NFL Week 14: Where have you gone Neil O'Donnell?

This thread. Debacle.

 

No, no no - that is absolutely the same as Trent Dilfer throwing a long touchdown pass to the white receiver in a blowout Super Bowl........ :

 

And Zag goes right back to the personal attacks because he knows he's full of it.

Roethlisberger wasn't elite yet. Everybody was calling him a caretaker on offense at that point, not an elite quarterback.

You are using things Brady did after his Super Bowl victory to misrepresent what he was at the time as well.

But you would never misrepresent anything, would you?

Somebody already made the argument. These guys were first discussed as elite because of the championships they won. It is a self-fullfilling prophecy and it is a disingenuous argument.

Was Eli Manning elite when he led the Giants to the Super Bowl? Is he now? Or was he just a very average quarterback, one who had played like crap early on in that very season, who got hot at the right time?

 

And the misrepresentation continues. I was not pointing to Dilfer as an example of an elite quarterback. I'm saying he helps to prove the hole in your overgeneralized argument. So does Brad Johnson. So does Eli Manning.

 

You are wrong on this. Dead wrong. More wrong than you have ever been.

And instead of just admitting it, you are going to dig in and make even more foolish statements and comparisons between apples and oranges and thus dig your grave even deeper.

I'll say it once agian because I am sure even a blockhead can get it - every elite quarterback has to have that first moment -- and for all the guys we are talking about they had it and they continue to have them.

But I , know, I know, no, no no - that is absolutely the same as Trent Dilfer throwing a long touchdown pass to the white receiver in a blowout Super Bowl........

 

NOBODY IS MAKING THAT ARGUMENT ABOUT SUPER BOWLS DEFINING ELITE QUARTERBACKS.

Dan Marino, Warren Moon, Dan Fouts - they were all elite quarterbacks and didn't win Super Bowls.

But all three of their teams were a helluva lot better and had a much better chance to win Super Bowls because they had them

 

No, it doesn't do that at all, especially since I'd put Eli Manning on the short list of elite quarterbacks in the league.

All it means that in two seasons out of the last 15 - again very big exceptions -- teams managed to win a Super Bowl without an elite quarterback and none since 2003.

Why do you think Trent Dilfer is always the poster child for the "must win a Super Bowl to be an elite quarterback crowd"?

I'll tell you, follow along, it is because what the Ravens pulled off that year is extremely rare.

But you keep latching on to exceptions and rarities to make a ridiculoius point, it is fun smacking you around again.

 

"Hey George Mason and Penn absolutely shows the fallacy of your argument that mid-majors can't get to the FInal Four!!!" [\OOP taking another extreme exception to prove his rule.....]

 

Oh, and Roethlisberger was considered an elite quarterback before leading his team to a Super Bowl? Really? He didn't have a "caretaker" label in '04 and '05? Seriously? I guess it was those 2,621 yards with 17 touchdowns and 11 interceptions in '04 that really elevated him to elite status. (The '05 numbers aren't much better, but that is kind of unfair because he missed 12 games).

Brady in 2001 completed 63.9 percent of his passes for 2,843 yards, 18 touchdowns and 12 interceptions. He had two big post-season games, but was he really considered elite? Or just a great story who then went on to prove he was a great quarterback.

Eli Manning is an elite quarterback? Seriously? No wonder you are declaring another false victory for yourself if you are willing to reach that far.

Interesting also that you are changing the time period to fit your argument. Dilfer and Johnson are two examples this decade. Eli Manning is another. Take away that one hot streak at the end of '07 and make an argument that he is an elite quarterback. He is an average quarterback who played the best ball of his career at the right time.

 

Eli Manning is an average quarterback?

Give me a break. Now you are just being dumb, which, I know is hard for you not to do.

And Big Ben was not considered a caretaker in the playoffs of 2005, when he made his mark and proved he was an elite quarterback. Ditto Brady in the Rams Super Bowl year.

But regardless - BOTH FUCKING GUYS HAVE SINCE PROVEN THEY ARE INDEED ELITE QUARTERBACKS which is what makes your idiotic argument even more idiotic.

 

I took the points, had Emmitt Smith UNDER the rushing total.... and the game to go OT ($100 to win $1100)

 

In other words, you are going to twist time and reality in whatever way is necessary to prove your point, as usual.