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Running Baseball Scoring Question Thread

Discussion in 'Journalism topics only' started by Batman, May 17, 2008.

  1. Batman

    Batman Well-Known Member

    Someone suggested this on another of these threads, and I agree. Seems like it's time to consolidate all of these into one thread instead of 80.
    So, in true baseball fashion, I'll start with a doubleheader from a high school playoff series I've been covering:
    1) Runner gets on first, goes to second on a ground out. While the infielders are getting the ball back to the pitcher, he notices no one is paying attention and goes to third. Dude did this twice in this series. Is it a stolen base, or just a continuation of the fielder's choice.

    2) Batter hits a sharp grounder to third that he seems to field cleanly. All of a sudden, the third baseman starts spinning around looking for the ball. Apparently, it had hit off the heel of his glove and gone inside his shirt. Batter is safe at first, umps rule a dead ball and award him second as well.
    Is it a hit and an error? An error all the way? Something else entriely?
    If he traps the ball against his body instead of it going in his shirt, he probably throws the guy out.
     
  2. Hank_Scorpio

    Hank_Scorpio Active Member

    1. Definitely just a continuation of the fielders choice.

    2. I would think it would be a hit all the way. Don't think you can charge an error because a ball got stuck in a uniform. It's not the fielder intentionally put it there. It's just a freak play.
     
  3. OJ1414

    OJ1414 Member

    I would say an error all the way. He misplayed the ball, which caused it to get stuck inside his uniform.
     
  4. Hank_Scorpio

    Hank_Scorpio Active Member

    It's probably a big judgement call for the official scorer. And it probably depends whether it was misplayed into his jersey or took a hop in front of the player and freakishly went into the jersey.
     
  5. Let me just throw this suggestion out there — single and an error. You have to account for how the runner go to second. And if the umpires are awarding him second base, it sounds like the same thing they would do if the ball goes out of play.

    So I think it either has to be error all the way, or single and an error.
     
  6. Barsuk

    Barsuk Active Member

    Or would it go as a ground-rule double, like when the ball gets caught in the ivy at Wrigley?
     
  7. fishwrapper

    fishwrapper Active Member

    What the hell are we doing here?
    I really enjoyed the dueling softball-fielder's-choice-thread with the softball-RBI-thread with the softball-error-thread with the baseball-sacrifice-drag-bunt thread.
    That's all we ever do in this business these days, consolidate. And, I've fuckin' had enough.
     
  8. Barsuk

    Barsuk Active Member

    Don't worry; it won't stick. This thread will fade back a few pages, then someone will need to know whether it's a wild pitch or a passed ball if the guy swings a third strike a foot outside and in the dirt, so they'll start a thread about it, and the cycle will continue.
     
  9. fishwrapper

    fishwrapper Active Member

    A dying skill...
    When we grew up, kids knew what a KS/PB was. Now, sadly, they only know PS2.
     
  10. deskslave

    deskslave Active Member

    Because I'm gonna use it, even if no one else is.

    Question about catcher's interference. I know it's charged as an E2. But are runs resulting from a CI unearned? I wonder because if CI is committed on the first pitch, can you assume the batter would have been out? (My guess is no, since the batter is not charged with an at-bat or a plate appearance.) I'm guessing his run would be unearned, but would all runs scoring with two outs also be unearned?
     
  11. BrianGriffin

    BrianGriffin Active Member

    I'm torn on your first scenario and I remember a time years ago when we had a 10.3 100-meter sprint guy who would advance bases all the time while infielders were throwing the ball back to the pitcher or the catcher was lobbing it back to the pitcher (obviously, this was a very low level of high school ball) and a way to score those plays was devised. For the life of me, I can't remember if we decided those were fielder's choices or steals. My instincts say steal because it's not the fielder's choice to allow the runner to advance. It was the inability to get the ball to the pitcher fast enough to keep the runner at the same base. What's the difference between that and a delayed steal where the runner takes off while the catcher lobs it to the pitcher? So my instinct is steal, but I don't say that with 100 percent certainty and my days as an official scorer are long over.

    In play two, there are a couple of issues. One, was the batted ball a hit or an error and did the initial play result on the ball down the shirt or was it a separate circumstance? Judging from your description, it appears that what caused the ball to be missed by the fielder also caused it to go down his shirt. So if you feel like he should have fielded the ball cleanly with "ordinary effort" (the litmus test the rule book gives you to apply to error/non-error decisions) it's a two-base error. But if you rule that the ball was too hot to handle or took a bad bounce and, as a result, he could not handle it, then it's a double. The only way it's a hit and an error is if he gained control of the ball before it went down his shirt. If he bobbled it, gained control of it, then dropped it down his shirt, you could call that a hit and an error.
     
  12. forever_town

    forever_town Active Member

    I suggested the consolidated scoring question thread.

    1. I'd go with fielder's indifference allowing the runner to go from second to third. It'd be the same as a guy taking second when the first baseman isn't holding him and the pitcher and catcher are focusing on the batter.

    2. On this one, I'd say two-base error. Unless the guy is Bo Jackson-beating-out-a-routine-grounder fast or the third baseman has my throwing arm. But a runner with no better than above average speed and a third baseman with at least an average arm? Two-base error.
     
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