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Marvin Miller for HOF ???

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Boom_70, Nov 21, 2006.

  1. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    But if the operative term is "impact on game" why not? Boras has had huge impact on game in past 10 years.

    Why not Victor Conte - he certainly had impact on the game.

    Bill James

    Sandy Alderson

    Of those on ballot I think Walter O'malley and Charles Finley are clear choices.
  2. spnited

    spnited Active Member

    I actually believe the operative phrase, Boom, is "contributions to the game."

    And I agree whole-heartedly on O'Malley (even though my father hated him for moving the Dodgers to LA) and Finley belong...along with Marvin Miller, the man who almost single-handedly forever changed the business of baseball and sports in America.
  3. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    Here is how it reads in bi- laws :

    . Eligible Candidates — Eligible candidates must be selected from:

    (A) Major League players who competed in any portion of at least ten (10) championship seasons and who have been retired as players for at least twenty-one (21) years. In addition, players whose service in the Negro Baseball Leagues prior to 1946 and the Major Leagues thereafter total at least ten years or portions thereof are defined as eligible candidates.

    (B) Baseball Executives and/or Managers and/or Umpires who have been retired from organized Baseball as Baseball Executives and/or Managers and/or Umpires for at least five (5) years prior to the election. If the candidate is 65 years old at the time of retirement, the waiting period is reduced to six (6) months. If the candidate reaches the age of 65 during the five-year waiting period the candidate becomes eligible six months after the candidate's 65th birthday.

    (C) Those whose careers entailed involvement as both players and managers/executives/umpires will be considered for their overall contribution to the game of Baseball; however, the specific category in which such individuals shall be considered will be determined by the role in which they were most prominent. In those instances when a candidate is prominent as both a player and as a manager, executive or umpire, the BBWAA Screening Committee shall determine that individual's candidacy as either a player (Players Ballot), or as a manager, executive or umpire (Composite Ballot). Candidates may only appear on one ballot per election. Those designated as players must fulfill the requirements of 6 (A).

    (D) Any person designated by the Office of the Commissioner of Major League Baseball as ineligible shall not be an eligible candidate.
  4. 21

    21 Well-Known Member

    Is Miller actually a 'baseball executive' under those definitions? I thought that designation was for owners/GMs.....no?
  5. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    It would certainly be a stretch.

    I found this also interesting in rules discussion:

    Are scouts now eligible for election to the Hall of Fame?

    No, they are not. Managers, umpires and executives are the only eligible candidates on the Composite Ballot.

    ————— Go to Top of Page —————

    Why are scouts not eligible?

    The Board of Directors believes the scouting profession is important, but extremely difficult to quantify. We are in the process of developing an extensive exhibit to be all encompassing and very educational so the scouting profession is represented in the museum, and much better understood by the public.
  6. Yeah, Marvin Miller and Victor Conte.
    Completely analogous cases.
    I believe the stupid has begun to drift along the sides of a thread again.
  7. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    The anatomy of how a good discussion breaks down - Fenian does not agree so starts with the name calling .
  8. cranberry

    cranberry Well-Known Member

    Well, Miller was a baseball executive so I don't see how he wouldn't qualify as a baseball executive. In any case I think they decided the issue when he was placed on the ballot the first time. Not a stretch at all. In fact, he was the most powerful executive in the game during his tenure.
  9. Lester Bangs

    Lester Bangs Active Member

    The question would have to be for the voters ... positive or negative impact. My argument stands -- I think Miller has had a largely positive impact, but know others will not agree. I just happen to think that, as the years go by, the guys doing the voting will vote him in as they will see his time as positive and his effect on the game as revolutionary. Anybody who can argue against the latter -- that he was revolutionary -- simply hasn't paid attention.

    That said, there are some analogies that are weak (Miller/Boras) and others that are just plain stupid (Miller/Conte). If you don't want your argument mocked, don't turn it into a cartoon.

    And Bill James eventual inclusion would not surprise me, though history will have to prove he belongs.
  10. Boom_70

    Boom_70 Well-Known Member

    Thinking down the road how would you feel about Donald Fehr as a candidate?

    The player/ management agreement just reached, could certainly prove to impact game.
  11. A thread in which Marvin Miller and Victor Conte are rendered analogous broke down long before I got to it, Boom.
    No on Fehr because he did not have the vast impact on the game that MM had, which is to say, a greater one than any single indvidual had except Babe Ruth and (maybe) Branch Rickey.
  12. Bruhman

    Bruhman Active Member

    the babe, branch and miller... i second the emotion for mlb's top 3.
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