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NYC Dept. of Health Anti-Smoking ads

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by The Big Ragu, Feb 2, 2010.

  1. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    If you aren't even going to be honest about your own posts, this is pointless. You called the posters grotesque, not the practice of forcing them to be posted. You said they were nasty to look at. Now that everybody has seen them and pointed out that they really aren't disgusting at all, you are changing your story.

    And the argument about "making cigarettes illegal" is pure intellectual dishonesty. You know it's not possible, so presenting it as if it were a realistic option is bullshit.

    I'm not saying there is no merit to your overall point, even though I disagree with it. But try backing it up without dishonest garbage.
     
  2. RickStain

    RickStain Well-Known Member

    Of course outlawing cigarettes is an option.
     
  3. BYH

    BYH Active Member

    Much ado about nothing. Cigarettes are quite obviously addictive and many more people than not will pay whatever it takes to poison their lungs and other organs. If spending $10 a pack doesn't discourage them, then pics of ravaged lungs and brains aren't going to do a thing.

    As playthrough notes, $$$ from cigarette taxes funds entire states, so they'll continue producing anti-smoking campaigns with one hand while balancing the budget with the other.
     
  4. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    The anti-smoking campaigns themselves are dumb, because they know they have no effect and they rely on that tax revenue. It's all window dressing. But if you are going to play that silly game, it's one thing when they put that ad with the woman with no fingers on TV. I find it a step too far when they start telling store owners they have to put posters of blackened lungs on the wall or face harsh fines.As I said in my first post, it strikes me as the nanny state run amok.
     
  5. hondo

    hondo Well-Known Member

    The photos are black blobs. They don't look like much of anything. This shouldn't be a big deal.
     
  6. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    Not a realistic one.
     
  7. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    I'm not sure smokers are the main target audience for something like this. I think it is aimed at non-smokers to help keep them from starting, too.

    And if these are such a big deal, which seems pretty damn ridiculous to me, these business owners can simply choose not to carry the product and solve their problem that way.
     
  8. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Selling cigarettes is LEGAL. Those businesses, as long as they are engaged in legal activity, shouldn't have the city government foisting those choices on them.

    Why doesn't the government force places that sell lottery tickets to put up ads that warn about the dangers of gambling and fine those who don't comply? Your ridiculous "you have a choice, don't sell lottery tickets" nonsense would apply there to.

    Using your logic, the government is justified in targeting ANYONE engaged in legal behavior and putting some kind of random demand on their business and if the business complains you wave your hand and say, "Well, you have a choice!"

    What they are doing is legal. Those regulations are random. That is an UNFAIR choice, as long as selling cigarettes is legal. Either outlaw them or keep them legal. But you are screwing with their businesses doing this, and it is a feckless pursuit because it has no effect on people's behavior.

    The point, which you blithely miss, is that as long as you are engaging in perfectly legal activity, the government shouldn't be forcing those "choices" on you.

    What if the government decides to force stores that sell items not manufactured in New York to post "traitor" signs all over their establishments? Using your convoluted thinking, those places made the "choice" to sell items that are manufactured outside of the state, so there is no injustice.

    What you aren't acknowledging is my belief that this isn't a legitimate role for a city government to be playing. And no matter how many harangues about honestty or intellectual dishonesty you throw at me, when I have been pretty straightforward about expressing that, that is simply what it amounts to for me.
     
  9. BYH

    BYH Active Member

    I agree smokers aren't the main target audience, but I don't think the state is trying to dissuade anybody here. This is just its way of trying to sleep better at night. "Sure it kills people but look, we told them not to do it! Now excuse us while we rake in the profits."

    The ad campaign doesn't bother me either way, but I will say the TV commercials are a billion times worse than this. I lose my appetite every time I see that woman with stubs for fingers and toes, or hear Voice Box Guy explain why he can't get his throat dirty because then he'll die.
     
  10. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    When you acknowledge that your original descriptions of these posters as "grotesque" and "nasty to look at" were ridiculous, I'll stop talking about your intellectual dishonesty.

    When you stop writing about "making cigarettes illegal" when we all know that is not possible, I'll stop talking about your intellectual dishonesty.

    And not all legal activity brings the same health risk as cigarettes, a product that should have been banned years ago. There is nothing random about it. Your use of that word also brings us back to your intellectual dishonesty.

    Bury it in a pile of words all you like. You have a legitimate argument to make and it would be much more worth of debate if you could engage in it without the bullshit.
     
  11. JR

    JR Well-Known Member

    Much ado about fucking nothing.

    There are sorts of "legal" activities and products that are government regulated.

    Here's what greets you when you buy a package of cigarettes up here.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2014
  12. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    That is in the box, right?

    These are things they are making stores put up on their walls. It's the city telling a bagel place, for example, how it has to decorate -- with city-mandated posters. That is why I distinguished. I actually think the warnings on boxes of cigarettes and the things inside the cigarette packs are stupid, too. But that only impacts anyone dumb enough to buy a pack of cigarettes. Those posters, to me, are the city meddling with people's businesses in a way I just don't want the city to be.

    EDIT: Correct me if I am wrong, please. those are inside the packs, not things that store owners have to put on their walls under threat of fine, right?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 15, 2014
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