath to defend America, and is now putting his ass on the line to defend a country where some ignorant assholes have the gall to roll up on him and call him a "raghead" when he's home on leave. It's shameful.

    We've got a long, sorry history of doing that kind of thing, as recently as WWII with the internment of the Japanese-Americans. It would be a shame if we go down that road again. Is that really what you want? Think about it .

    You're entitled to your opinions on the motivations of the youths rioting. But they're just that: Opinions. Nothing is as black and white as you apparently think it is.
     
  2. Starman

    Starman Well-Known Member

    Big shock.

    Rupert the fascist fake American is completely nestled in the jockey shorts of the Saudis, and Chinese.

    Nothing FOX does can even remotely be called journalism.

    It's sensationalist hysteria-whipping screeching ladled with heaping helpings of tits and ass.
     
  3. YankeeFan

    YankeeFan Well-Known Member

    Dave, 98-99% of the residents of North Africa are Muslim. That's a fact.

    The residents of the towns where the riots occurred were predominantly from North Africa and/or the descendants of immigrants from North Africa. That's a fact.

    A=B=C.

    As to your friend, I appreciate his service.

    I'm curious. You say he was born here. Do you mind if I ask where his parents are from? Is he religious or secular? What about his parents?

    My best friend's parents came her from Pakistan. He's a cardiologist. His father is also a doctor.

    My friend is a atheist and his parents are secular.

    They are fully integrated into American society. My buddy is a huge Yankees and Knicks fan. He went to a Catholic college and married a girl who's Portuguese with a little bit of Jewish mixed in.

    That's very different that the experience of the Christmas bomber, the 9/11 hijackers, or the "youths" that rioted in France.
     
  4. sportsguydave

    sportsguydave Active Member

    YF: We'll agree to disagree on the riots. I think you make a lot of assumptions that you wouldn't get away with if you were a journalist. But you're not, so it's all good. :)

    The issue with the labeling of the riots as "Muslim riots," I think, is more with the negative connotation Fox was hoping to attach to them. It's a big part of the problem many of us have with Fox: This kind of shameless, blatant advocacy in the guise of "journalism."

    I think if you're honest, you'll admit that Fox has been a major drum-beater in the wave of anti-Muslim hysteria. It's fine for the sheikh to call them on it, but not in the role of an investor.

    My friend is Iranian. His parents, both intellectuals, emigrated here in the mid-60s, I believe, to escape some of the abuses of the Shah, who though our guy, was a pretty bad guy at times. He and I don't talk about religion much... never did, but I believe his family is secular. I went over to visit often when we were in school, and it seemed like a secular home to me.

    He, however, has no problem identifying himself as a Muslim. I hope you're not implying that being a religious Muslim is necessarily tantamount to being an extremist.

    I'm interested to know what defines "being fully integrated into American society" in your eyes. It shouldn't mean having to drop all vestiges of who you were before you got here. And I'll forgive your buddy on the Yankees and Knicks. Everyone's forgiven a few stumbles along the path. :)

    Be that as it may, I don't think it's really fair for you to characterize the "experience" of the youths that rioted. What do you know of them or their issues/gripes, besides what you've read/heard?
     
  5. BrianGriffin

    BrianGriffin Active Member

    It depends why they were rioting. Are they rioting for religious reasons? Then it might be called a Muslim riot. But that's not the case, evidently, although there may be religious undertones. It sounds like an ethnic issue related to police treatment of an ethnic minority. I don't know if youth riot is the best description because the ethnicity is significant to the story. But "Muslim Riot" would be grossly misleading. I might even accept a cultural clash, but I do believe that middle eastern Islam exists in the context of middle eastern culture(s) at least as much as middle eastern culture exists in the context of Islam.
     
  6. DanOregon

    DanOregon Well-Known Member

    If it wasn't Murdoch, somebody else would have launched a news network to the right of CNN by now.
    I wonder if the Saudi Prince takes credit for all the tight sweaters and short skirts as well.
     
  7. SportsDude

    SportsDude Active Member

    Maybe, but I don't think anyone else would make it work. Screeching, screaming and feeding red meat to the masses is one thing (and I say this as someone who leans to the right), but it has to catch the viewer. This is the reason Fox kills MSNBC in the ratings.

    I actually think there is good news content on the network. I like Brett Baier, Chris Wallace, Fox News Watch, Journal Editorial Report, but the rest is pure red meat for the frothing masses at best, and pandering for the constantly aggrieved demographic. There's a whole industry dedicated to this type of schlock, where some kid in elementary school being handed a condom 3,000 miles away makes for a bigger headline than actual news. Keep the viewers by keeping them pissed, I guess.
     
  8. DanOregon

    DanOregon Well-Known Member

    Fox News Watch used to be a good show - it sucks now. I like Wallace, Baier, Angle, Garrett and Smith - but the secret to the networks success is developing narratives, kind of like sports producers think up "storylines" for games.
    A) Identify a "controversy." B) Note that the fact other networks aren't covering it is proof that they are protecting liberals. C) Ask questions like "Why isn't the Obama White House commenting on the "controversy? Are they part of the cover-up?" D) Find some people who have watched Fox News and are upset about "the controversy" and do a story about the "growing public outrage." E) Find a legislator to weigh in.
    Once public interest peaks or people realize the whole thing is bogus, go back to A.
     
  9. SportsDude

    SportsDude Active Member

    I still enjoy Fox News Watch, I don't think it is what it once was. RedEye is funny (to me, but tastes differ) but not hardly news, and there are good journalists working there. If you check the ratings though, those journalists are not what people are watching, unfortunately, neither on MSNBC of Headline News.

    You defined the Fox style of "narrative" journalism well. Almost every 24-7 news entity, on the web and especially on cable, follows the same formula, it's just not tweaked for the right. There's not enough real news, or at least news producers and executives feel will draw in viewers, so you create it. Fox does it by throwing red meat and outrage around and keeping its base pissed off (Thomas Frank wrote a pretty good book about this phenomena). Some of the more "traditional" outlets practice it as well. CNN in the early days seemed to think homeless people were strictly a product of the Reagan administration.

    If it's not fiction or a game, I strictly avoid cable anymore. I turned on Weather Channel a while ago and saw them trying to carry non-existent storylines throughout the day like a Fox would or ESPN.
     
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